Domestic vs. Foreign

[Just another canuck]

If you could go out and buy a brand new vehicle right now... or actually, one car and one truck, what would they be? And as far as cars go, I don't mean Ferrari's and Lambo's...

Personally, I would have a Toyota Tundra and VW Jetta TDI. I would have said Passat, but it doesn't currently come in the TDI model.

[Cat Driver]

I spent some time driving all the popular small SUV's and bought the Suzuki SX4, it is the best all around vehicle I have ever owned.

[Driving Rain]

http://www.investandtradeontario.com/so ... 2pager.asp

It appears that Ontario is the number one manufacture of cars and trucks in North America.
That's not a very good place to be at this moment in time. When the car manufactures go down the crapper so does a large portion of Canada. Steven Harpers lieutenant and finance minister Jimbo Flagherty has publicly stated that he would advise foreign investors to invest anywhere in Canada except Ontario. What I find strangest is that his home riding is Oshawa.

I drive a North American built VW Jetta TDI and 4x4 Ford Ranger light truck. I like them both they've been very reliable.




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Ontario's Auto Industry
Driving the future



Cars and trucks are BIG business in Ontario

Our auto industry:
produces more vehicles than any other North American jurisdiction—over 2.6 million in 2005

manufactures one in six vehicles built in North America

exports 85% of all vehicles to the U.S. and countries around the world.

North America’s Top Vehicle Manufacturer Jurisdictions
State/Province 2005 Light Vehicle Production
1 Ontario 2,624,212
2 Michigan 2,476,123
3 Ohio 1,795,626
4 Missouri 1,147,896
5 Kentucky 1,109,480
6 Indiana 772,858
7 Tennessee 692,966
8 Alabama 479,465
9 Illinois 455,262
10 California 417,369


Source: Ward’s AutoInfoBank, Feb. 6, 2006


People Powered
43% of our auto manufacturing employees have completed their post-secondary education versus 27% in the U.S.

Industry-focused education produces a steady supply of workers.

Ontario autoworkers have helped capture 17 of the 49 North/ South American Awards for plant quality awarded by J.D. Power and Associates, including Gold and Silver in 2006.

The Place to be for R&D

Ontario’s auto industry is a leader in materials and manufacturing, powertrain, fuels and emissions, design processes, intelligent systems and sensors, photonics and intelligent highway systems.

Ontario has one of the most generous R&D tax credit programs in the world:

the after-tax cost of a $100 R&D expenditure is less than $41

R&D deductions can be carried forward indefinitely

more costs qualify for R&D tax credits in Ontario.

High Quality R&D for less
Country Rating Canada’s R&D Tax Treatment
Italy 129
Germany 129
France 123
U.K. 120
Japan 116
U.S. 115
Canada 100


Source: Warda, Jacek, Rating Canada’s R&D Tax Treatment, A 2003 Update.




Unparalleled Market Access

NAFTA (the North American Free Trade Agreement) gives Ontario auto manufacturers access to a market that is huge (420 million people) and affluent ($13.8+ trillion GDP) and where products move freely across borders.

Our auto industry is concentrated in southwestern Ontario — close to the American border for easy market access.

Our transportation infrastructure is extensive, sophisticated and integrated with the U.S.


An Ideal Investment Climate

In their forecast of the global business environment through to 2009, the Economist Intelligence Unit (EIU) ranked Canada as one of the best countries in the world to do business, thanks to our openness for foreign trade and capital, high-quality infrastructure and opportunities within the North American marketplace.

Ontario is cost-competitive—in fact, the province offers auto parts makers a 5% cost saving when compared to U.S. counterparts according to KPMG’s Competitive Alternatives 2006.

The province’s $500 million (Cdn) Ontario Automotive Investment Strategy supports investment in innovative technologies, enhanced skills training and public infrastructure. To date, it’s leveraged $6+ billion in capital investment by major auto producers.

Our regulatory systems are streamlined, with business start-ups requiring just two simple steps, compared to as many 20 in other industrialized countries.

