GM to halt production at Oshawa truck plant

[Dex]

or $5.67 a US gallon

[Dex]

" Last year, China exported more than $12 billion in auto parts, up from less than $2 billion in 2002 — the majority to North America. The increase in exports has added to the problems plaguing North American suppliers. Most famously, Delphi, which is seeking to emerge from bankruptcy, has closed dozens of plants and moved some production overseas to become more competitive, including to China. "

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/26/busin ... chevy.html

[LH]

Everything is relative. If you make $25,000 per year you are encountering major problems now with the rise in fuel prices and that effect on the rising cost of food at the grocery store. Your own boat isn't an option unless it has oars and was handed down to you.......maybe.

The farther you go up the annual income scale, the less 'muttering' one will hear and at a certain point, you'll hear none.

Since Canada is self-sufficient in fuels, I'd like to know why she has to set her rates to those of OPEC, expecially if it is causing any kind of hardships at home. I'd also like to know why the Feds and the Provinces must get their same percentage of tax from wach liter of gas, no matter how low or high it moves. The oil companies are expected to take less and the operator who runs the gas outlet, but not the governments. What always makes me laugh like Hell is every time the price goes up some group is lobbying Ottawa or their Provincial government to investigate and put a stop to the rise..........not realizing that whenever the price rises both levels of government take-in even more tax revenue from a liter of fuels........and we expect them to curtail and sop that rise.

[. ._]

I've waited a long time to jump into this thread.

Ontario is on the verge of the new economy. Manufacturing is done in China. Period. All other manufacturing in the world can not compete, unless it serves high end, small niche markets. Ontario is changing from a manufacturing based economy to a technological and service based economy. Auto plant closures in Oshawa and Windsor are part of this.

Change is painful sometimes, but when the laid off autoworker in Oshawa retrains to do computer networking or some other skill, he or she will find that the steady day job with intellectual stimulation is better for health and family than a shift-work, monotonous brain-dead job. Sure the money will be a bit less, but statistically, the laid-off auto worker will live longer and healthier. Unless he goes out west to be a rig-pig, then God help him.

My $0.02.

-istp

[Sheila]

Good points istp, but basically, the whole country is going to be disturbed by this event. It seems like the employees had no warning. If GM is going under or out of business the employees should have known. GM has acted ruthless to lay off so many people, at once. Its not the employees fault they didn't stop making the wrong kinds of trucks! Like those big V8 trucks. They probably didn't sell very well.
If they are supposed to be downsizing, I don't believe they have done it, legally.

[valvelifter]

I've waited a long time to jump into this thread.

Ontario is on the verge of the new economy. Manufacturing is done in China. Period. All other manufacturing in the world can not compete, unless it serves high end, small niche markets. Ontario is changing from a manufacturing based economy to a technological and service based economy. Auto plant closures in Oshawa and Windsor are part of this.

Change is painful sometimes, but when the laid off autoworker in Oshawa retrains to do computer networking or some other skill, he or she will find that the steady day job with intellectual stimulation is better for health and family than a shift-work, monotonous brain-dead job. Sure the money will be a bit less, but statistically, the laid-off auto worker will live longer and healthier. Unless he goes out west to be a rig-pig, then God help him.

My $0.02.

-istp

Interesting take on this one. I kind of agree; Canada cannot compete with China in the manufacturing market. It is a matter of time before most manufacturing, even of the larger items still done here, is sent east. It will take a while to shift the labour market in the other way, and it will be painful for some.

But I would just hate to see my brand new car repainted after a recall is sent out stating that there is too much lead in the paint.

[EI-EIO]

spoke to my mother in Ireland last night, and gas there is is C$2.14/L (Eur1.36)

However that gas is 95 Octane, not 87 (Super is 97/98)

Gas taxes are higher in Europe but you also get better gas.

[North Shore]

istp, while I hear what you are saying, that's not much of an answer..what happens when the tech industry decides that Chinese computer techs will work for less than North American ones? Globalisation and liberalisation of trade works well if there's a level playing field of wages/benefits/cost of living - if not, then the workers and customers get the shaft, and the companies rake in the profits..

[2R]

The politics of fear .Big business using the threats of job losses to get more corporate welfare.

