should I take algonquin program (ofc)???

[jpar84]

Hi Everyone,

This is my first post. I am glad I came across this forum because I have an important decision to make in the next week and would love to get some expert opinions.

I will be starting my flight training this year and I am considering the aviation management program at algonquin college in Ottawa in conjunction with the OFC. I have been accepted to start in september and must confirm enrollment by may 1st. The program offers a commercial pilots license and an additional rating (float,instructor,or multi-crew) within 16 months, it also provides academic training in general areas as well as aviation specific areas. the cost is aprox $50,000.

i am currently finishing up my bachelor of commerce degree (finance major) at concordia university. I am trying to decide whether entering this program will be beneficial to me considering I will already have a university degree. I must decide whether I would be better off enrolling in the program and fast tracking my flight training or working full-time while flying whenever possible.

The way I see it, the program does offer potentially usefull training in areas such as Glass cockpit/gps technology and crew resource management that I would probably wouldn't get if i didn't enroll. I will also be eligible for a student line of credit to help finance the program which is much more lenient in terms of principle repayment then other loans or lines of credit. At the same time however, maybe the additional academics won't be beneficial considering I already have a degree. If I were to work full-time and do my flight training over aproximately 2 years i will likely have much less debt at the end of it and will gain work experience in finance that I could turn to if heaven for bid the pilot thing doesn't work out. If I do enroll in the program I must schedule a lesson everyday between 8 am and 3 pm and will attend classes in the evenings, I might be able to get part-time work at part-time pay best case scenario. The program amy also provide networking benefits as it has affiliations with first air, air inuit and others.

So many things to consider and so little time.

Any general insight into the algonquin program would be greatly appretiated, as well as general advice as to whether I would be better off working fullt-time and training or enrolling in the program. I'm also aware that being a pilot requires an open-mind and maybe there's a better way that I haven't even considered. I am not eligible for the military due to my height (6'6").

I look forward to getting some insight on this and very much appretiate any advice!

thanks in advance
JP

[Hedley]

currently finishing up my bachelor of commerce degree

Why not just go right to a flight school (OFC or any other)
and do your flight training, ASAP?

The sooner you get out there, the less likely you will entirely
miss this cycle.

Maybe I'm wrong, but if you have an undergrad degree from
a university, you probably already have enough post-secondary
education.

If you want to fly, just frikken get out there and fly! Sounds
to me like you've already spent enough time in the classroom.

Maybe I'm missing something here, but for someone like
you, I think an hour working on the ramp as a line guy would
be more educational about aviation than another hour in the
classroom. You've already spent 4 frikken years doing that.

Flying is like screwing. You can talk about it in the classroom,
but there is absolutely no substitute for practical experience.

[sez]

I guess I'm in the similar situation like you. I hold a Bachelor's Degree in Finance and working for the last 4 years in Oil Industry in a very competitive multinational company. Because I could not be able to save enough money I've chosen a subsidized College for my commercial training. Well I'm happy with my choice, considering I'm new to Canada, I have a chance to build network for the aviation industry (well not enrolled yet, I hope in sept...). But I gues as you're Canadian you'll not have the same difficulties like me. Whether you choose College or Flight School way, I'm sure that it will work out similar outcome for your taining. By the way after my taining ends in 2 years, and work in Av Industry for some years, I am not quite sure that if I'll be eligible in Oil Industry again. (Actually I'm 31 quite older than u). So follow your dream If it's your dream indeed.

[jpar84]

currently finishing up my bachelor of commerce degree[/quote]

Why not just go right to a flight school (OFC or any other)
and do your flight training, ASAP?

The sooner you get out there, the less likely you will entirely
miss this cycle.

Maybe I'm wrong, but if you have an undergrad degree from
a university, you probably already have enough post-secondary
education.

If you want to fly, just frikken get out there and fly! Sounds
to me like you've already spent enough time in the classroom.

Maybe I'm missing something here, but for someone like
you, I think an hour working on the ramp as a line guy would
be more educational about aviation than another hour in the
classroom. You've already spent 4 frikken years doing that.

Flying is like screwing. You can talk about it in the classroom,
but there is absolutely no substitute for practical experience.

If flying is anything like screwing then I know I'm gonna love it. I completely agree with you that getting through training as fast as possible is the way to go and yes I am sick of sitting in the classroom. The only thing is this program is the quickest way for me to get into the workforce as I will get my cpl and instructor rating in 16 months. I suppose i could do that on my own if i schedule lessons almost everyday though.

