Harv's Air - or other FTOs for Canadian PPL? Please advise..

OldSmokey · Post by **OldSmokey** » Mon Nov 19, 2007 4:43 pm

Hi Guys,

I am new to this forum and this is my first post

I have extensive information about Harv's Air already and have read through the post's on this and other sites.

I am from the UK and am considering coming to Harvs Air for a Canadian PPL sometime between May and July. As I do not live in Canada I turn to you folks for honest advice..

I just wanted some recent information on the 'truth' behind the school? How good are instructors? Aircraft? Facilities - I am currently stuck between choosing Steinbech or St. Andrews? I know it has a cosmopolitan and international feel to it.

It seems like quite a well run outfit with good facilities, but this could be just marketing!

I only have limited vacation and have set aside between 4-6 weeks (possibly 7) for completing the PPL, and will rent an individual room. I will also try and clear the ground school before coming to Canada. I have a TC Class 1 medical.

The problem I have is that visiting the school before hand to find out exactly what it is like may be a problem, and I know the risks associated with going in 'blind'?

I am just trying to minimise this so would appreciate any information about Harvs.

I am also considering the likes of Moncton and Pro IFR, and recently WWFC - any others I should be considering?

Thanks

OS

OldSmokey · Post by **OldSmokey** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 5:52 am

48 views and not one reply??

Surely someone must have know about the school.....?!

niwre · Post by **niwre** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 8:18 am

OldSmokey wrote:48 views and not one reply??

Surely someone must have know about the school.....?!

The problem is you're going to have 48 different opinions. There are many great schools out there. Harvs is good at what they do so is Moncton.

OldSmokey · Post by **OldSmokey** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 9:36 am

Ok, well to rephrase the question..

For a PPL, what experiences (if any) can people share about Harvs Air, Moncton and ProIFR?

In terms of quality of training etc, for someone who is about to embark upon the long road ahead and start with the PPL....

renfley · Post by **renfley** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 9:43 am

There's lots of info on a bunch of schools, check out http://www.avcanada.ca/forums2/viewtopic.php?t=12463
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OldSmokey · Post by **OldSmokey** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 10:38 am

Yes, i read the info and trawled through the page, but I am more after a 'heads up' of recent experiences by people who have attended the school recently..

shamrock104 · Post by **shamrock104** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 5:47 pm

Good school with good facilities, accommodation at the airport.
Steinbech is a dry town, no beers so no major distractions.
A suggestion would be to start your training with the Cadets so you can keep the same pace as them and get it done in the 6 weeks, they will let you do this. If you dont get the ground exams done you can also ask to sit in on their groundschool.
If you need any more info please feel free to PM me.

sdp · Post by **sdp** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 6:55 pm

are you from the middle east? if not, don't waste your time or money! lots more to choose from.

OldSmokey · Post by **OldSmokey** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 4:24 am

Hi Shamrock104,

I will PM you to pick this up with you directly.

SDP - No I am not from the Middle East, I am from England.

Why do you ask?

I have logic for choosing Canada over U.S.A - Quality of training being one and a few other issues.

SDP - So what school would you recommend and why?

Feel free to PM me if you like...

Cat Driver · Post by **Cat Driver** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 10:10 am

I have logic for choosing Canada over U.S.A - Quality of training being one and a few other issues.

How do you figure the quality of training is better in Canada?

That is not my experience, having been involved in both.

OldSmokey · Post by **OldSmokey** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 10:41 am

From my understanding Transport Canada regularly conducted spot checks on syllabus and training given by FTO's.

The likes of FAA training which is more 'loosey' 'doosey' in comparison to JAA and TC also in my opinion points to this factor.

However, I think it is not so much the school but the Flight Instructor and individual which affects training quality, the school only plays a certain element.

I also hold an FAA Medical and can consider the U.S, depending on the FTO.

I suppose the Permanent Residency factor for Canada, sways my decision more for training in Canada compared to U.S.A.

I am open to options if you have any constructive suggestions ?

Thanks

O.S

Hedley · Post by **Hedley** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 10:45 am

Bingo. If you get a good instructor, you will get good instruction. If you get a not-so-good instructor, you will get not-so-good instruction. This is true regardless of what school or location you choose.

