Cheese-Eating Surrender Monkeys

[Hedley]

http://www.canada.com/ottawacitizen/new ... 87&k=35850

[niss]

I dont see the big deal. Canada is there as part of the NATO agreement for NATO to defend NATO members. It would seem that other NATO members are not holding up to their end of the bargain. It doesnt seem to me that this is out of cowardice or anything like this. Why should this war be a one man show? Canada wasnt attacked. Germany and France should step up to the plate. Why should it only be Canadian and Afghani blood being spilled in Kandahar?

[JakeYYZ]

This Afghan Surrender Group make the French seem courageous.
These long- in- the- tooth political hacks delivered exactly what you’d expect from
a group of gutless gas bags. Their report is an utter and complete capitulation to our
enemies in this war for our very survival. This asinine surrender report should be called
what it is - TREASON - .

[Hedley]

Don't hold back, Jake - tell us what you really think!

[Walker]

Jake did you even read the thing?????

[electraguy]

FOR SALE

FRENCH ARMY RIFLES, NEVER FIRED ONLY DROPPED ONCE

and

FRENCH ARMY TANKS, THEY HAVE 20 SPEEDS IN REVERSE AND 5 IN FORWARDS IN CASE U GET ATTACKED FROM BEHIND

A famouse US general once said, I would sooner have 1000 germans in front of me that 2000 frenchmen behind me.

In all seriousness, both france and germany are being useless over there. I don;t think its the troops themselves, there governments have ties there hands. But either way, when have the french ever won a war, google french military victories, you will get a good laugh at the result. They should pack up and go home if there gonna be useless anyways. Nuff said

[WJflyer]

FOR SALE

FRENCH ARMY RIFLES, NEVER FIRED ONLY DROPPED ONCE

and

FRENCH ARMY TANKS, THEY HAVE 20 SPEEDS IN REVERSE AND 5 IN FORWARDS IN CASE U GET ATTACKED FROM BEHIND

A famouse US general once said, I would sooner have 1000 germans in front of me that 2000 frenchmen behind me.

In all seriousness, both france and germany are being useless over there. I don;t think its the troops themselves, there governments have ties there hands. But either way, when have the french ever won a war, google french military victories, you will get a good laugh at the result. They should pack up and go home if there gonna be useless anyways. Nuff said

The problem is there is no political will from these nation's populations to allow their forces to participate in combat operations, especially the Germans. There was massive controversy in Germany when they decided to chop a couple of Tornado ECR birds to Afghanistan, and these birds don't sling bombs; they are recon jets. Here, there is some political will from the Canadian population to send troops into combat situations.

[shitdisturber]

A famouse US general once said, I would sooner have 1000 germans in front of me that 2000 frenchmen behind me.

That was Black Jack Pershing wasn't it?

[corporate joe]

FOR SALE

FRENCH ARMY RIFLES, NEVER FIRED ONLY DROPPED ONCE

and

FRENCH ARMY TANKS, THEY HAVE 20 SPEEDS IN REVERSE AND 5 IN FORWARDS IN CASE U GET ATTACKED FROM BEHIND

A famouse US general once said, I would sooner have 1000 germans in front of me that 2000 frenchmen behind me.

In all seriousness, both france and germany are being useless over there. I don;t think its the troops themselves, there governments have ties there hands. But either way, when have the french ever won a war, google french military victories, you will get a good laugh at the result. They should pack up and go home if there gonna be useless anyways. Nuff said

French military victories:

Battle of Allia - 387 B.C.
The Gauls led by Brennus defeat the army of the Roman Republic led by Quintus Sulpicius and go on to sack Rome itself

Battle of Gergovia - 52 B.C.
The Gallic Tribes led by Vercingetorix defeat the Roman Republic army of Julius Caesar.

Battle of Soissons - 486 A.D.
The Franks led by King Clovis I defeat Syagrius and the remains of the Western Roman Empire.

Battle of Tolbaic - 496
The Franks led by Clovis I are victorious over the Alamanni.

