Passenger comfort??????????????????????

[Unknown]

Would like to share a experience I had on a AC flight from Santiago-Toronto about a week ago and see if any of you agree the crew handled the situation in a unprofessional and rude manner.

1. The lead Flight attendant started the flight off by making a announcement " lady's and gentlemen I regret to inform you that our personal entertainment system has a MAJOR PROBLEM and we are unable to figure out the electrical issue that is causing this problem"

I don't work for Air Canada but you would think that saying words like MAJOR PROBLEM and ELECTRICAL ISSUE might make the average fly er a little nervous about the 11hour flight they are about to take part in.

2. The attendant then informed us the reading lights were in-op so they would not be dimming the light for people to sleep.

There was maybe 3-4 people out of hundreds reading. Several people asked for the lights to be dimmed but were told no.

3. I'm not sure if it's usually permitted or not but the back 8 middle rows which has 3 seats across in every row were empty so some people were laying across the seats sleeping with there seat belts on. About 2 hours into the flight I picked up my pillow and blanket and went to lay in one of the empty rows. Before I could take the seat I was told from one of the attendants that the back 5 rows were reserved for the crew and there bags. The crew was using 2 rows for there shopping bags and hand bags and the last 3 were for them to sleep. About 1 hour later I noticed a few people asking for misc things like water and blankets when I overheard the only flight attendant complain saying that he was working the cabin by him self so he would get what he could for them.

I found it ridiculous that people that payed for these seats were not receiving even basic necessities like water and blankets because 3 flight attendants were wrapped up in blankets and went to sleep for 4-5 hours when they should have been working. The pilots have to work the entire flight why should these people get to sleep 5 hours out of a 11 hour flight?


Sorry about the rant but the crew involved should be embarrassed about there service and I'm sure things will never change it's always been a customer service nightmare at AC.

[KAFUFO]

If you feel that way take the other airline?

[Unknown]

If you feel that way take the other airline?

Good one! You must work for AC with a response like that. That exact response is why WestJet is Canada's airline. Air Canada gets buisness because people don't always have the option to fly with anyone else.

[Embraer190]

It's really unfortunate that you had such a poor experience with Air Canada. I had a similar experience on a flight from YOW-LHR, except not as bad. The FAs were older and they were utterly miserable (I'm not stereotyping). But, you have to realize that flight attendants are humans too and don't always handle problems in the best possible manner. Keep in mind that Air Canada has been laying off flight attendants and there is lots of bitterness around. As for the IFE problems, that is even more unfortunate, especially since your flight was 11 hours! Air Canada really puts emphasis on their "state-of-the-art" IFEs being part of the "superior Air Canada Experience," yet there have been having many problems with them. I'm sure it will get better as time goes on and they work the kinks out of the new system. But all it takes is one flight like you've described to lose customers. Hopefully your next experience is more positive, if there is a next time.

[Tim Tam]

If you feel that way take the other airline?

Good one! You must work for AC with a response like that. That exact response is why WestJet is Canada's airline. Air Canada gets buisness because people don't always have the option to fly with anyone else.

And I assume you fly for WS?

Look, we (WS) are good, but we are still not Canda's airline. Until we have 50.1% of Domestic traffic, can we say that. Until then, marketing ploy at best. We don't even fly to Santiago or deal with the crap (and there is a lot of it) that AC has to deal with, so why say such things????

[Brick Head]

Unknown,

Please cut and past your post to this address.

montie.brewer@aircanada.ca

Please include the date traveled.

Thanks.

[tonysoprano]

Unknown.
As an employee and 767 crew who does Santiago, I feel the need to apoligize. You as a customer deserve to rant. The truth is, this is not the normal way AC operates. Unfortunately, it sounds like you were being served by a crew that did not provide the standard service. This incident should never have happened. AC is fully responsible and has to pay the consequence(s). If this becomes the normal way, we are in big trouble. Fortunately, it is not the standard. There are some employees who will never know how how to say the appropriate things or provide the standard service even after years on the job. I assure you that on another day on the same route, you would not experience this.

