Cross Winds....are they a mystery?

[Offset]

What do you do when you find yourself with a X/wind at your airport of destination that is beyond the demonstrated X/wind limits and you have no alternate left?

I remember a time as a student when returning from the practice area the winds had picked up to 20 kts straight across the only runway at the airport.

Good thing my instructor made sure I knew how to handle a crosswind before he let me go solo.

[sky's the limit]

Cat,

The Tiger was my fourth airplane, after the C140, 170, 152. I LOVED that thing, even with 75hrs at the time... Flew like a dream.

As for the x-wind thing, outside the bush types, I've been consistently appalled by the level of ability. Not that each and every person can't land smoothly in large x-winds, it's just they were never taught properly at school, and they did not get jobs early in their careers that demanded the skill on a daily basis. I did my initial number of hours on a 152, then switched to the 140, 170, Tiger, and Citabria before reaching 100hrs. I also had the benefit of a first class(not class 1...), and highly experienced teacher. Later during the CPL that changed, and I had some run-ins with the school over the quality of the Instructors/instruction.



STL

[Cat Driver]

STL, I also love the Grumman AA5 series, they are in my opinion the second best certified light aircraft in north America the Micco SP26 is the best.


http://www.miccoaircraft.com/SP26A_Specs.htm

I flew it at the factory some years ago with the intent of using the SP26A in my new flight training school that I could not get approved. It was a marvelous machine.

" Later during the CPL that changed, and I had some run-ins with the school over the quality of the Instructors/instruction. "

My reason for selling my first flight school school was because as it got bigger my problems with instructors with marginal skills and knowlege became expodentially bigger.

Who is responsible for this state of affairs?

[sky's the limit]

Who is responsible for this state of affairs?

Not one person in particular, that's the problem. It's a systemic issue, and I for one am glad I had some good advice when starting out, however that didn't prevent me from paying lots of money for sub-par flt training, I learned the hard way. Several people I know didn't care, they just wanted the license, not really caring what they actually learned along they way - I did, and still do.

STL

[mcrit]

contacts the runway aligned with the runway center line and no drift at touch down?

25000hrs and you need me to explain that?

You know, if you wrap your head in tin foil it will prevent the guys in Tower C from reading your thoughts. Just a friendly tidbit of advice for my venerated elder.

., go read Duke Elegant. That is what you should aspire to.

[nyco]

my oh my, please god, my dear god, make that I never get to fly with a stuburned and sadely insulting instructor. Aren't you the kind that yells on students before realizing you never taught him/her what they are doing wrong, or not at all?
Chill a bit mister, don't be only the mean ol' ba........

[Cat Driver]

" ., go read Duke Elegant. That is what you should aspire to. "

mcrit, the more you attempt to be sarcastic the deeper you shove your foot down your own throat.

I suggest you go back and read Dukes stuff.

Les was one of my best friends, you will also note when reading his stories that he used me as one of his examples of who to learn from, in fact I checked Les out in the C117 which the very airplane he starts his stories about.

Now I am going to give you some more advice.

From reading some of your ideas about flight training and asking you direct questions it is evident you are unsure how to respond and because you are very limited in your understanding of how to teach flying your only response is to attempt to insult people.

Quite frankly I do not believe you are the holder of a class 1 instructors rating, however if you in fact do hold one then you are the perfect example of why the rating has no meaning.

And to end this nonsense you are the perfect example of courage through anonymity.

Cat

[trey kule]

mcrit wrote

You know, if you wrap your head in tin foil it will prevent the guys in Tower C from reading your thoughts.

Have to agree with you on your assessment of him Cat. I tried the tinfoil thing. Other than just about suffocating myself and getting a bad taste in my mounth, I think the folks in tower C were still able to read my thoughts. Shows just how smart and knowlegable he really is.

Seriously, though, I have a couple of thoughts. At flight safety, for example, newly minted instructors are given (I believe) about three weeks additional training to teach them how to properly teach the FS curriculum. And they are supervised, supervised, supervised.
Now what flight school in Canada puts a newly minted class 4 through a three week company training program (at the company's expense).

Cat you had mentioned the quality, or lack of it, of the instructors you were getting. Seems to me a company indoctrination program might have been a big help. The problem, I have seen, is not that most of these folks cannot fly, but they suffer from minimal proper training, and maximum ego.