Battle of Vouille - 507
The Franks led by Clovis I defeat Alaric II (the conqueror of Spain) and his Visigoths in a decisive victory.

Battle of Val-es-Dunes - 1047
William, the Duke of Normandy and King Henry I of France are victorious against the rebel Normans led by Guy of Burgund

Battle of Hastings - October 14, 1066
The Normans led by William the Conquer er defeat King Harold II and his Anglo-Saxon army. William would go on to conquer all of England.

Battle of Bouvines - July 27, 1214
Philip Augustus of France overwhelmingly defeat Germany's Otto IV and Count Ferrand of Flanders.

Battle of Morlaix - 1342
French forces beat back the attacking English and force a retreat.

Battle of Ardres - 1531
French forces lead victorious over the English.

Battle of Cocherel - May 16, 1364
The French and Bertrand du Guesclin find victory against Charles II of Navarre.

Battle of Montiel - 1369
The Franco-Castilian combined forces led by Henry II of Castile find victory against a conglomeration of Portuguese, Jewish, Granadine and Marinid forces led by Pedro of Castile.

Battle of La Rochelle - June 22, 1372
The French-Castilion fleet wins control of the Channel after a decisive victory over the English.

Battle of Chiset - 1373
French forces, whilst laying siege to Chiset, repel an English relief force.

Battle of Roosebeke - November 27, 1382
Louis II of Flanders and Philip the Bold lay waste to Philip Van Artevelde and the Flemish.

Battle of Bauge - March 21, 1421
A combined force of France and Scotland defeat the English in one of the earliest English defeats of the Hundred Years' War.

Siege of Orleans - October 12, 1428-May 8, 1429
Jeanne d'Arc (Joan of Arc), Gilles de Rais and Jean d'Orleans of France defeat the Earl of Shrewsbury, the Earl of Salisbury and the Duke of Suffolk.

Battle of Jargeau - June 11-12, 1429
Joan of Arc for France leads victorious against William de la Pole of England.

Battle of Beaugency - June 16-17, 1429
Joan of Arc delivers another French victory over the English.

Battle of Patay - June 18, 1429
La Hire and Poton de Xaintrailles of France defeat Sir John Fastolf of England, effectively turning the tide of the Hundred Years' War.

Siege of Compiegne - June 18, 1429
Though Joan of Arc is taken prisoner (and ultimately executed), the French resist the English siege from Philip the Good and John II of Luxembourg.

Battle of Gerbevoy - 1435
French forces led by commander La Hire and Jean Poton Xaintrailles defeat the English.

Battle of Formigny - April 15, 1450
Comte de Clermont and Comte de Richemont of France defeat Thomas Kyriell of England.

Battle of Castillon - July 17, 1453
Charles VII of France defeats John Talbot of England.

Battle of the Chesapeake - September 5, 1781
France, coming the aid of America's George Washington, defeats the British in a strategic victory.

Battle of Valmy - September 20, 1792
France defeats the invading armies of Prussia and Austria.

Battle of the Vosges - July 13, 1794
France defeats a coalition of Prussian, Austrian and Saxon troops.

Battle of the Bridge of Arcole - November 17, 1796
Napoleon Bonaparte I of France leads victorious over the Austrians.

Battle of Hohenlinden - December 3, 1800
A decisive French victory by General Moreau over the Austrian Empire led by Archduke John.

Battle of Austerlitz - December 2, 1805
Napoleon I of France is decidedly victorious over Russia and the Austrian Empire.

Battle of Jena-Auerstedt - October 14, 1806
Napoleon I of France is victorious over Frederick William III of Prussia.

Battle of Friedland - June 14, 1807
Napoleon Bonaparte is victorious against General Bennigsen's Russians.

Battle of Tudela - November 23, 1808
Jean Lannes of France is victorious over Francisco Castanos of Spain.

Battle of Ucles - January 13, 1809
General Victor of France is victorious over General Venegas of Spain.

