'Plot to blow up planes' foiled

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Post by . ._ »

gonefishin' wrote:oil was getting too expensive in the US so they needed a way to bring the price back down.

why will checking our carry on be any safer? 90% of checked baggage is not screened, so I'm not sure how this helps?

and am I really sure that those on the plane sitting beside me and my 18 month old son will appreciate the fact that I cannot bring diapers, so that dump he just took will be smelling great after brewing for 4 hours.

3100ish were killed on 911, how many are we up to now in this useless Iraq war 5000+?

good job Dubya.
http://icasualties.org/oif/BY_DOD.aspx


http://icasualties.org/oif_a/CasualtyTrends.htm
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Post by . ._ »

I heard they found the ringleader of the terror plot...

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grimey
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shoe x-rays useless...

Post by grimey »

...but lets do them anyways:

http://edition.cnn.com/2006/US/08/15/Te ... index.html
WASHINGTON (AP) -- The government's new order that all airline passengers put their shoes through X-ray machines won't help screeners find a liquid or gel that can be used as a bomb.

The machines are unable to detect explosives, according to a Homeland Security report on aviation screening recently obtained by The Associated Press.

The Transportation Security Administration ordered the shoe-scanning requirement as it fine-tunes new security procedures.
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niss
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Post by niss »

When I went to Israel on El Al two years ago, everything I had and of course my body (hands, cloths, etc) were run through a machine that looked for explosive chemicals.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/2097352.stm
http://www.usatoday.com/news/sept11/200 ... l-usat.htm
http://archives.cnn.com/2001/WORLD/meas ... .security/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/El_Al
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Let's kick the tires, and light the fires.... SHIT! FIRE! EMERGENCY CHECKLIST!
grimey
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Post by grimey »

Yea, but there's a big difference between checking for chemical emmisions from explosives, which works for alot of them, and looking for them on an x-ray, which doesn't. Interviewing passengers prior to boarding, and having armed, uniformed air marshalls on every flight also improves security. El-Al has security that works, in part because they need it for security reasons rather than political ones, and so they concentrate on effective security measures, rather than feel good crap.
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Post by airplane rider »

Having gone through security in Miami Intl more than a few times, my last security screening was a little strange...after being selected for an increased search I was ushered into what could only be described as a plexiglass cattle shoot. Myself and the other barefoot passengers (cattle) then had to wait until our bags had gone through the x-ray machine and officers were ready to go through them manually. It was a very odd feeling to be in a plexiglass shoot in the middle of the regular screening with hundreds of people walking around either side. Were they afraid we would detinate some kind of bomb?

Add to the weirdness, the fact that I was carrying a bag full of autopilot parts for a Lear-35. You should have seen the faces of the security officers dealing with my luggage. In situations like that you have to be very delicate with how you conduct yourself if you want to avoid further difficulty. My only concern was how they were handling my VERY EXPENSIVE parts...their only concern was that whatever was in the bag looked like it could detinate. Fun.
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grimey
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Post by grimey »

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Post by airplane rider »

Nice find Grimey! There was an actual physical change in my screener when the last of my autopilot parts had been swiped and tested. She even allowed me to help re-package the items and smiled when I told her that she had done a very professional job.

I hate that this is only getting worse for everybody. Perhaps it won't be long before we'll be stripped naked, issued a paper flying garment, strapped into our seats for the duration of the flight and all baggage will travel on seperate cargo flights.

I try to smile.
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Post by fogghorn »

This thread should have been titled, somebodies wet dream fantasy plot foiled :shock:

The UK 'Terror Plot' -
What's Really Going On?
By Craig Murray
8-15-6


Mr. Murray was the British Ambassador to Uzbekistan from August 2002 to October 2004
----

I have been reading very carefully through all the Sunday newspapers to try and analyse the truth from all the scores of pages claiming to detail the so-called bomb plot. Unlike the great herd of so-called security experts doing the media analysis, I have the advantage of having had the very highest security clearances myself, having done a huge amount of professional intelligence analysis, and having been inside the spin machine.

