Forces AME

Pete · Post by **Pete** » Sat Sep 30, 2006 9:34 pm

Hello Everyone,

Im interested in the Maintenance side of aviation...I dont know if Id pursue it...maybe one day along my lifes journey...who knows....but not in the near future.

From reading this forum, it seems, just like being a pilot...being an AME is just as hard with respect to finding work, going where the jobs are etc.

I have yet to find many posts on getting trained, and working through the Airforce. Is there any reason? Pro's or Cons? I think if I were to go through, Id try through the airforce first....providing all my experience could be transfered (or TC recognized) to a civilian job (someone correct me if Im wrong).

Any thoughts on this I would enjoy reading....if I were to get into a 2nd career...I think being an AME would be my thing...probably the only thing that would keep me in aviation if I couldnt fly professionaly. Thanks!

ian254 · Post by **ian254** » Mon Oct 02, 2006 5:58 pm

don't bother going in the airforce it from what I have been told its not transferable but that doesn't mean that TC won't change it

onthelook · Post by **onthelook** » Tue Oct 03, 2006 3:38 pm

i thought the guys gettin out of the airforce needed to do 6 months on the civilian side before they could get a liecense.. its got to be on the transport site somewheres...

Greg87 · Post by **Greg87** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 5:21 pm

Just out of curiosity what's the reasoning behind that? If anyone can fix planes and keep them in the air the air force guys can, look at what they have to work with!

conehead · Post by **conehead** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 9:36 pm

Greg87 wrote:Just out of curiosity what's the reasoning behind that?

You must have worked for at least 6 months on aircraft registered in Canada. Military aircraft are not on the Canadian registry. (civil)

Bullet Remington · Post by **Bullet Remington** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 9:44 pm

As an ex mil wog and both licensed Engineer and pilot here's my perspective.

Firstly, the military doesn't cal their maintenance folks engineers. They're called Technicians. For example, I was on the last course of people trained as Aviation Techs before they broke it up into the Aero Engine tech (MOC 511) and Arfram tech (512). They have since gone back and combined the electrical, airframe and engine trades into one called Aviation Maintenace technician (AMT).

They ysed to have the machinist, sheet metal worked and refinisher trades separte as well. I believe they now have that combined and call them Aircraft Structure technicians

The reasonong for having mil guys do some time on civilian maintenance side is very simple. There are no civilian type equvilents for fighter aircraft.

They did grant me the time I worked on Sea Pigs because the SK61N is the civilian equvalent. But then again, I joined as an Aviation tech with a civil B license. (Structures). I'm not sure if its the same or different with TC now.

For those folks who spend their whole career working on fighters, there may be some difficulty in getting TC on side. The helicopter folks have it a bit easier. Especially those fortunate enough to attend civilain type courses.

Switching from mil to civie can be done. I would suggest talking it over with some folks who have done it and talking with TC as well.

Cheers and Good Luck to you.

HercRigger · Post by **HercRigger** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 2:20 am

Pete,

I felt the same way as you. I looked at getting into aviation as a pilot but after going to college and getting a diploma (immediately after 9/11) there wasn't a whole lot in the way of jobs and overall, the industry looked pretty bleak back then. I joined the Forces in 2002 as an AVN Tech and eventually ended up working on Hercs in Trenton. I love it. It's not everyone's cup of tea mind you, lot's of time spent away from home (in Afghanistan at the moment, and coming back here this winter and next spring for my 2nd and 3rd tours) The Herc community, aircrew and groundcrew inclusive, spends more time away than any other type in the CF with the exception of probably the Sea Kings. If you like working hard, going places and seeing things you probably would never see on civvie street, this is for you. The hours are long (I've been up here for 3 weeks now and haven't had a single day off since we arrived) but it's rewarding. Eventually, I'd like to take what I've gotten through the CF and write my AME exams and get my M1 or M2. Haven't looked too much into it but it can be done apparently so check with TC. Hope this helps.

Cheers

Kandoo · Post by **Kandoo** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 5:07 am

If you join as an AVS tech. (Avionics) the transition is not that difficult if you meet the requirements. I am not sure how much military time you need; I’m guessing TQ5 qualified with a few years under your belt doesn’t hurt. You will need to bring all your training records and UER to Transport for an evaluation. You will be required to have six months working on Canadian registered aircraft and will need a letter from your employer stating this. If you have enough time,military and civilian, you will be allowed to challenge the Transport Canada AME exams.
If you join as an AVN tech. (Mechanic) you will still need to take an Aircraft Mechanics course through a recognized college. You can do this by correspondence; everything else is the same as AVS. This is how things use to be, I don’t know if it has changed recently.

Greg87 · Post by **Greg87** » Fri Sep 07, 2007 8:07 pm

Question, I am currently in college for Aircraft Maintainance. We were recently told that if we signed up for the forces our 5 years would start immediately, ie: including the time spent at college, and our schooling would be paid for. On our summer off we'd go through basic, then after college we'd have 3 years left of the 5 years. Now what I'd like to know is do you still fill out a logbook in the forces and have things signed off? I keep hearing about how there is the 6 month thing, but does that mean the rest of the time on the apprenticeship is considered complete? I've been thinking about it lately, input from anyone is greatly appreciated.