Battle of Ciudad-Real - March 27, 1809
A French victory for General Sebastiani against Spain under direction from General Cartojal.

Battle of Wagram - July 5-6, 1809
A decisive victory for Napoleon Bonaparte over Austria's Archduke Charles.

Battle of Smolensk - August 17, 1812
Napoleon Bonaparte of France is victorious against Russia led by Prince Bagration.

Battle of Borodino - September 7, 1812
Napoleon Bonaparte of the First French Empire is victorious against Mikhail Illarionovich Kutuzov of the Russian Empire.

Battle of Lutzen - May 2, 1813
Napoleon I of France is victorious against Germany's Gebhard von Blucher, Peter Wittgenstein and Gerhard von Scharnhorst

Battle of Vauchamps - February 14, 1814
Napoleon and his band of 18,000 Frenchmen defeat 30,000 Prussian troops in the final battle of the Six Days Campaign.

Battle of Navarino - October 20, 1827
A coalition force of French, British, Irish, Italian, Belgium, United States, Dutch and Russian forces defeat the Ottoman Empire and Egypt in this large-scale sea battle.

Invasion of Algeria - 1830
French forces invade and conquer the North African country of Algeria.

Battle of Balaclava - October 25, 1854
A coalition of French, British and Turkish troops defeat Russia during this Crimean War engagement.

Togoland - August 26, 1914
A Franco-British force successfully invades the German West African protectorate of Togoland.

First Battle of the Marne - September 5-10, 1914
A Franco-British force led by Joseph Joffre and John French defeat Germany led by Helmuth von Moltke and Karl von Bulow.

Battle of Ypres - October 19-November 22, 1914
French and British forces gain a victory against Germany.

Battle of Belleau Wood - June 1-26, 1918
France, Britain and the United States led by John J. Pershing and James Harbord are victorious over the German Empire and Crown Prince Wilhelm.

Cote d'Ivoire - January 2003
French peace-keeping forces succeed in stabilization of lawless western border.


Am I defending France? I couldn't give a rats ass about what happens there. However, I've noticed a tendency on these boards from certain individuals to categorize and show clear prejudice towards a language and a people. I've even seen people think French Canadians are the same as French people from France.
If categorizing and judging humans on color is racism, what would you call doing the same to generalize against people for their language?
Whatever the term is, it comes from the same xenophobic ignorance and has no place in a great country like Canada.
However, seeing who the author of this post is, it comes at no surprise.

[JakeYYZ]

Jake did you even read the thing?????

Their reasons are wholly political. They're trying to defeat Mr. Harper's government
on this and other issues. They're trying to make Afghanistan out to be a hopeless, costly conflict.
These traitorous rat bastards are out to undermine Canada’s will and national resolve to
defeat a dangerous enemy.
Islamist leaders must be thrilled by the support they receive from these Leftists—whom V.I. Lenin
once famously dubbed “Useful Idiots.” ... Die in a goddamn fire, you traitorous, rat bastards.
Summary execution is too damn good for you, but it’s the best idea I’ve heard lately.

[Walker]

So, I shall restate my original question which you have not yet answered; have you read the report? And did you read the report prior to your two previous posts?

Next please in your own words describe your interpretation of the purpose of the upper house?

Thirdly what is Canada’s will and national resolve? It is quite clear what your will and resolve is, but I would like to hear your interpretation as to what the will of the majority of the population of this great nation is.

Fourthly I would far sooner question the national loyalty of someone who suggests summary executions of parliamentarians, than that of someone who has spent their life in the service of the crown. So I am curious to know what your interpretation of treason is. Then would you so care to enlighten us as to what a member of the house must do to be considered guilty? Furthermore if you still feel the same way how do you suggest such a thing be done? Perhaps a beheading broadcast on the internet?

Fifthly is the Senate Partisan or non Partisan?

Lastly how does our military capacity compare to that of the Russian military at the height of the cold war?

-Your trusting friend, Walker

[Icebound]

Their report is an utter and complete capitulation to our
enemies in this war for our very survival. .