As an aside, if any FTU has students that cannot handle crosswinds by the time they are finished their PPL, we should be looking at the CFI and why that was not picked up and corrected.

It seems that managment in Canada considers it their job only to blame TC for poor standards, the flight schools for poor instructor training, and the new pilots for not knowing anything. time for FTU management to start taking some responsibility for the product they are turning out.

And I find it hard to believe X-wind landings warrents a thread...there really is something wrong in our system somewhere.

[Hedley]

courage through anonymity

Hey ., PM me if you want his name and his home phone number.

Hint: his parents named him after their favorite brand of rum

X-wind landings warrents (sic) a thread

Welcome to the People's Republic of Canada, where mediocrity is taken to new heights!

[trey kule]

Hedley, really?. His parents named him "rotgut"?

[Airtids]

Mount Gay?

[Cat Driver]

Trey, you are correct in your comments that it is the duty of management to ensure an acceptable level of quality in their instructional pool.

I tried for years to improve the level of instructional skills in my instructor pool, I had some successes and some failures.

What finally made me decide to sell out was the realization that I would never be able to pay a living wage to my instructors due to market driven rates set by all the schools in my area.

You can not attract enough students if you raise your rates to the level that will support top notch instructors if none of the schools around you are willing to raise their rates.

In the end I decided to just sell out and go back to flying in other areas of aviation where I could justify my time and efforts.

[trey kule]

Cat.

I understand completely. Just a short while ago I looked at buying a little cub, and when I did the math using $50.00 (plus overburden) for an instructor, the cost was more than what most schools are charging for a C172. I really dont know how they do it, even by starving their instructors.

[Cat Driver]

" Hey ., PM me if you want his name and his home phone number. "

Thanks Hedley, but I'll pass on that one.

I am afraid that I would find out he actually is the holder of a class 1 instructors rating and that would depress me further.

Maybe Jim Dow could use him?

[Hedley]

Maybe Jim Dow could use him?

Funny how great minds think alike For quite some time, I've been asking him how his application into Transport is going!

[nyco]

it's funny how, either on francophone or english forums, you ll always have the minority of people who seem to be addicted to being as..s. I must say i feel bad for doc having to justify or answer all these comments. any chance mcrit we could use the forums and posts for some interresting and/or enjoyeable comments, just a thought, would be cool though he?

[Cat Driver]

nyco, when people do not have the ability to address the message they attack the messenger.

mcrit is forgetting that the internet is not as safe to hide behind as he may think.

I wonder what would happen if he got outed here so his students could get a better feel for his debating skills when it comes to how to teach flying.

You see it is easy for me to denut him in these infantile arguments because I do have a track record as a flight teacher to back up my methods of teaching.

Your greatest fear as flight instructors is that he may someday show up at your school with a TC ID hanging around his neck with all the power that would give him to be a paid prick.

I bet he wouldn't have the balls to try bullying me even with the tag as protection.

Because TC would have to pay a proctologist to retreive their ID tag.

[nyco]

I said doc didn't I, i meant cat indeed, guess my brain is working slow motion after a day at work on my computer.
anyways, I am just a bit sadden to think that some students do have instructors with this kind of ego and little opening to others. I used to teach in a big school in the US (florida, yeah sorry, some do what they can to live their dream lol), and there was some of these top gun "i'm the best, I know better" kinda instructor. worst in that is they got to the airline, and left behing a few students who just couldn't enjoy aviation anymore. you know, the students whose instructor liked to impose on rather than share.
Anyways, don't forget to enjoy and be happy while flying or live, you won't survive anyways

Mcrit, if i could have only one advice, chill, enjoy the experience you can receive, and share the one you have, but don't take yourself too seriously, you ll just end up making a fool of yourself

[mcrit]

Hey Cat:
I know you've got experience, and I would (and I am not being sarcastic here) love hear what you have to say. The problem is that you don't share your knowledge, you spend most of your time implying that the rest of us are stupid. That is my beef with you. If you want to share your knowledge and point HOW something could be done better, by God, you go for it with my blessing and full support. If on the other hand you just want to come on here and vent your spleen....never mind, my intent is to stay constructive. I was serious when I told you to take a look at Duke Elegant. He shared alot, and never once belittled anyone.
As for my name, you, and everyone else has seen it on other threads, and anyone that wants to know need only ask.