We fast-track immigration for key employees, delivering work visas within days of application.

Look at who’s investing in Ontario.

International Truck and Engine, a leading producer of heavy trucks, recently invested $235+ million in Ontario to modernize its Chatham facility and establish an R&D centre to prototype and test leading-edge technologies for the next generation of heavy trucks.

Bloomsburg, PA-based Magee Rieter, which supplies fabricated carpet and acoustical floor systems, established its first satellite facility in London, Ontario in 2004. Why Ontario? Magee Rieter says it’s because of the province’s skilled and available workforce, proximity to customers and similar business culture to Bloomsburg, PA.

Transform Automotive, headquartered in Sterling Heights, MI, opened its first Canadian facility in London, Ontario in 2005. The advanced metal-forming supplier, which specializes in transmission components, cited the city’s highly educated workforce, existing infrastructure and geographic location in the heart of the North American auto industry as the main reasons for choosing Ontario.


We can help
Call: 1-800-819-8701 (North America)
00-800-46-68-27-46 (U.K. and Europe)

[BoostedNihilist]

I have never owned a new car. However, in my market if I were to go out and buy a new vehicle tomorrow it would be a 4x4 f-350.

If I had to buy a brand new car? I would probably go with a toyota corolla.

Now, If I had to buy a used car and a used truck, I would buy a 1984 toyota sr5 tercel, and a 199? ford f-150.

For those who buy that VW quality line might I suggest a read through www.myvwlemon.com

[Changes in Latitudes]

I am just doing some research, you Toyota and Honda guys, how many pairs of crocs do you own and do you wear them with socks?

[Driving Rain]

For those who buy that VW quality line might I suggest a read through

VR6 VW's are crap so is the 2.0 4 banger in the City Jetta and City Golf. Their new 5 cylinder is proving to be a piece of crap also. The TDI is a completely different animal.
I've put 400,000 km on mine since I bought it brand new April Fools day 2000. I joined the TDI club found out what was ureliable about the TDI's and provided my own fixes without being held up by the Stealership. As soon as my warranty period was through I've never been back to them unless it was a re-call item to be replaced for free.

[Just another canuck]

Yeah, I guess I don't know much about the gas-powered V-dub's but I owned a Golf TDI, which I ended up selling to my folks. I loved it and so did they. Drove from YK to T Bay for 200 bucks and like Driving Rain mentioned... keep up with that preventative mx. and things will all right.

My folks loved that car so much they bought brand new and now have a brand new VW Jetta TDI, which is absolute gem. The mileage isn't as good as that Golf, but still... very nice. More power as well. Also, like mentioned below, it's not uncommon at all to see those diesels driving around with a half million km's on them. I'll never go back to gas, unless I buy a real sports car or some shit.

As far as the trucks go... I think the F-350 was mentioned. If I needed a full size truck, that's definitely what I'd go with I guess. But the Tacoma and Tundra are very nice for mid and full size. Pricy but worth the extra cash I think. Once they come out with 1 ton, I'm sure it'll start to dominate the market just like they're doing with the other models.

[iflyforpie]

I don't ever plan on buying a brand new vehicle ever again but if I was forced at gun point it would come either from the Honda or Toyota factory.

The quality difference between domestics and imports is not as great as most people would make you believe, especially since many of the parts are made by common third party sources and most final assembly is here in North America anyways.

Domestics get a bad rap because anybody with a heartbeat and a meager pay check can drive one off the lot when they don't have the financial means to take proper care of the vehicle. Also somebody who has forked over $10-$20000 more for a quality import than an equivalent domestic isn't going to tell the world the problems they are having with it.

The reason I chose a Honda or Toyota is because they are the vehicles will lose the least value in depreciation. There are many products that meet or even exceed the 'Big Two's' quality and have better warrenties (ie, Hyundai) but are still shunned because everybody remembers the crappy cars they made in the 80s and 90s. And in the mean time Toyota, Honda, and even Mercedes Benz have had more than their share of recalls and QC problems in recent years.