[Unknown]

I would like to add that I agree it's not fair to stereotype all employees with this past experience, in Toronto I had a connecting flight to Edmonton and the 3 crew members were by far the best I have ever had on a flight. This flight from Santiago was just really a shock in what customer service has come to but who knows the crew could have been called back early or had some other circumstances which caused them to be fatigued.

[. .]

unknown: The issue with the lighting could have been an issue due to MEL restrictions. Once a certain number of lights are burnt out, they force all the lights on to ensure enough light in the cabin. I realize this may not have been apparent to you. I would also suggest making a complain about the flight. Simply listing the flight number and date could actually institute change.

[flapless]

Unkown, or anyone for that matter, Please take the time to send a message to the company.
The few that ruin your travel experience need to hear about it. The only way for the company to fix these issues is to know that they exist.
If you go to the website. On the top right corner is a keyword search, type "Customer Relations". The highlighted match will take you to the Customer Relations page. Click "send an email". This will take you to a form email that will ask for flt details.

Flapless

[ringworm]

Actually, the MEL dictates that individual lights may be inop provided sufficient lighting remains for cabin attendants to perform their duties.

I wonder what intensity of lighting qualifies as 'sufficient'?

I say dim the lights

rw

[BLZD1]

Unknown,

I am an AC pilot! Sorry for the bad customer service. PLEASE forward a complaint to the address above. AC will follow up on your complaint with the Service Director for that flight. I think your experience needs to be addressed!

Thanks

[767]

I prefer to have the lights dimmed because it makes it easier to look outside my window when its night time.

[E-Flyer]

But, you have to realize that flight attendants are humans too and don't always handle problems in the best possible manner. Keep in mind that Air Canada has been laying off flight attendants and there is lots of bitterness around.

Sorry I have to disagree with you on this one Embraer. In general, customer's shouldn't have to realize anything, except when it's those kinds blaming the pilot's for the thunderstorms.

The reason I say this is because non of the customers usually have experience in the aviation field, maybe a few, but most of them can't see the difference between a bus and a plane, except for that it travels faster.

When you say that F/A's are humans and don't always handle problems in the best manner, they don't belong at an airline or anywhere that requires customer service. I thought one big chunk of training F/A's is the whole reason of how to portray oneself during many kinds of scenarios.

Whether Air Canada is laying off F/A's or not, the customer shouldn't have to pay for the results of its bitterness, it's not their fault. If the F/A's are so bitter that they don't realize that it's these people on board causing him/her to have a job, then this F/A should really not be serving for any airline.

I just think that the crew shouldn't have any expectations of Customers, there are nearly 300 different people on board that plane, and they will portray 300 different opinions. Being able to deal with the PAX under must conditions should not be a problem, especially for the crew that is so experienced that they are retiring tomorrow. Don't get me wrong again, the crew isn't the pax's bitch, because many times there are unreasonable PAX. But I thought ACA's "superior" method of testing candidates for jobs weeded out bad individuals, thus they hire THE best of THE best. Guess there are flaws in the hiring system, but that's a totally different point.

But for the general sake of problems that you explained Unknown, the way that they handled the situation sucked !

Cheers

[It's about time]

Would like to share a experience I had on a AC flight from Santiago-Toronto about a week ago and see if any of you agree the crew handled the situation in a unprofessional and rude manner.

1. The lead Flight attendant started the flight off by making a announcement " lady's and gentlemen I regret to inform you that our personal entertainment system has a MAJOR PROBLEM and we are unable to figure out the electrical issue that is causing this problem"

I don't work for Air Canada but you would think that saying words like MAJOR PROBLEM and ELECTRICAL ISSUE might make the average fly er a little nervous about the 11hour flight they are about to take part in.

.

Bottomline...bad choice of words by the lead. Believe me the flight is not going anywhere if there's an electrical issue that could cause problems. Since there are so many variable out there it's impossible to have a phrase book for the leads to read from. Heck, I don't even say the T word when I'm talking to the folks....that's Thunderstorm.

As for the other points, very unfortunate....