Kandoo · Post by **Kandoo** » Sat Sep 08, 2007 3:53 am

The Forces can be a great route to go. I spent 13 years in and now have a good career as an E and M2 AME. The last I am aware of they were going to a logbook similar to the one Transport requires for an AME. When I was in all tasks were recorded on your OJT forms in your UER. This was accepted by Transport, for me, towards my AME. I would go to my local Transport office and have a sit down with someone and find out exactly what they will accept before making a decision. The other thing to consider is the aircraft type you will be assigned to because it must have a civilian registered equivalent to be considered toward your time. When dealing with Forces Recruiting a word of advice, NEVER take what you’re being told as the truth. I would never accuse a recruiter of lying but sometimes they can be conveniently unaware of the facts and overly optimistic of the outcome of your situation. If it isn’t in writing it’s only a rumor and will have no bearing what so ever on your future career in the military! Like I said it can be a great way to go and you could decide not to leave once you get there. I have friends still in and loving it. I had some of the best times of my life because of it. Just do your homework and go in with your eyes open. Whatever you decide Best of Luck!

Greg87 · Post by **Greg87** » Sat Sep 08, 2007 5:17 am

Thank you for your reply. When you say that there has to be a civillian equivalent, does that mean there has to be a civillian version of that particular aircraft or that there has to be something similar? Does that mean planes like the Hornet and Hawk and other similar types wouldn't count?

Kandoo · Post by **Kandoo** » Sat Sep 08, 2007 11:45 am

I would check with Transport Canada on that to be sure, but I believe that’s the case. You could always try getting it written in your contract where you’ll be posted after training and what airframe you’ll be working on. It may be suggested that you could end up working on the Prime Ministers Airbus but remember if it’s not on paper it doesn’t mean squat!

petite · Post by **petite** » Sat Sep 08, 2007 2:28 pm

PM me.

Mech-Pilot · Post by **Mech-Pilot** » Sun Sep 30, 2007 8:50 am

We currently have a couple of CF guys working with us. One them is a recent hire and doing his apprentership. I guess most of his time was accepted by TC because we was an engine tech on the Hercs, but to have his license he has to work for 6 months have a certain amount of civi tasks completed and write the new exams that TC has brought out(General Knowledge, Engines, Airframes and also the fabulous CARS). It totally can be done.

I'm kinda glad I didn't go the CF way after college. The recruiter told me there was no room for AMT but he could get me in as a cook. That didn't go over well with me!!

conehead · Post by **conehead** » Sun Sep 30, 2007 9:08 pm

Mech-Pilot wrote:The recruiter told me there was no room for AMT but he could get me in as a cook. That didn't go over well with me!!

Recruiters have a twisted sense of humour!

Canada cargo Inc. · Post by **Canada cargo Inc.** » Wed Oct 10, 2007 5:35 pm

I will never say anything bad about my air force training. I joined at 17 yr. with very few prospects. The air force helped me to grow up. I started out as a aircraft engine mechanic but learned very quickly that almost everyone in TC at that time was ex-military. I wrote my AME 'M' license exams without having to work on any 'civi' aircraft -just 104 fighters. I just had to prove that I was cross-trained on airframe side, which was easy.

After 10 years of hands-on working experience on fighters, helicopters, and Boeing 707's - I transfered into NDT - non destructive testing. They forced us to write government exams to get our civilian certifications. I left after six more years and got a $10K raise in pay the day I walked out. They just could not afford to pay us what the civilian market was offering. I was one of the lucky ones.

Canada is the second largest country in the world, but we have one of the smallest populations and military forces.
- Why aren't countries with twice the populations being asked to do more
- Why isn't our military just UN peace keepers like we used to be.

So think very carefully about what you want from the current air force. Remember this - you never get paid enough to get shot at - no matter what the occupation, especially on foreign soil. Don't get me wrong - I would have no trouble taking up arms to protect my own country or my family, but I see no right way to die for some other country.

davey · Post by **davey** » Thu Oct 18, 2007 1:50 pm

Hi Guys,
I am facing the same problem as you lot, the only difference is that I am in the Royal Air Force (UK) and looking into getting my licenses. It does seem a little odd that all your experience really means nothing in civvie street, but once you get your licence, you are not only a qualified engineer but you take with you all the qualities that the military instills in you, and from my experience it means alot. There may be a huge amount of hoops to jump thru but its got to be worth it in the end!!

jayjact · Post by **jayjact** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 11:15 pm

I have a friend who was an "AIRFRAME TECH" for 13 years in the Airforce. His work in the military counted towards his AME licence, except...he had to do an engine course first. He said in the military, the different aspects of the job a very segregated. In 13 years he never touched an engine. Airframe , gear, control surfaces are all he dealt with, absolutly no avionics or electrical he got around that because he took an avionics course and now has an E licence though. This was 12 years ago, things may have changed.