Hedley:
What type of spin do you get if your C of G is too far aft, and how recoverable is it? What is the legal reference that permits the C172 to spin. Also, I've had a chat with a certain board member of our mutual aquaintance. He seemed to know you quite well. He was of the opinion that you should stop complaining about being of the airshow circuit and just be greatful that you still have a license. I had lunch with some of the Inspectors at 4900 (we share a caf, and they are nice fellows). They seem to concur with our mutual aquaintance. I will however thank you for the idea for my avatar.

nyco:
Come fly with me sometime, you'll find that even with my ego in the cockpit there is plenty of breathing space (there are guys on here that can back that up). You're advice is good and I do try and follow it. Its just that I can't abide a bully (might be part of the reason signed on with my current employer).

[trey kule]

Mcrit:

So you had some chats with some folks in TC who shared their opinion of Hedley. Care to share their names?

We have privacy laws in this country, and I am sick to death with government employees who think they can cleverly use words or phrases to circumvent these regulations.

I do hope someone from TC's office reads your post and takes come action.

I am editing this. I happen to mention my frustration to one of our higher ups and he is contacting TC's office to deal with this matter.
He has promissed to post their reply or pass it on to me and I will post it.

Mcrit: your backyard fence disparaging comments are completely lacking in manners, as no one can defend themselves against such gossip.
I do hope Hedley looks into his legal options with such written comments.

[Cat Driver]

mcrit:

Just one more correction on your suggestions, I was one of the Dukes best friends and we actually did fly together, for you to make the jump in thinking that I belittle people for something to do and refer me to Dukes stories he wrote for entertainment is quite presumptious of you.

Trey:

Please let us know what response you get from TC with regard to their negative comments on one of their clients, which is in violation of their working contract with TC.

But be prepared to get a snow job as twice I presented living witnesses to exactly the same type of degrading comments by TC officials to my clients.

When I proved beyond doubt that named TC individuals told my clients not to take flight instruction from me because " We have issues to settle with . . " .

In the end all I ever got was a letter of apology from the Regional Director General TC, and he also sent letters of apology to my clients with the excuse that his employees " had made a mistake "

It was not three months later than the same TC inspector made the same remarks to another possible client and it was at that point I finally gave up and never worked in Canada again.

But soon I hope to have my own homebuilt airplane and I intend to give instruction outside of any approval or interaction with TC.

I pray every night to the Great Manatou the God of my forefathers that that slimy prick at TC comes within reach of me and I will make him wish his father had pulled out.

Cat

[trey kule]

Cat.

I didnt send the letter myself to TC, but I have a copy of it. It is a pretty good letter, but he sent it to TC in Pacific region. Is the "4900" reference to an address in that region or some other region?

I think it is time that people get called to task for it. At the very least I am hoping that they may be a little more careful about what they say to people who post here.

And I will advise of the reply when he gets it.

[Cat Driver]

"It is a pretty good letter, but he sent it to TC in Pacific region. Is the "4900" reference to an address in that region or some other region? "

Trey, 4900 is Young St in Toronto.

The Pacific Region head office is 800 Burrard and arguably the most disfunctional Regional office in Canada under the leadership of Dave Nowzek with the full support of Pruess in Ottawa.

If you are expecting to get even a glimmer of honesty and fair comment out of that office you better get ready for a snow job.

As I have said over and over, the industry would be better served by Mafia Dons than by those whom I have named, over and over and over......

But maybe what I am stating is false and they are not aware of my actions and therefore do not defend their own actions.

[nyco]

definetely aside, cat, if you ever fly catalina's in the region, let me know

[trey kule]

Cat;

I mentioned to him about the address, but there was a reason he chose Pacific region, which I dont want to go into on a public forum.

However, prior to Mcrit's post, I had nothing but admiration and respect for Hedley. Since reading it however, my opinion of him has completely changed.
So, If what Mcrit has said is fair comment, than all is as it should be. But if it is not true, than he has substantially changed my opinion of Hedley, and thus libeled Hedley. If Transport Canada inspectors, did, in fact, make those comments to Mcrit, then I think Hedley might have an action against them as well.
As to the anoymity SP?) question, I do know Hedley's true identity, so the comments were made about an actual person, and not an avatar.