Ne pas des Francias!!

[SinkRate]

Just wondering if anyone else has had the little problem of communication when flying in northern or eastern Quebec?
I ll start by saying I dont mind living in a so-called bi-lingual country but I think the standard for aviation should be in English. I was recently in Northern Quebec at an un-controlled airport trying to get my clearance so I could be on my way.
There was a Nava-hoe also trying to do the same thing. Long story short it was a game of Yatzee as to who was doing what in the taxi and departure phases of the flight. Not safe in my opinion...
Im not going into it much more but why not speak english if you can? I repeatedly said "ne pas de francias" over the radio
( yes im aware thats french lol) and was ignored. We are both aiming for the same thing as pilots...Safety and Efficiency!
Lets work together.
Thats it
Thanx for your ears!
Sink

[Captain X]

+1

I know this has been discussed before however,

I wonder if in the USA they have Jep plates / charts in Spanish? Why we have CFS's and CAP's in French boggles the mind. I know its Canada and we have 2 official languages but really.

[Donald]

+1

and

[Buzz Lightyear]

This subject has already been beaten to death many times....when you fly in Quebec and make your calls in English people will most of the time reply in English, especially if they think there may be a conflict.

I'm sorry to say but general aviation in France is in French, in Spain in Spanish, in Italy in Italian, get my point?

This being said I very much understand the frustration of not understanding what's going on around you, especially while flying. But as you've all said...it's a bilingual country so start working on your French, women love it!

B.

[warner]

Il est peu differente au Quebec, excusez-moi, they do things just the way they want to there, it's different, I believe all federal airports have to respond to you in the language they are addressed in, I work back east quite often and it can be interesting, the culture and all that, most people can speak some english but whether they choose to or not is the question, sometimes a " je ne parle pas francais " off the get go will usually work.

[Just another canuck]

I'm sorry to say but general aviation in France is in French, in Spain in Spanish, in Italy in Italian, get my point?

I don't think that's true at all... and that's why I find it strange that it is accepted here so easily. Not calling you a liar Buzz, but I did work with a couple Italian dudes... they never mentioned that. And I do know that GA in Indonesia is in English... nothing else.

Not a big deal to me anyway, but I have heard many horror stories where the language thing almost turned into a disaster.

[canwhitewolf]

oh I dunno , i was flying into sardinia one time on a GCA radar precision approach with terrible weather and minimum visibility and some where out on the approach the controller said..


ona da course ona da glida patha.. donta toucha nuttin!

so i complied and "didnt touch nothing" I just maintained last heading and descent rate

never heard from him again until we broke out at minimums

used up my last nerve on that one

heinz57 language sometimes works

[MichaelP]

In France it helped to understand some french especially on 'frequence club' 123.5.
Paris Information would never respond to me in English.
But most airports had reasonable English.
The French Military on the other hand spoke very clear and concise English and were always very helpful.

The Germans... All spoke English and mostly well.
But depending on where you were they could either be very very friendly (Munich and Augsburg) or very arrogant (Stuttgart)...

In Thailand they all operate in English, but with "Sawasdee krup" or "Sawasdee ka" politely added.
Some people have a problem with the Thai accent or any foreign accent and complain about it.
I think of this as being similar to getting attuned to the radio in the first place... We all begin with incomprehension and learn to understand the RT through training. So give ATC a little slack and if necessary ask for what you want in a different way.

Quebec is different. Even I have a difficult time with the loss of Canadian freedoms in the name of a distinct society.
I was there in the early 70's when English law was being revoked and rights were being taken away from people.
If Quebec french was anything like the french we learned in high school in Quebec then it wouldn't be a problem.
To me it sounds like a dutch person speaking french, it's hard to listen to.

[jeta1]

comment removed - time expired

[canwhitewolf]

english is the universally accepted language of aviation,

one language is needed, thats the way it has to be for safety in the air and on the ground

http://www.flightspeak.co.uk/ICAO_English.htm

[Chuck Ellsworth]

When Quebec separates on the next vote this issue will finally be put behind us and we can get on with life.

[Rudder Bug]

Ne pas des Francias!!Posted: Wed Feb 25, 2009 5:07 pm

That is not french SinkRate. You should say "Je ne parle pas français" ( I don't speak french ). It's easy, anybody can say that.

Can't you make a little effort and say it right? Wouldn't you think learning at least the basics of a second language could be convenient if you eventually wished to fly internationally?

[SinkRate]

Fair enough Rudder Bug you have a valid point...I should make an effort to learn a bit more it would only help. In my defence the HO driver didnt speak any english either(whether or not he could have I dont know?) Im not pointing fingers at either side the point is the failure of communication because of the rules.
For future reference......Je ne parle pas francais.
Got it.....

Jet, this wasnt opened to spread hate or negativity about anyone. This was a valid safety concern I experienced first hand because of a language gap.

[orbit]

Buzz Lightyear wrote:
I'm sorry to say but general aviation in France is in French, in Spain in Spanish, in Italy in Italian, get my point?