So this, I believe, is the true story.

None of the alleged terrorists had made a bomb. None had bought a plane ticket. Many did not even have passports, which given the efficiency of the UK Passport Agency would mean they couldn't be a plane bomber for quite some time.

In the absence of bombs and airline tickets, and in many cases passports, it could be pretty difficult to convince a jury beyond reasonable doubt that individuals intended to go through with suicide bombings, whatever rash stuff they may have bragged in internet chat rooms.

What is more, many of those arrested had been under surveillance for over a year - like thousands of other British Muslims. And not just Muslims. Like me. Nothing from that surveillance had indicated the need for early arrests.

Then an interrogation in Pakistan revealed the details of this amazing plot to blow up multiple planes - which, rather extraordinarily, had not turned up in a year of surveillance. Of course, the interrogators of the Pakistani dictator have their ways of making people sing like canaries. As I witnessed in Uzbekistan, you can get the most extraordinary information this way. Trouble is it always tends to give the interrogators all they might want, and more, in a desperate effort to stop or avert torture. What it doesn't give is the truth.

The gentleman being "interrogated" had fled the UK after being wanted for questioning over the murder of his uncle some years ago. That might be felt to cast some doubt on his reliability. It might also be felt that factors other than political ones might be at play within these relationships. Much is also being made of large transfers of money outside the formal economy. Not in fact too unusual in the British Muslim community, but if this activity is criminal, there are many possibilities that have nothing to do with terrorism.

We then have the extraordinary question of Bush and Blair discussing the possible arrests over the weekend. Why? I think the answer to that is plain. Both in desperate domestic political trouble, they longed for "Another 9/11". The intelligence from Pakistan, however dodgy, gave them a new 9/11 they could sell to the media. The media has bought, wholesale, all the rubbish they have been shovelled.

We then have the appalling political propaganda of John Reid, Home Secretary, making a speech warning us all of the dreadful evil threatening us and complaining that "Some people don't get" the need to abandon all our traditional liberties. He then went on, according to his own propaganda machine, to stay up all night and minutely direct the arrests. There could be no clearer evidence that our Police are now just a political tool. Like all the best nasty regimes, the knock on the door came in the middle of the night, at 2.30am. Those arrested included a mother with a six week old baby.

For those who don't know, it is worth introducing Reid. A hardened Stalinist with a long term reputation for personal violence, at Stirling Univeristy he was the Communist Party's "Enforcer", (in days when the Communist Party ran Stirling University Students' Union, which it should not be forgotten was a business with a very substantial cash turnover). Reid was sent to beat up those who deviated from the Party line.

We will now never know if any of those arrested would have gone on to make a bomb or buy a plane ticket. Most of them do not fit the "Loner" profile you would expect - a tiny percentage of suicide bombers have happy marriages and young children. As they were all under surveillance, and certainly would have been on airport watch lists, there could have been little danger in letting them proceed closer to maturity - that is certainly what we would have done with the IRA.

In all of this, the one thing of which I am certain is that the timing is deeply political. This is more propaganda than plot. Of the over one thousand British Muslims arrested under anti-terrorist legislation, only twelve per cent are ever charged with anything. That is simply harrassment of Muslims on an appalling scale. Of those charged, 80% are acquitted. Most of the very few - just over two per cent of arrests - who are convicted, are not convicted of anything to do terrorism, but of some minor offence the Police happened upon while trawling through the wreck of the lives they had shattered.

Be sceptical. Be very, very sceptical.
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Vickers vanguard
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Post by Vickers vanguard »

Fogghorn,

Any reference to the above article ? newspaper or magazine maybe.....
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prop2jet
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Post by prop2jet »

Vickers... you got to try using Google :D

http://www.craigmurray.co.uk/archives/2 ... ror_p.html
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Post by Dust Devil »

prop2jet wrote:Vickers... you got to try using Google :D

http://www.craigmurray.co.uk/archives/2 ... ror_p.html
Leave Vickers alone. He is flawless
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