Let me assure you that "our very survival" will not be affected very much by what happens or does not happen in Afghanistan or Iraq, in spite of what we have been led to believe over the past 5 years.

There are over 6-billion people on this planet. In 6 years, there will be 7 billion of them, in 20 years, 8 billion. They will affect "our very survival" way more, as they compete for the same finite water, oil, and food resources which we need.

"Our very survival" will depend on how well we can co-operate with them, because we sure as hell will be a little short on numbers should we decide to fight them all.

Afghanistan is nothing more than a useless distraction. It will devolve in its own time and way, no matter what we think we are "doing for it".

Canadians (including me) tolerated troop deployment to Afghanistan because our western sensibilities felt that a corrupt regime supporting a criminal activity required appropriate punishment... but then as time went on, the primary victim of that criminal action lost interest.... and went off on another greater adventure of his own...

I kind of think that Canadians can be excused for losing interest as well.


...

[2R]

Did someone say cheese oh i thought he said cheers


Perhaps an Ebola epidemic or some such outbreak will prevent the world from ever getting to eight billion .

Good for corporate joe to defend the French.God Knows they have not been able to defend themselves for the last two centuries.

There are even Frenchmen in this country that would not fight for France .

So good for joe. He can be the first up if the Germans ever want some of their real estate back.They did get a large chunk back from the Soviets ,although there may still be some outstanding land claims issues with other neighbours.

[niss]

Why are the streets to paris lined with trees?

To give the marching german soldiers shade! Yeehaw!

[shitdisturber]

Corporate Joe the Normans are actually Vikings, Northmen = Norman who invaded that part of France and then never left; so technically they weren't really French. Therefore the Battle of Hastings was won by the Vikings.

[electraguy]

Hey Corprate Joe,

And exactly what is that comment supposed to mean? I have no problem with french canada, as a matter of fact Quebec is one of my favorite places of all time, especially Montreal. SO, if you can't take a little humor directed at the "france french" well I am sorry but honestly buddy suck it up. And yes Canada is a great country, witha ll it races, languages and ethnic groups. I have worked with people from all over the world and all over this great country. Former CF member, so I know all about what it is to be Canadian. As I said previous, a little mud slinging in good fun is not a big deal. If your gonna start throwing the personal insults about, well I can run with the best of them there too. Its sure a good thing that you had time to research all that, very interesting stuff though. So, hop off your high horse and lets shake hands and get on with life, deal?

[bmc]

At least the French know how to make wine. I look forward to the day if (not when) Canada can same the same thing.

[corporate joe]

Hey Corprate Joe,

And exactly what is that comment supposed to mean? I have no problem with french canada, as a matter of fact Quebec is one of my favorite places of all time, especially Montreal. SO, if you can't take a little humor directed at the "france french" well I am sorry but honestly buddy suck it up. And yes Canada is a great country, witha ll it races, languages and ethnic groups. I have worked with people from all over the world and all over this great country. Former CF member, so I know all about what it is to be Canadian. As I said previous, a little mud slinging in good fun is not a big deal. If your gonna start throwing the personal insults about, well I can run with the best of them there too. Its sure a good thing that you had time to research all that, very interesting stuff though. So, hop off your high horse and lets shake hands and get on with life, deal?

Notice I did not insult you or name you directly. I do not see how you would consider that personal insults. The Quebec comment was not direct at you either if you read again, you will clearly see that. Finally there is a difference between author of this post, and author of this reply. No need to get all worked up.
I am not defending the french either, just pointing out how ridiculous it is to generalize any group of people whether it is for race, language, religion, or color. Don't think that your reply created my reply; my reply was directed at people (and it's always the same people on these boards) who actually think that what they are saying when they are generalizing is true. If that is you, then yes it was aimed at you. If it wasn't then no it wasn't aimed at you. This post was actually a nice piece of bait, and people who had prejudice issues would single themselves out. Nonetheless the post remained vague and did not single anyone out, except for the author of this post, who displays this behavior constantly.
People that think that you can put an entire nation and label it under one banner, are the sames one that think that all Muslims are terrorists, are Jews are money making bastards, that all blacks are thieves... And like I said, there is no place for that in a great country like Canada.