I don't think that's true at all... and that's why I find it strange that it is accepted here so easily. Not calling you a liar Buzz, but I did work with a couple Italian dudes... they never mentioned that. And I do know that GA in Indonesia is in English... nothing else.

[

u]I don't think that's true at all[/u]

is the right answere I was in the center seat in Lufthansa before the ban and it was all in english and most of europe is that way,,english is the language,,I also heard same from the well travelled 'Blimp" pilots from U.S. in europe,,they can get english...not a big deal it is the major language of commerce.
I think they ought to think safety 1st ,,,,I have french and other european roots(and speak 3 languages) and still think in flying for the sake of safety as per ICAO we ought to all walk on the same pace!
Keep it all English,,if you want it all another language fine but make it UNANIMOUS!

[Rudder Bug]

For future reference......Je ne parle pas francais.

Hahaha you got it perfect, not even the slightest accent!

[SinkRate]

lol

[scopiton]

who cares, spanglish or frenglish, just speak the langage you've been risen with and you'll have an answer
ATC is here to save your ass and it's bilingual
use it...

[Donald]

who cares, spanglish or frenglish, just speak the langage you've been risen with and you'll have an answer
ATC is here to save your ass and it's bilingual
use it...

Sure...until you make a position report on 126.7 referencing a nearby landmark, and you hear: "bla bla bla bla same landmark bla bla bla".

Now what?

[navajo]

I fully agree that the commercial pilots shall speak english in Quebec when there is some english dudes around them, it should be part of the commercial pilot training. Unfortunately, I don't think we can count on TC to improve the new pilots training! I still cannot believe you can call yourself an airline pilot after 2 written exams and 2 years of experience.... It's harder and longer to be a professional electrician than to hold an ATPL!
Anyway, let's remember that the private pilot who don't speak a word of English in Quebec (which is not a bilingual province) should have the same right to fly and have fun with his airplane than a bilingual private pilot. It's just hard to understand when english is your first language and you've never been to Quebec (elsewhere than Montreal of course!) but I don't think it's a negotiable right.

[MichaelP]

Even the Chinese are complying with ICAO regulations.
Can a province separate and become a Moon country distinct from this planet?

worry about fertilizing your lawn with Guinness this coming Spring instead.

This is important.
NOTAM: 031709 St Patrick's day will be celebrated 17th March until 23:59 local time.
Please avoid too much Blarney!
Ishka baha and Guinness should be consumed, while Avgas/Avtur stays in the aeroplane (or helicopter) in the hangar!

[nookie201]

I've flown into Mexico a few times, I'd almost learn spanish to avoid the confusion next time, Also was in QC last week, IFR was no problem at all controllers were proficient in English and clear as can be.

What about ICAO phrasing?

-G

[rd1331]

Quebec (which is not a bilingual province)

Guess what....CANADA IS BILINGUAL. Quebec is not its own country, it is a province of CANADA. Which makes it a BILINGUAL PROVINCE. If Quebec wants to be its own country perfect, then we can make Canada a Non-Bilingual country and save us a lot of money. You are part of Canada, and Canada is Bilingual, so Quebec is Bilingual.

I'm sorry to say but general aviation in France is in French, in Spain in Spanish, in Italy in Italian, get my point?

Well officially have no idea what you talking about now. If you actually flew in countries outside Canada you would realize that is completely not true. As other people have pointed out, and from myself who has flown in multiple countries where English isn't even a national language, but English was spoken on the radio. Yes there was some, small amount, of there own language sometimes, but as soon as someone spoke English everyone switched gears and spoke English.

So stop trying to say that you can do it in Quebec because the rest of the world does it, because they don't. The ICAO language is English, and not because political reasons, but because as a group of Internation Countries, they decided that the English language would be the best International Language.

[Cap'n P8]

Can't speak for overseas, but if you go down to central america you will hear a hell of a lot more spanish on the radio than english, and that includes general aviation and commercial operators. You will also be lucky if you can understand what anyone is saying when they actually do try to speak english.

[Cat Driver]

I spent the last ten or so years flying in Europe and most of the countries speak English for air traffic control.

Some of the smaller countries sometimes have some poor english speaking controllers but using ICAO phraseology generally keeps things reasonably easy to communicate effectively.

[AuxBatOn]

Guess what....CANADA IS BILINGUAL. Quebec is not its own country, it is a province of CANADA. Which makes it a BILINGUAL PROVINCE. If Quebec wants to be its own country perfect, then we can make Canada a Non-Bilingual country and save us a lot of money. You are part of Canada, and Canada is Bilingual, so Quebec is Bilingual.

Then why would it be the French speaking pilots having to switch language for English speaking pilots? Why don't the English speaking pilot learn French (in this bilingual country) and speak it when flying in Quebec?

You are part of Canada, Canada is bilingual, then be prepared to speak French in a bilingual province or a French province. Why should Roger the PPL learn to speak English for you, when you fly in Quebec? You are the Commercial Pilot, the one earning money to fly. You should be the one doing the Professionnal Development.