Frankly, this time of year, Florida is looking pretty good

Remember that Canada and the USA have licence reciprocity - generally all you have to to, to convert a pilot's licence between the two, is to write a short test and do a medical.

Cat Driver · Post by **Cat Driver** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 10:50 am

However, I think it is not so much the school but the Flight Instructor and individual which affects training quality, the school only plays a certain element.

That sums it up exactly.

The main difference between Canada and the USA is the need for a operating certificate in Canada to open a flying school. In the USA once you become a licensed instructor you can open a training business without the crippling time and money losses that you face in Canada if you are the owner of the business.

Therefore it stands to reason that in the USA you should have a better expectation of spending less for training as it is cheaper for the owner to operate in the USA.

OldSmokey · Post by **OldSmokey** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 11:01 am

Well, I have both category 1 Medical for TC and FAA.

I am taking this one step at a time and have given myself approx 6 weeks (official vacation allowance) plus 1 week unpaid to get the PPL. Although, I anticipate that 5 weeks is the average, I have planned for contingency in any case.

I plan to do this around May - June 08 so I am looking into schools now albeit Canadian or FAA.

If I have to change instructors during the limited vacation time I have etc this will further complicate matters and I am just trying to get peoples experiences of different schools.

Either way if I get an FAA or TC PPL ( both are ICAO) and under the recipricol agreement I will have this endorsed by the respective licensing authority.

So that said, any futher advice?

The trouble is with the U.S and Canada being so far away the difficulty comes in visiting each school and then deciding, which will also reduce the amount of constructive time spent flying.

Post by **avcanada** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 11:13 am

TSA authorization is something else to consider if you choose the U.S..

The training standards in Canada and the U.S. are basically the same. The written exams are easier in the U.S. however. If you choose the U.S. select a school that runs a Part 141 flight training program.

Which ever school you choose the most important thing is to get with an instructor who fits well with you personality and training goals.

Finding a qualified, motivated, instructor is the key.

I've heard nothing but good things about Harv's Air over the years.

OldSmokey · Post by **OldSmokey** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 11:15 am

Yes, this was another consideration which swayed my decision to train in Canada.

TSA Authorisation can take a considerable time to come through and that is after being treated like a second class citizen!

In comparison to Canada where you can do a PPL or anything under 6 months on a tourist Visa, which also sits in nicely with my vacation plan

hldiets · Post by **hldiets** » Sat Nov 24, 2007 3:08 pm

Harv's is great....make sure you learn at St. Andrews though, they have a tower and 3 runways.
Their other location is private and uncontrolled.

ski_bum · Post by **ski_bum** » Sat Nov 24, 2007 5:52 pm

Old Smokey,
Harv's is a great school. I have been a student and instructor there. If you are on a crunch for time, they know how to handle it and will get you done, providing you are willing to put in the time. Get the ground school done before coming over, one less thing to worry about and it will speed things up. The equipment is pretty good, I think every plane has a garmin pannel mount GPS in it, and the fleet is diverse, however if your on a tight time line I would stick to one type.

As Cat and Hedley said, if you get a good instructor you get good instruction. This is very true and everyone at harv's is on the same page, some may be better than others, but all are good. PM me if you want names.

I would vote for St. Andrews, great facility, 3 runways, controlled airspace, restuarant, etc.

Any other questions feel free to PM me.

Ski_Bum

Mr. North · Post by **Mr. North** » Mon Nov 26, 2007 4:19 pm

Harv's came through for me when I was pressed for time. And considering nearly half of their students are foreigners, they have the experience to get you on your way.

Good caliber instructors. St. Andrews is closer to big city fun.

Krashman · Post by **Krashman** » Tue Nov 27, 2007 11:55 pm

Harv's is a good school. But there are alot of other school out there as well. I used to instruct at Harv's and I know there are a lot of airplanes so if your willing to do alot of flying you can get a plane pretty well when ever you like.

One piece of advice: Be sure to take all the cost estimates they've given to you with a grain of salt. They only cover the very minimum amout of flying and from my experience you'll be doing between 10 and 20% more. I've found that some student go to harv's or any school with the notion in their head all they need to do is bang off 45hrs of flight training and they've got their licence.

I've had alot of very satisfied students from the school and a few that leave but such is the business.