Air Canada's unions ready to 'Walk the Line in '09'

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Traf
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Re: Air Canada's unions ready to 'Walk the Line in '09'

Post by Traf »

ok, maybe it's been asked before, but I don't remember. Will Jazz pilots picket with AC pilots when it comes time, or will they be flying their asses off?
I don't think you are going to see the Jazz guys walking the picket lines in support of the AC pilots. There is too much bad blood and conflicting interests. There is no way that either one of these groups is going to walk the line in supprt of the other's seperate contracts.

As much as we would like to pretend there is a new generation of pilots moving into both airlines, the fact is, there is an overlap on some flying that both sides would like to do. Need proof? How many pages was the protest ACPA filed with Teplitzky over the replacement of a 200 with a 705? I heard 30 some pages. All that over 25 seats.

Anyone who thinks the company is going to negotiate both sides at the same time is sniffing glue. They will manipulate both groups with the threat of flying being passed to the other side. They will cut back door deals with both sides and promise damage to the other group knowing that ALPA or ACPA would do a deal with the devil to secure their own future and possibly do harm to the other guy's.

The only chance there was of these groups supporting each other in 2009 has come and passed when the Global Solution went down the tubes. Human nature is to protect yourself. Come 2009, that is exactly what both sides will be doing. You gotta wonder though, have these two groups spent so much time fighting for their own, seperate future that they have missed the fact that the most powerful position possible would be a united front?

Fasten your seatbelts folks, this ride will not be straight forward and not without dirty deals, backstabbing and shady characters.
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tonysoprano
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Re: Air Canada's unions ready to 'Walk the Line in '09'

Post by tonysoprano »

Yah, why wait. Looks like it's already started.
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Rockie
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Re: Air Canada's unions ready to 'Walk the Line in '09'

Post by Rockie »

Several years ago the Nova Scotia nurses were legislated back to work and the next morning their union showed the government 5500+ resignation letters. Talks resumed.

But that won't happen at Air Canada.
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2R
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Re: Air Canada's unions ready to 'Walk the Line in '09'

Post by 2R »

Some of the most valuable real estate that the company owns in CYVR was recently assessed .I bet that all that stuff will be sold off just befoe the airline is sold.The government now allows for 49 percent foreign ownership in both equity and voting shares .My wild ass guess completly unfounded in any facts would be a company that would use the very large hangers on the southside for its cargo operations from/to Asia .Same guys that were talking to Canadian before the takeover are still talking in Richmond .Shareholder meeting was held in the airborne rodent bar on the southside .Most agreed that the airline will be sold before 09

Just a feeble attempt at starting a rumour. The author claims no facts are true and completly the figment of a busy mind :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
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linebacker35
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Re: Air Canada's unions ready to 'Walk the Line in '09'

Post by linebacker35 »

rudder wrote:There is alternative domestic service on most routes and certainly 100% of the destinations that AC serves within Canada. Similarly, there are alternatives to AC to arrive at transborder and international destinations. It is Jazz that is the sole service provider using AC code to many medium and smaller Canadian cities and towns that could be viewed as 'essential'.

The last AC pilot strike saw United Airline pilots refuse to fly added flights on AC routes in support of the AC pilots.
The situation south of the border has the pilot groups uniting to change the industry, and there has been talk about how they would support each other in this way. It would be interesting to see if more pilot groups come to the aid of the AC pilots like United did last time.

ACPA and the American unions such as ALPA and APA should organize support for one another in the upcomming negotiations
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Jaques Strappe
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Re: Air Canada's unions ready to 'Walk the Line in '09'

Post by Jaques Strappe »

ACPA and its members have also put their support behind BALPA in the latest strike vote at British Airways. American is doing the same and will also be heading toward a strike vote. I think you may see a lot of unity after all the CEO cash grabbing that has been going on.
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Machiavelli
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Re: Air Canada's unions ready to 'Walk the Line in '09'

Post by Machiavelli »

Read ACE aviation holding's and Air Canada's management proxy circulars for all the lurid details on "Executive Compensation".

Does ACPA read these things, especially when it comes time to negotiate? I'm mad about it and I don't even work there.
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Re: Air Canada's unions ready to 'Walk the Line in '09'

Post by North of You »

Well thank you very much! I just blew a mouth full of wine all over the monitor when I saw these numbers! Do not read any further if you are eating. You were warned.
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yyz monkey
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Re: Air Canada's unions ready to 'Walk the Line in '09'

Post by yyz monkey »

Updated numbers for 2006 (AC) are here: http://www.aircanada.com/en/about/inves ... _proxy.pdf

Page 35
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Re: Air Canada's unions ready to 'Walk the Line in '09'

Post by Dockjock »

Barf.

For 2006, over 60% of all AC.B stock options granted to employees went to the top 5 executives in the company. There are about 30,000 employees in total. And we wonder why the us vs. them mentality persists?

On the other hand, the strike price is $21 by 2013...I'm not sure those pieces of paper will be worth anything at all. Which begs the further question- why not bribe the employees with options? Clearly with this stock performance it is a no cost incentive! :roll:
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Four1oh
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Re: Air Canada's unions ready to 'Walk the Line in '09'

Post by Four1oh »

:shock: Jebus pitty effn christ!!
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Re: Air Canada's unions ready to 'Walk the Line in '09'

Post by QFE »

You had better cash in your options BEFORE you get legislated back to work as the shares will pop when that news comes out. :wink:
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Re: Air Canada's unions ready to 'Walk the Line in '09'

Post by KAFUFO »

I actually heard the Jazz fund is going to be AC savior from ACE unfortunatly this means 777 doing grand prarie to edmonton and CRJ YVR direct SDY
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tonysoprano
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Re: Air Canada's unions ready to 'Walk the Line in '09'

Post by tonysoprano »

Dockjock.
We don't want stock options. AC has the capacity to pay its pilots good old fashioned formula pay. All we need to do is convince that management and other departments are sucking the life out of pilot's pay.
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RB-211
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Re: Air Canada's unions ready to 'Walk the Line in '09'

Post by RB-211 »

Not to mention unlce Milty's pay out.

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/20 ... sia-x.html


Time to put an end to it.
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tonysoprano
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Re: Air Canada's unions ready to 'Walk the Line in '09'

Post by tonysoprano »

Time to put an end to it.
Those should be the words we take to the table. This will be a real test.
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Re: Air Canada's unions ready to 'Walk the Line in '09'

Post by Dockjock »

I want stock options, just not in place of salary or other compensation. I mean in addition to.

It certainly doesn't seem like Milton, Brewer, Dunne, Duschesne, Peterson, or Fournel (average 2005 compensation $980,000 NOT INCLUDING OPTIONS) had to forgo anything to receive them in past years. And I really don't see how 65% of all options granted must go to the top 5 executives in the company. Certainly seems to have worked for WJ and I dare say stock options would be a tad more motivating to pilots than the chance at a $75 monthly bonus is.
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