My Volkswagen experience was disappointing. It was a great car (Mk 3 GTI), but not worth the extra money spent and certainly not outstanding in the quality department.

[Hedley]

Honda or Toyota is because they are the vehicles will lose the least value in depreciation

And why is that? Because of their higher quality and lower
maintenance costs.

I'm pretty sure that "Honda" means "maintenance is optional"
in Japanese

You can do horrible things to a Honda and Toyota and get
away with it - like not changing the oil, filter or spark plugs
for 250,000km - that would kill a domestic.

[iflyforpie]

You can do horrible things to a Honda and Toyota and get
away with it - like not changing the oil, filter or spark plugs
for 250,000km - that would kill a domestic.

That would kill pretty much any car. And even if it didn't, would you rather buy the poorly maintained import or the well maintained domestic?

A relative of mine bought a Toyota Camry that was a lease return where someone had done just that, except it had only 100,000km on it. Had to replace the engine. Another relative of mine bought a Toyota Avalon brand new and has had tons of electrical problems with it.

Toyota and Honda build great vehicles, but I am under no illusion that they are perfect. And you've got to admit that if you are looking at full-size pickups, Honda's pretty little Ridgeline is better suited for hauling groceries and the Tundra can only compete with the domestic half-tons, which are great in their own right.

P.S. My next newish vehicle purchase is going to be a Honda CR-V.

[Just another canuck]

Tundra can only compete with the domestic half-tons, which are great in their own right.

I think it's fair to say that the Tundra is superior to the the GMC, Ford and Chevy half-tons. And of course it can only compete with half-tons, that's what it is. When only the Tacoma was around, you wouldn't throw it in to compete with the half-ton market. That's why they came out with the Tundra. And when they come out with a 3/4 and 1 ton, they'll eventually dominate as well.

As far as Honda goes, very nice vehicles... I just have a personal problem with them. I think it's all the Civics out there and the people who drive them.

[mantogasrsrwy]

I just have a personal problem with them. I think it's all the Civics out there and the people who drive them.

That's hilarious because I've always felt the same way about VW drivers.

[Just another canuck]

Weird...

[BibleMonkey]

Steam car all the way... (:
http://www.damninteresting.com/?p=669

[Doc]

I have no need for a half ton. When I need one, I rent it.

As for a new car. One word....SUBARU. Full time 4X4. More torque than anything in it's class. Will make it up my driveway. Every time. I live at the base of the Matterhorn! Did I mention it's full time 4X4?

[Just another canuck]

SUBARU. Full time 4X4

They are sweet little cars. I was test driving them in Calgary before I bought my Golf TDI. I was more interested in fuel economy at the time otherwise I may have bought the Subaru.

[Sabrea]

I've not long gotten a Mitsubishi Lancer (the 2 wheel drive Evo) on Mitsubishi's past performance. An Evo or Subaru would be the choice if I had the unlimited budget (and my wifes permission) for the drivability of the all wheel drive. The reliabilty seems to be right up there for both which is a plus since the cars are very modular (remove engine to change drive belt). For the pick up I'd have the Australian built Ford Falcon utility (true 1 tonne, 450hp 5.7 litre V8 from the floor) or the Holden (read GM here) utility (basically the same as above). They ride like cars and haul like trucks, and that makes bikes, jet ski's and sleds easier to ramp onto the back.

[Czar]

For all you TDI drivers, I know all the positives such as better engine reliability and gas mileage.
I've always debated the advantage of buying a diesel jetta vs gas jetta. The price difference alone ($2000-3000) means you had to
own the car for at least 100,000kms just to pay for the difference.

However, I've noticed that diesel is much more expensive than regular gas in my area (Montreal). As much as 30% higher.
Seems to me that the higher price for diesel eliminates the better gas mileage.

Your thoughts?

[Just another canuck]

Even with the price difference in fuel, you still save. And diesel was usually closer to the same price of gas in the past. The gap started to widen more recently.