[ettw]

3. I'm not sure if it's usually permitted or not but the back 8 middle rows which has 3 seats across in every row were empty so some people were laying across the seats sleeping with there seat belts on. About 2 hours into the flight I picked up my pillow and blanket and went to lay in one of the empty rows. Before I could take the seat I was told from one of the attendants that the back 5 rows were reserved for the crew and there bags. The crew was using 2 rows for there shopping bags and hand bags and the last 3 were for them to sleep. About 1 hour later I noticed a few people asking for misc things like water and blankets when I overheard the only flight attendant complain saying that he was working the cabin by him self so he would get what he could for them.

Hmmm....I would be wondering how long the layover was. LOL. I have a buddy who does this South American stuff with AC. He LOVES the layovers.....PARTY TILL THE LIGHTS COME ON seems to be his moto down there. LOL.

L.T.D.

Cheers,

ETTW

[E-Flyer]

3. I'm not sure if it's usually permitted or not but the back 8 middle rows which has 3 seats across in every row were empty so some people were laying across the seats sleeping with there seat belts on. About 2 hours into the flight I picked up my pillow and blanket and went to lay in one of the empty rows. Before I could take the seat I was told from one of the attendants that the back 5 rows were reserved for the crew and there bags. The crew was using 2 rows for there shopping bags and hand bags and the last 3 were for them to sleep. About 1 hour later I noticed a few people asking for misc things like water and blankets when I overheard the only flight attendant complain saying that he was working the cabin by him self so he would get what he could for them.

Hmmm....I would be wondering how long the layover was. LOL. I have a buddy who does this South American stuff with AC. He LOVES the layovers.....PARTY TILL THE LIGHTS COME ON seems to be his moto down there. LOL.

L.T.D.

Cheers,

ETTW

You mean he party's till the lights come on as in he uses his entire rest period ?

[complexintentions]

The event sounds unfortunate to say the least. But as someone who has never been a huge AC promoter....I have to say I am very, very impressed that there are no less than five AC employees not only apologizing on behalf of their employer, but offering an email address to try and get redress. I kept waiting for the excuses and the buck-passing and it never came. Take THAT you teal-tailed "owners"!

Nice job guys. Kind of deflates the tired argument of apathetic AC employees.

[tonysoprano]

edit

[tonysoprano]

...and now for something completely different:

How we win customer loyalty. After recently taking a rewards flight with another Star Alliance airline, a long-time customer wrote to tell us why she keeps coming back to Air Canada. The reason she is loyal to Air Canada, and a past Super Elite and Elite customer, she explains, is the degree of professionalism demonstrated by Air Canada and its staff. In Kelly H’s view, Air Canada is a cut above other airlines. To this customer, what matters is “the class and professionalism of Air Canada in the way they handle their customers from the time you check in to the time you leave the airport.” So, unless we don’t offer service to the destination of her choice, this customer will be booking only with Air Canada. Congratulations to all employees and especially the front-line employees! Let’s keep winning customer loyalty by taking care of our customers with professionalism and making them feel valued.

[wirez]

As an AC FA I am sorry to hear about your unfortunate experience. However I can tell you from the cabin crew point of view, it would have been 100% in their interest to dim the lights if they could. Not sure why they weren't. I wasn't there.

Also, the South American flights are notoriously short crewed, so unfortunate experiences such as yours are commonplace. The only resolution is to write a letter to the company to let them know how you feel about the service.

Lastly, it is not at all true that pilots work the entire 11 hours. They have a relief pilot for crew rest purposes, and cabin crew are entitled to rest as well.

Once again, apologies for your experience. Myself and my colleagues in this company do try our best to go out of our way to make the flying experience more enjoyable, so please let the few give you a bad impression of us all.

[Buceta]

Unknown,

You're absolutely right.
I've also had to endure those long 10-11 hour AC flights and what you went through on the way to Santiago is very common, if not always the case. I use those flights at least 6-10 times a year and it's been many years now. It never changes, it is always the same despicable service from the moment you check-in until you get off the airplane at destination.