If they cannot compete in the new global market perhaps they do not deserve to exist and should close all their plants and we can just all buy imports as it would be cheaper for Canada than subsidizing underutilized manufacting plants .Rather than piecemeal plants making a tiny percentage of global vehicles .When some car plants in other parts of the world are stamping out hundreds of thousands of vehicles these companies are only making less than a hundred thousand vehicles .When you factor in millions of dollars in subsidies it would be cheaper for the government to buy cheap imports cars and give them away .Than continue to pretend to be a global presence in car manufacturing by subsidizing companies that have absolutly no intention of dominating the global markets from these plants .
When will the TATA Land rover be available ???

Does anyone remember McDonnel Douglas .The millions that the many Canadian Federal and Provincal governments poured into that factory in Toronto only to see it demolished and the work exported . Those corporate execs all got big bonus's every time the government gave the company money.And they still sold the workers down the river.

[valvelifter]

Just heard today that Chrysler will start production today of the Dodge Challenger, after a 35-year absence. This is a 400hp V-8 car.

GM will apparently restart production of the Camaro, another V-8 with power.

All this, in today's times???

Honestly, I would not want to work for a company that has absolutely no vision. This is suicide.

And then I am supposed to feel bad when a couple of thousand workers are laid off?? Would anyone feel bad for someone being laid off today from a company that does nothing but typewriters (by choice), when the competition is mass producing computers??

[2R]

http://www.amphijeep.biz/home.html

All off these vehicles are sold out !!!!so why does GM not make some under license ???

[valvelifter]

Yeah, I would buy one. I would do anything not to pay ~$2.50 to the Montreal mayor for crossing the bridge into the city

[Tubthumper]

I don't hear Toyota crying the blues, regardless of gas prices. Maybe it's something to do with the fact that these vehicles don't have that Union-quality build that has doomed the Big 3 from making a good vehicle.

[valvelifter]

Good point, Toyota and others make their share of gas-heavy vehicles. I think perception of the big 3 has a lot to do with it. Until they steer away from their muscle car past and head into a completely new direction, people will always associate them with Camaros and Challengers, while the Toyotas will be known for their Corollas and Camrys, not the Tundra.

[JakeYYZ]

The Canadian Auto Workers union says it's surprised that General Motors wants $1.5 million in compensation for the blockade at the car giant's Oshawa headquarters.

CAW Local 222 president Chris Buckley says the company's court action to have the blockade removed was expected. But Buckley says the $1.5 million sought in damages from the union local and five of its members - including himself - was a shock.

Link: http://www.torontosun.com/News/TorontoA ... 41431.html

Guess what, genius... actions have consequences.

[Dust Devil]

The best thing GM could do is close the plant immediately and just walk away.

[BigB]

The best thing GM could do is close the plant immediately and just walk away.

Much like Maple Leafs' closure in Edmonton in the late 90's. Sanity will prevail.

[MUSKEG]

I am puzzled by the perception out there that GM for some reason owes you a job, no matter that what you do is no longer necessary and costs the company money. GM is a privately owned company, that is responsible to it's shareholders. I am not anti union but when the union negitiates with strike and slowdowns as a lever then don't be surprised when businesses close the doors and move where people want to work, take pride in working efficiently, and don't demand sick days (when not sick) baby days, stress leave that needs to be taken at the lake, etc etc. This has little to do with gas guzzlers and a lot to do with workers who have become expendible due to automation. Machines don't complain, will work 24/7 and don't generate any employee complaints. An employer is just that, he doesn't owe you a thing other than what the law says he must. He is in business to make money and if employees are costing him money, GUESS WHAT.

[LH]

Time to wake up all you western folks. Take note of this and then chew on it. ALL western-made products, SPECIALLY vehicles of ANY type, have an extremely heavy import tarriff tax on them before entry into Japan.....and it's been that way for eons. North America has never had the same kind or size of tarriffs. Step #1.......let's level the playing field and put the same and as high tarrifs on Japanese and Chinese products as they put on North American goods and then see "how the cookie crumbles". Until then, don't anybody lambaste our products and how they can't compete until all the playing fields are equal. So we staart tomorrow AM by advising our Far East bretheren that whatever tarriffs they erect against our goods will be matched in kind by us on their imported goods when they reach our shores.

[Dex]

Are you suggesting we resort to Protectionism? Isn't an unregulated free market better? Wouldn't privatized Police forces be run more efficiently? Are you a communist?

