I always wondered
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Flying Low
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Re: I always wondered
Would make an interesting discrimination case....
"The ability to ditch an airplane in the Hudson does not qualify a pilot for a pay raise. The ability to get the pilots, with this ability, to work for 30% or 40% pay cuts qualifies those in management for millions in bonuses."
Re: I always wondered
Tony,tonysoprano wrote:That was offered to ALPA. The senior guys didn't like bottom of the list. Never went to a vote, never discussed with the rest of the group. Just flat out rejected by those at the top.Start by sliding the Jazz seniority list under the AC list, and allow the Jazz drivers to bid for opening in the AC system by seniority.
Do you have any proof of that? Not that I'm questioning your version of facts as I have heard that story before, but no one on our side is talking-makes me a bit suspicious.
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Flying Low
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Re: I always wondered
All the senior guys at Jazz I have talked to don't seem to have a problem with bottom of the list provided there are "fences" to protect them in case of layoffs. Basically botl will never get approved at Jazz if a 1 year pilot at mainline can bump a 20 year pilot at Jazz during layoffs.
"The ability to ditch an airplane in the Hudson does not qualify a pilot for a pay raise. The ability to get the pilots, with this ability, to work for 30% or 40% pay cuts qualifies those in management for millions in bonuses."
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Dark Helmet
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Re: I always wondered
That sort of agreement was made by the GS commitee. A joint list with fences, and a cut off date. To my knowledge (mind you and I am sure there are a hundred variations to this storyFlying Low wrote:All the senior guys at Jazz I have talked to don't seem to have a problem with bottom of the list provided there are "fences" to protect them in case of layoffs. Basically botl will never get approved at Jazz if a 1 year pilot at mainline can bump a 20 year pilot at Jazz during layoffs.
) was that it was turned down by ACPA due to the fact that the company (ACE, AC...I don't know) would never go along with it............which I find it interesting because were we not doing this to protect ourselves from Management to begin with?Tony, I am also courious about your post. Not that I am doubting you, actually it is the first I heard of it
. ( I guess you heard version #58 and I must have heard version #59 
)Basically things were going really really well and then it all fell apart. Regardless of what actually happened, it is probably irrelevant now.
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Martin Tamme
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Re: I always wondered
Dark Helmet wrote:Regardless of what actually happened, it is probably irrelevant now.
It is irrelevant now, because the landscape has changed. Nevertheless, it wasn't the ACPA MEC that killed the deal - we were actually the ones pushing for it. The seniority list, along with fences, was already hypothetically agreed upon by both parties. Any ACPA member can find ACPA's MEC's decision in the February 2007 MEC Meeting Minutes.
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Martin Tamme
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Re: I always wondered
tonysoprano wrote:That was offered to ALPA. The senior guys didn't like bottom of the list. Never went to a vote, never discussed with the rest of the group. Just flat out rejected by those at the top.Start by sliding the Jazz seniority list under the AC list, and allow the Jazz drivers to bid for opening in the AC system by seniority.
For the record: No, that didn't happen.
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tonysoprano
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Re: I always wondered
I was told that ALPA didn't like it in the end and didn't put it out there for a vote with their membership.Nevertheless, it wasn't the ACPA MEC that killed the deal - we were actually the ones pushing for it. The seniority list, along with fences, was already hypothetically agreed upon by both parties. Any ACPA member can find ACPA's MEC's decision in the February 2007 MEC Meeting Minutes.
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Martin Tamme
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Re: I always wondered
tonysoprano wrote:I was told that ALPA didn't like it in the end and didn't put it out there for a vote with their membership.Nevertheless, it wasn't the ACPA MEC that killed the deal - we were actually the ones pushing for it. The seniority list, along with fences, was already hypothetically agreed upon by both parties. Any ACPA member can find ACPA's MEC's decision in the February 2007 MEC Meeting Minutes.
Maybe that is true, but it wasn't seniority related.
Re: I always wondered
Regardless of WHY the GS failed, it has failed and we will now have to live with whatever implications this may have for either side.
My guess is there will be a threat by AC to both the mother ship and baby ship with regards to flying. With rising oil costs and slowing economy, the company will have us right where they want us. Seperate and desperate to protect our flying.
Fasten your seatbelts ladies and gents as this could get bumpy!
My guess is there will be a threat by AC to both the mother ship and baby ship with regards to flying. With rising oil costs and slowing economy, the company will have us right where they want us. Seperate and desperate to protect our flying.
Fasten your seatbelts ladies and gents as this could get bumpy!