Thanks for the reply

[jpar84]

I guess I'm in the similar situation like you. I hold a Bachelor's Degree in Finance and working for the last 4 years in Oil Industry in a very competitive multinational company. Because I could not be able to save enough money I've chosen a subsidized College for my commercial training. Well I'm happy with my choice, considering I'm new to Canada, I have a chance to build network for the aviation industry (well not enrolled yet, I hope in sept...). But I gues as you're Canadian you'll not have the same difficulties like me. Whether you choose College or Flight School way, I'm sure that it will work out similar outcome for your taining. By the way after my taining ends in 2 years, and work in Av Industry for some years, I am not quite sure that if I'll be eligible in Oil Industry again. (Actually I'm 31 quite older than u). So follow your dream If it's your dream indeed.

Its nice to hear from somebody in a similar situation. I have no doubt that i am going to pursue a career as a pilot I'm just trying to map it out the best way possible.

thanks for the insight and good luck!

[CLguy]

Jpar84 just finish your degree and head to the cheapest flight school and start training. Don't get caught up in the so called Aviation Programs that are nothing more than a Flying School piggybacking on to a College so they can grab your cash. Unless you are attending a true College Aviation Program that has their own flight department and provides you your licences for the cost of tuition then stay away. There is nothing this program will provide you that will put you ahead of the pack out in the industry. You already have a degree so if you are an aspiring airline pilot all you need now if flight time.

The way I see it, the program does offer potentially usefull training in areas such as Glass cockpit/gps technology and crew resource management that I would probably wouldn't get if i didn't enroll.

Don't get caught up in the sales pitches! The glass cockpit, gps, crew resource management is just fluff!! You can learn all of that in one day or probably an afternoon. There are different types of GPS and chances are the company you end up working for will have a different type so you will end up relearning it anyway. Besides it is not magic!! Glass cockpit is no big deal and there are lots of seminars and weekend courses available for crew resource management if you are so inclined.

Just my 2 cents and good luck on which ever way you decide!

[jpar84]

Jpar84 just finish your degree and head to the cheapest flight school and start training. Don't get caught up in the so called Aviation Programs that are nothing more than a Flying School piggybacking on to a College so they can grab your cash. Unless you are attending a true College Aviation Program that has their own flight department and provides you your licences for the cost of tuition then stay away. There is nothing this program will provide you that will put you ahead of the pack out in the industry. You already have a degree so if you are an aspiring airline pilot all you need now if flight time.

The way I see it, the program does offer potentially usefull training in areas such as Glass cockpit/gps technology and crew resource management that I would probably wouldn't get if i didn't enroll.

Don't get caught up in the sales pitches! The glass cockpit, gps, crew resource management is just fluff!! You can learn all of that in one day or probably an afternoon. There are different types of GPS and chances are the company you end up working for will have a different type so you will end up relearning it anyway. Besides it is not magic!! Glass cockpit is no big deal and there are lots of seminars and weekend courses available for crew resource management if you are so inclined.

Just my 2 cents and good luck on which ever way you decide!

Thanks for letting me know, I suspected this might be the case but wanted to confirm this with somebody who knows.

cheers
JP

[Barney]

Go check out Ottawa Aviation Services, they are next to OFC. Going over
there you may notice newer and more choice of aircraft. You may even save
yourself 20 grand if you train there. Aviation diploma is virtually useless.

[Cat Driver]

Aviation diploma is virtually useless.

Not to the people selling them.

[jpar84]

Go check out Ottawa Aviation Services, they are next to OFC. Going over
there you may notice newer and more choice of aircraft. You may even save
yourself 20 grand if you train there. Aviation diploma is virtually useless.

whaaaa???? Save 20 grand exageration or truth?? More choice of aircraft would definitely benefit my tall ass cuz there is no way in hell i'm ever flying a cessna 150 at 6'6".

thanks for the tip.

[Grey_Wolf]

More choice of aircraft would definitely benefit my tall ass cuz there is no way in hell i'm ever flying a cessna 150 at 6'6".

Heck I'm 6'5" and I've contorted into a 150, PA-12, and a Citabria. Granted it isn't the best fit, it's doable. Given the option, I'd take a 172 or even a 172RG; a little bit more elbow room, but still. You'll learn sooner that being tall, that you don't get into planes, you wear them! Right now, I'm flying a PC-12, and I'm still doing yoga moves to get in and out of it!

[jpar84]

More choice of aircraft would definitely benefit my tall ass cuz there is no way in hell i'm ever flying a cessna 150 at 6'6".