Anyway, the newer TDI's aren't quite as good as the older ones on fuel either. They burn cleaner I guess but the mileage isn't as good. I would typically get 1200 km on a single tank of diesel in the summer. The gas would do half that maybe?? Cost me 200 bucks to drive from YZF to YQT.

Should also mention the resale value is way higher and you can drive them twice as long.

[Guido]

I note that nobody is cheering for Kia...

But seriously, I drive a Mazda, and I love the thing. It's expensive when things break, but that doesn't happen to often.

[C-GGGQ]

2.0 4 banger in the City Jetta and City Golf

Mines been nothing but reliable

One word....SUBARU

Grandfather had a legacy forever kept getting new ones, amazing cars. I got a used Impreza and it was the worst lemon I've ever seen. Overall I agree subarus are amazing vehicles but every car maker can have its fair share of crap.

For a new car I'd have to go with a new Honda or Subaru (I hate toyotas, possibly effected by the shadiest dealer in the world being the local toyota dealer in my home town) New truck would be a Ford.

[BoostedNihilist]

I think it's fair to say that the Tundra is superior to the the GMC, Ford and Chevy half-tons.

Based on what? the lemonaid guide? LOL. There is a reason people who live in the bush don't drive tacomas and it aint because theyre more expensive.

You can beat a domestic truck harder, and you can fix it cheaper, and when you need a part in an emergency (like a tire in the bush) chances are the guy coming up the road behind you has one that will fit.

Next to the ridgeline (which is a joke) the toyota tundra is the definitive ladymans truck.

If I was in the light truck market I would definitely consider a tacoma, suv, a 4runner but calling a tundra 'superior' to domestic heavy iron has got to be the dumbest thing I have read today.

[BoostedNihilist]

IMO subaru is a company that really gets it. If you look closely at the underbody of a subaru you will not find any brake lines. It is because they are run on the interior of the car. Pretty cool, can't get punctured when you're rallying the piss out of it. Sitting in a subaru is a nice feeling. It is like a blend of toyota blue and honda comfort. I actually have a WRX in the shop right now we're doing a little bit of 'upgrading' on and the more I work with the car the more I like it.
WHenever I start the WRX in the shop I can't help myself from reaching for the mixture and carb heat knobs.

Every time someone brings me a vw I think to myself "What kind of stupid german electrical glitch is going to happen now." shortly followed by "I wonder how long this shit is going to take to fix" They have gotten better but man, what a retarded system. It is like they've subcontracted the worst of the lucas engineers and let them go wild with bosch crap and an unlimited wire budget.

[Zwartboy]

I really like the Subaru WRX, probably because it's got the same cylinder configuration of most airplanes. They also have a good reputation and would be very entertaining to drive year round. Another car that has my eye is the Saturn Solstice/Saturn Sky, the 2.0L turbo motors just seem exciting in a small car like that. They're not exactly the most practical vehicle though.

As far as trucks go, Dodge with their Cummins diesel is by far the best diesel. I worked with a guy who has 800 000km on his, most of it towing around office trailers. If you want the best gas truck, GM has done an incredable amount of work on their small block V8. I drove a Chevy 2500 with the 6.0L, and it could handle all the weight you could throw on the trailer. Not the greatest fuel economy, but I wasn't expecting Prius fuel burn when towing 10 000lbs of construction equipment.

[Just another canuck]

Well I am certainly no car mechanic. I don't fix vehicles myself nor do I want to... not right now anyway.

My opinion comes from reading, but also the people that have owned GMC's, Chevy's, Dodge, etc. that have switched over. I've never driven a Tundra and my old man has a GMC, which I love. However, I've driven the Tacoma which is way nicer than the Dakota I drove before. A couple of my friends love their Tundra... also switched over from GM and Ford. And they take them in the bush all time.

In fact, I like the Nissan as well. Just don't think I'd buy a domestic half-ton... I like the competition better. And when they come out with 3/4 and 1 tons, I'll probably favour those as well.

So Boosted, I apologize for stating a preference in vehicle manufacturers. It was pretty stupid. I only hope I didn't ruin your day.