As a customer, I always go out of my way not to fly Air Canada, but unfortunately sometimes this is not always possible, that's usually when the company I work for has this arranged for me.
The problem with the lights is something I never experienced but the lack of concern for what is good for the customer and the lack of common sense runs amoc.
This stuff about FA's blocking the last 4-5 rows of the airplane is absolutely pathetic. I understand if the flight is not full and they block the very last row for some napping during the flight. CP used to do that the whole time.
They are after all long flights and the seats on the last row usually dont recline anyways. I would also say that I prefer that the FA's take a nap or 2 during cruise because in case of any emergency on landing you will have a better rested crew.
But as it happens on every Air Canada flight, when you have to get off your seat at 0330am to get some water because FA's are nowhere to be seen and as you walk to the aft galley and you see 4 or 5 FAs sleeping on each row, you gotta wonder who is really running this mickey mouse show. This only adds to the aggravation that you most likely had with the rude check-in agent back at the departure airport.
It got to a point now that check-in agents don't even say "have a good trip" or any subtle smile. It's "gate 112, boarding at 930pm. Next!"
Two years ago I had the opportunity to take my infant son on one of those trips (we had to use AC). and being an infant he travelled on my lap for 11 hours all the way to EZE. There were 17 empty seats but no matter how much I asked for the check-in agent or the FA's during the flight, they just would not allow me have a seat with an open seat beside me for my son to sit.
Meanwhile there were 4 blocked rows with FA's sleeping on them.

If you travel with an infant, you can't take your stroller to the gate now. Tough. You just carry that baby all the way to your gate and keep him/her in your arms while you wait at the gate. You have to wait until your kid uses an unbrella stroller for you to be allowed to take it to the gate. No.no, Air Canada can not take your stroller from the door of the airplane and bring it downstairs to the lower belly. How incovinient this is, but hey, it's not about what is good for you, it's about what is good for them. This is in almost every aspect of their service.
On one of those 11 hour flights breakfast was served at 03am, 4 hours prior to arrival in YYZ. When I questioned the FA I was told that they were short staffed and they wanted to "get done with it". Classic.

The motto of this company should be "AC - where the customer is just an inconvenience"
I don't work for Westjet and hopefully I'll never have to, but being an alternative to Air Canada, I fly very often with them.
Take a Vancouver-Toronto flight for example and their FAs are on the aisle working the whole flight. This is not any Singapore Airlines by any means, but I get a friendly welcome from the moment I check-in until the end of the flight. Westjet Check-in and gate agents just do not give your boarding pass with a blank stare or looking at the monitor. This is so small, so simple but yet so important when dealing with the people who is paying for a service.
For those who might think this is a westjet X Ac, dont bother. Never mind Westjet, just compare to any other company - Sunwing, Air Transat, First Air, even Bearskin! It doesnt even have to be an airline, just any customer service provider (except for Bell, that's another lousy bunch) and there's only one word that comes to mind:
DEPLORABLE.

[Embraer190]

Unknown,

You're absolutely right.
I've also had to endure those long 10-11 hour AC flights and what you went through on the way to Santiago is very common, if not always the case. I use those flights at least 6-10 times a year and it's been many years now. It never changes, it is always the same despicable service from the moment you check-in until you get off the airplane at destination.

As a customer, I always go out of my way not to fly Air Canada, but unfortunately sometimes this is not always possible, that's usually when the company I work for has this arranged for me.
The problem with the lights is something I never experienced but the lack of concern for what is good for the customer and the lack of common sense runs amoc.
This stuff about FA's blocking the last 4-5 rows of the airplane is absolutely pathetic. I understand if the flight is not full and they block the very last row for some napping during the flight. CP used to do that the whole time.
They are after all long flights and the seats on the last row usually dont recline anyways. I would also say that I prefer that the FA's take a nap or 2 during cruise because in case of any emergency on landing you will have a better rested crew.
But as it happens on every Air Canada flight, when you have to get off your seat at 0330am to get some water because FA's are nowhere to be seen and as you walk to the aft galley and you see 4 or 5 FAs sleeping on each row, you gotta wonder who is really running this mickey mouse show. This only adds to the aggravation that you most likely had with the rude check-in agent back at the departure airport.
It got to a point now that check-in agents don't even say "have a good trip" or any subtle smile. It's "gate 112, boarding at 930pm. Next!"
Two years ago I had the opportunity to take my infant son on one of those trips (we had to use AC). and being an infant he travelled on my lap for 11 hours all the way to EZE. There were 17 empty seats but no matter how much I asked for the check-in agent or the FA's during the flight, they just would not allow me have a seat with an open seat beside me for my son to sit.
Meanwhile there were 4 blocked rows with FA's sleeping on them.