Heck I'm 6'5" and I've contorted into a 150, PA-12, and a Citabria. Granted it isn't the best fit, it's doable. Given the option, I'd take a 172 or even a 172RG; a little bit more elbow room, but still. You'll learn sooner that being tall, that you don't get into planes, you wear them! Right now, I'm flying a PC-12, and I'm still doing yoga moves to get in and out of it!

haha well i did an intro back about 5 years ago when i was 19, they tried to squeeze me into the 150 but I had to jam my knees clear over my head and turtle so they took me up in the 172. i suppose it will be one more hurdle for me to overcome which is why a school with an extensive fleet with several 172's may be important especially if i want to fly 4-5 times a week to complete my training within 1.5-2yrs. As far as i know the OFC only has 3 172s with 1 more on order. Once I get started though I may consult you for advice on my way if you don't mind. The last thing i want to do is set up shop in kinukijuk only to find out i don't fit in their plane.

cheers
JP

[Grey_Wolf]

Once I get started though I may consult you for advice on my way if you don't mind

No Problem! Ask any and all questions that come to mind! I'll do my best to help out, and if I can't find the answer, the forums may be a place to ask it. Granted using the search button for older posts may be a good point start, there are other regular posters here (in the Training Forum) that can definately guide you in the right direction.

[jpar84]

Once I get started though I may consult you for advice on my way if you don't mind

No Problem! Ask any and all questions that come to mind! I'll do my best to help out, and if I can't find the answer, the forums may be a place to ask it. Granted using the search button for older posts may be a good point start, there are other regular posters here (in the Training Forum) that can definately guide you in the right direction.

Thanks Greywolf

Cheers

[SAA340-600]

I am was the same situation as you. Done uni and all i needed were the licenses and the time. I chose algonquin and the OFC and so far so good. Although i must admit i am putting in more time with the flying related academics then the non-flying side of the program. I really like the ofc and the ambiance and i dont care if i fly a c150, c172 or katana cuz its all the same: training (and no i am not 6'6 but 6'1)....for me, what i fly will matter in 10 years from now. Follow the dream and dont look back.

cheers





"Flying is a function of how long the left seat guy can fly till he switch the 3 autopilots on"

[WTB:PPC]

Go check out Ottawa Aviation Services, they are next to OFC. Going over
there you may notice newer and more choice of aircraft. You may even save
yourself 20 grand if you train there. Aviation diploma is virtually useless.

Wow, another jealous OAS pilot! On behalf of all the people working hard and spending a lot of money to go from zero to Multi IFR CPL's / Instructors in 48 weeks I would like to personally thank you for another shameless OAS plug and your ignorant slam against the OFC, Algonquin and Aviation Diplomas (if you knew better you would keep these things separate-- you can still walk in and do a PPL, CPL, MULTI IFR or an INSTRUCTOR rating at the OFC without being involved with the College.)

I guess if I couldn't get a "worthless" aviation diploma (and was ignorant) I'd be talking the same trash.

To address your question jpar84-- I was in the same boat as you are currently in, last year, only I had completed my B.A. I took the aviation program because I had the resources and because I like structure. Self paced study is cool, it saves you money, but I wanted to be fully immersed in aviation for a year, and now after 48 Weeks I'm a Multi-endorsed CPL, INRAT is complete and I'm over halfway through my Instructor Rating.

So ask yourself two questions JPAR84-- 1) Do I need a structured program to help me meet my objectives? 2) Are the financial resources available for me to take this challenge on?

If you answer yes to both, then the Algonquin Aviation Studies Diploma is a good choice for you. IF you're from Ottawa you can opt to do a self-paced study like the others were talking about, which would save you 8 grand or so in tuition (I'm not sure with this guy came up with 20 grand savings figure, again, more ignorance / jealousy). Is eight grand worth it for a "worthless" aviation diploma? If the structure involved in attaining that diploma help you meet your career objectives in aviation then I would say yes.

Take your time and don't rush the decision bud. Only you know yourself well enough to decide what is truly right for a person in your situation.

I think Aviation related post-secondary educations likely look pretty good on the resume when, well, you're working in aviation after all...!

Cheers man and may you find your way in to the sky!

[Hedley]

No one cares where you get your licence.

They're all the same colour

And for someone that already has a FOUR YEAR DEGREE
from a university, spending the extra years getting an
aviation diploma from a community college instead of
flying, is not exactly the best choice.

[Cold_Lake_Hvy]

Sorry to say, at this stage in the game it doesnt matter the plane types you fly (theyre not heavies thats for sure) but you must get a good solid foundation and all airline pilots will tell you the T pack is where you want to be ( I for one). We all trained on cessnas and I hope the young ones out there are still doing the same.