[corporate joe]

There are even Frenchmen in this country that would not fight for France .

There are Canadians in Canada who would not fight for their country. What's your point?

Good for corporate joe to defend the French.God Knows they have not been able to defend themselves for the last two centuries.

Read the part of my reply where it says: "Am I defending France? I couldn't give a rats ass about what happens there. However, I've noticed a tendency on these boards from certain individuals to categorize and show clear prejudice towards a language and a people. I've even seen people think French Canadians are the same as French people from France.
If categorizing and judging humans on color is racism, what would you call doing the same to generalize against people for their language?
Whatever the term is, it comes from the same xenophobic ignorance and has no place in a great country like Canada.
However, seeing who the author of this post is, it comes at no surprise."

Now in this case, this post, was aimed at you, thanks for singling yourself out.

[bmc]

So, France has being chastized for not joining in on a bullshit war?

Canada didn't jump when Bush asked us to join the laughable Coalition of the Willing. Are Canadians wimps as well, 2R?

[2R]

I would not say that .
I would say that Canada has enjoyed the benefits of the Nato alliance with very little cost.And continues to enjoy the protection that the allies offer at very little cost in comparison to what other members are paying for our protection.How long this will go on for is another debate.

But it does bother me that Canadian troops and Scottish troops are buried in France when there are "Frenchmen in this country who would not fight for France" but chose to attend Nazi rallies in Montreal When the allies were under fire in France (source Devor 1942 as discussed on the CBC with regards to someone very important in canadian poitics whose father attended Nazi Rallies in Montreal). I have met Honourable Frenchmen in this country who fought alongside the allies to liberate France and Europe and done the right thing .So when i meet someone who says they do not jump to GWB i ask What would have happened if those two towers were in Montreal or Toronto??Who would of helped us ???Our friends would .If you do not help your friends in their time of need .Do not ask for help when you need it as none may come.

As for Afghanistan .There has never been peace there and there never will be

[ocnek]

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=9731d_4407

heheh....duck and cover!

[niss]

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=9731d_4407

heheh....duck and cover!

Ya I am pretty sure those were CDN forces.

[Glen Quagmire]

I would not say that .
I would say that Canada has enjoyed the benefits of the Nato alliance with very little cost.And continues to enjoy the protection that the allies offer at very little cost.

Not sure the families of our fallen soldiers would agree with you there. Canada seems to be doing much of the heavy lifting in Afghanistan, which has a direct link to 9/11 unlike Iraq.

So when i meet someone who says they do not jump to GWB i ask What would have happened if those two towers were in Montreal or Toronto??Who would of helped us ???Our friends would .If you do not help your friends in their time of need .Do not ask for help when you need it as none may come.

Are you saying we have done nothing to help the U.S. post 9/11? What a joke. Your line of reasoning is quite familiar to me but still makes me gag. Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11, do I need to repeat that to the hawkish members of this board, NOTHING. Honestly Canada is more at risk to terrorism now due to the actions of ex PNAC members down south. Oh right you don't know what PNAC is, well look it up.

Our soldiers are dying for you, and as a direct result of what happened some years ago in September, do not disparage them.

[2R]

Do not take my word for it .Read any history book Afghanistan has never known peace.The Tribal and Religious wars will be there long after the Nato mission is over.
Throw opium into the equation and those people will never know peace.A sad fact is that most drug producing countries are at war .With themselves or their neighbours.

The Best solution would be to sell Afghanistan to China.The Chinese would know how to stop the violence on the old silk roads.Maybe GWB will get the Chinese to forgive the USA debt in return for some much needed real estate.Say North Korea,Then Kasmir,then some Afghan hills with some excellent farming potential a fair exchange for all that debt.