If you travel with an infant, you can't take your stroller to the gate now. Tough. You just carry that baby all the way to your gate and keep him/her in your arms while you wait at the gate. You have to wait until your kid uses an unbrella stroller for you to be allowed to take it to the gate. No.no, Air Canada can not take your stroller from the door of the airplane and bring it downstairs to the lower belly. How incovinient this is, but hey, it's not about what is good for you, it's about what is good for them. This is in almost every aspect of their service.
On one of those 11 hour flights breakfast was served at 03am, 4 hours prior to arrival in YYZ. When I questioned the FA I was told that they were short staffed and they wanted to "get done with it". Classic.

The motto of this company should be "AC - where the customer is just an inconvenience"
I don't work for Westjet and hopefully I'll never have to, but being an alternative to Air Canada, I fly very often with them.
Take a Vancouver-Toronto flight for example and their FAs are on the aisle working the whole flight. This is not any Singapore Airlines by any means, but I get a friendly welcome from the moment I check-in until the end of the flight. Westjet Check-in and gate agents just do not give your boarding pass with a blank stare or looking at the monitor. This is so small, so simple but yet so important when dealing with the people who is paying for a service.
For those who might think this is a westjet X Ac, dont bother. Never mind Westjet, just compare to any other company - Sunwing, Air Transat, First Air, even Bearskin! It doesnt even have to be an airline, just any customer service provider (except for Bell, that's another lousy bunch) and there's only one word that comes to mind:
DEPLORABLE.

What you're describing is about right, especially on longhaul flights. It seems that the FAs with higher seniority are on the bigger planes with long flights while the FAs with lower seniority are on the smaller planes with shorter legs. This makes long trips hell because you have 5-6 old bag flight attendants who are crabby for 10-11 hours. This is (obviously) because of all the Air Canada shit they've had to deal with over their long careers. They have simply lost all passion for their job and customer service. Have you taken the Embraer lately? It seems like all the newer, friendlier, bubblier FAs are on those planes, it is such a treat! I was in J class from YEG to YYZ this summer and I was treated like absolute gold. It was an amazing experience. It is unfortunate that the issue of having crusty FAs on longhaul flights is a recurring problem, but that's the unfortunate part about air travel; sometimes you win and sometimes you lose. Hope your next experience is more positive.

[Four1oh]

For those who might think this is a westjet X Ac, dont bother. Never mind Westjet, just compare to any other company - Sunwing, Air Transat, First Air, even Bearskin! It doesnt even have to be an airline, just any customer service provider (except for Bell, that's another lousy bunch) and there's only one word that comes to mind:
DEPLORABLE.

You can add Sears to your list too. What a gong show they've turned into. I recommend going elsewhere to buy your appliances.

[tonysoprano]

You can add Sears to your list too. What a gong show they've turned into. I recommend going elsewhere to buy your appliances.

Our new fridge delivery from Sears took three attempts to get it right. Never again? Well, who knows? Service is a lost art. The bigger companies seem to be less consistent. I have a really tough time comunicating with agents at my cable company. But overall I'll stick with them. A sincere smile and thank you are not my priority. The succesful outcome of a service is judged on so much more. The old farts use to be friendly and competent. Now they are just old farts. But of course I shouldn't generalize. I work with many old farts in our indusrty and many still have an edge over the young ones. At times it seems the younger ones are better. The bigger the company, the more diverse the culture. The routes I do seem to get good reviews from our customers. I stand at the door when deplaning to say thanks and witness very few and infrequent frowns and I get more thank yous than I can give. The more frequent complaints deal with aircraft issues rather than people issues. Pros and cons are a fact of life.