[2R]

Quid pro quo
A level playing field best plant wins ? Never happen as the corporate thieves and corrupt white collar criminals that have stolen and robbed shareholders blind with absolute impunity would steal any gains that government would give the companies .Those white collar thieves would give themselve big pay raise's and bonus's if the government made it a level playing field.
GM will be finished once the thieves get their hands on the pension funds.Even the the RCMP pension fund was a victim of white collar crime as well .One of the major reasons for the run on the US dollar was the lack of confidence from the lack protection giving to the money markets from corporate thieves.Steal 700 millions and get house arrest .Now they are starting to take this crime seriously as roque traders can ruin a market overnight.

[CD]

Wasn't that already done? Oh no, wait ... it was the Tom Clancy novel Debt of Honor:

"The story starts with the passing of the "Trade Reform Act", enabling the United States to mirror the trade practices of the countries that it imports goods from. The bill is immediately used against Japanese goods, and results in an increasing backlog of imported products which begins to hurt the Japanese economy. Facing a perceived economic crisis, a group called Zaibatsu decides to seize Japan and take military action to safeguard the Japanese economy. Along with China and India, the plan involves curtailing the American presence in the Pacific in an effort to reestablish the Greater East Asia Co-Prosperity Sphere, which includes a possible Chinese-Japanese invasion of Siberia to secure its extensive resources.

Japan begins its part of the operation against the U.S. by launching torpedoes at two of the U.S. Navy’s Pacific Fleet carriers and two submarines at the conclusion of a joint U.S.-Japan naval exercise, destroying both submarines and crippling the carriers. Simultaneously, the Japanese cabal engineers the collapse of the American stock market (through the use of witting and unwitting personnel who electronically wipe out the computerized records of all transactions on Wall Street), leaving America at a huge economic disadvantage. Meanwhile, units of Japan's Self-Defense Forces occupy the Marianas Islands (as part of the grand plan involving China and India), specifically Saipan and Guam. The Zaibatsu, actually its leader Raizo Yamata, believe that these two elements, combined with the acquisition of Russian SS-19 ICBMs under the cover of the Japanese space program, will be enough to force the United States to negotiate a truce."

[xsbank]

You guys should do more reading:
1. The end of globalization is being forecast because some goods now cost more to ship than they cost.
2. Outsourcing all our manufacturing results in a loss of expertise in our country, leaving low-skilled or high-skilled labour jobs that most can't work at into their 60s like the manufacturing jobs.
3. We pay world prices for oil thanks largely to the Free Trade Act.
4. We export our raw materials untouched because we refuse to pay the higher labour costs, then when economies that have nothing to do with us or transport costs rise, are not purchased any more and sawmills, pulp mills, logging, fishing etc. collapse.
5. Tariff walls - we used to have tariff walls against the Japanese so they bought land in N.A. and set up their own plants made with the same robots that build them in Japan but now they can claim that they are exempt

[LH]

I operate on the K.I.S.S. Principle......"Keep It Simple Stupid". You put up tarriffs to protect your workers and industry at a certain percentage and I would like to do the exact same thing and for the same reasons. Your tarrifs end up being almost three times higher than my tarriffs against your country and I wonder why your goods and parts for them are cheaper than mine and I wonder why my exact same industry is suffering. Duh! Obviously, you were almost three times more interested in protecting your industry and workers than I was.

.............and "No"...it isn't being a Communist to want a level playing field when one begins to compete in anything. If you don't get it, then don't blame the opposition for having an unfair advantage because it's YOU who allowed it to happen dummie.

As result, if GM or North American industry are looking for some kind of sympathy for their predicterment they'll find it in the dictionnary between somewhere between "Shit" and "Syphillis".


.........and AGAIN.....sorry to shit on anyones ill-informed impressions, but Canadian oil is based on prior signed agreements that have been in place long before anything called a "Free Agreement" between Canada and anyone else. Don't like it.......file your complaint with Ottawa and OPEC HQ in Vienna, Austria........yeah Vienna! In the meantime, Canada produces enough oil and natural gas to supply itself and still export 50% of what the US needs. Live in eastern Canada and don't like using imported oil products? Then shit on the dummies that stopped building the pipeline bringing western oil to your refineries because yours comes to you courtesy of oil tankers from other countries........not because Canada doesn't ptoduce enough.