[jpar84]

Thanks for all the replies everyone. For those who insist that tha algonquin program is a waste because it will takes years to complete, please be advised that it is a 16-month program which upon completion will get you an instructor or float rating and cpl, so it is not a long drawn out process, if anything it would be the quickest way for me to complete things. I definitely did not intend to start a fued, but at the same time I appretiate the input from both sides. At this point however, I have decided that working and flying on my own woud be the best approach as it will allow me to complete all my ratings fairly quickly and in the end I will have much less debt. Unfortunately I don't live in Ottawa but I may be moving there, depending on where i decide to do my training and where i decide to work. If I do go to Ottawa I will likely do my training at OFC or Ottawa Aviation services which I intend to visit next week.

I appretiate all the input I have gotten on this issue it has definitely been an influencing factor in my decision and will continue to be. I do have one more question, from the looks of things Ottawa Aviation services appears to be a cheaper way to do my flight training because it is not a club, my question is what are the advantages to belonging to a club and is it worth the extra cost?

Cheers
JP

[jpar84]

Sorry to say, at this stage in the game it doesnt matter the plane types you fly (theyre not heavies thats for sure) but you must get a good solid foundation and all airline pilots will tell you the T pack is where you want to be ( I for one). We all trained on cessnas and I hope the young ones out there are still doing the same.

Thanks for the input, my concern is based on the fact that I don't fit in the 150 however, this is why I would like to make sure I train somewhere that will allow me to train in the 172 despite the additional cost.

[tonyhunt]

Unfortunately I don't live in Ottawa but I may be moving there, depending on where i decide to do my training and where i decide to work. If I do go to Ottawa I will likely do my training at OFC or Ottawa Aviation services which I intend to visit next week.
I do have one more question, from the looks of things Ottawa Aviation services appears to be a cheaper way to do my flight training because it is not a club, my question is what are the advantages to belonging to a club and is it worth the extra cost?

If you visit Ottawa and want to compare all the flight training units, make sure you visit Carp Flying Academy at CYRP and Rockliffe Flying Club at CYRO.

CFA http://carpflyingacademyinc.com/

RFC http://www.rfc.ca/en/home/

Rockliffe gives good value if you want to train in a Cessna. It's the closest airport to downtown and training can be done on C-172s for $126/hr wet or $172/hr dual. Make an appointment to talk to Simon, CFI at Rockliffe.

[Barney]

It is not my intention to plug Ottawa Aviation Services and to trash the program at OFC.
Just simply offering another option which may he may not have been aware of. As
for the OFC program, im not sure of its overall value but it seems overpriced in my
opinion and to fly old 150s for a couse price of over 50 grand seems like a vaste
waste of money to me. No I dont work for OAS but I respect the way they do things
and many of their employees and students move on to very nice careers.

[jpar84]

Unfortunately I don't live in Ottawa but I may be moving there, depending on where i decide to do my training and where i decide to work. If I do go to Ottawa I will likely do my training at OFC or Ottawa Aviation services which I intend to visit next week.
I do have one more question, from the looks of things Ottawa Aviation services appears to be a cheaper way to do my flight training because it is not a club, my question is what are the advantages to belonging to a club and is it worth the extra cost?

If you visit Ottawa and want to compare all the flight training units, make sure you visit Carp Flying Academy at CYRP and Rockliffe Flying Club at CYRO.

CFA http://carpflyingacademyinc.com/

RFC http://www.rfc.ca/en/home/

Rockliffe gives good value if you want to train in a Cessna. It's the closest airport to downtown and training can be done on C-172s for $126/hr wet or $172/hr dual. Make an appointment to talk to Simon, CFI at Rockliffe.

Thanks a lot Tony! I never eally considered Rockliffe as a serious option figuring it was a more private club and expecting it would be more expensive if anything. Just goes to show how assuming makes an a@# out of well you know the saying. I have a lot of investigating to do in the next couple of weeks, its great to know there are som many options available to me in Ottawa.

cheers

[Cat Driver]

Sorry to say, at this stage in the game it doesnt matter the plane types you fly (theyre not heavies thats for sure) but you must get a good solid foundation and all airline pilots will tell you the T pack is where you want to be ( I for one). We all trained on cessnas and I hope the young ones out there are still doing the same.

WTF is " the T pack " ?

[Cold_Lake_Hvy]

WTF is " the T pack " ?

another rotary jockey I suspect.