Newhires FYI

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Canoehead
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Newhires FYI

Post by Canoehead »

I'm working on my 2008 tax return, and was looking back at my 2006 information, and thought you'd be interested in my income for my first year as an F/O at Jazz...

I should add, I don't do WDO's and we are a family of 5 (for purposes of deductions).

Gross Pay: 35,682
Net Pay: 22,745
Deductions: 13,256

This does not include any per diems (range between 600-800 /month).

I can tell you that third year looks like this:
Gross: 50, 488
Net: 32,251
Deductions: 18,237

The first year is tight, but if you can stick it out, it gets better.
Still pretty poor though IMHO!

I'd be curious to know if and WJA'ers would share with us.
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FICU
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Re: Newhires FYI

Post by FICU »

Man... your first year gross salary is close to what I paid in income tax alone last year... in the left seat.

My year 1 F/O gross was more than your year 3 gross.

B737 operator.

Jazz should be ashamed!
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Last edited by FICU on Tue Mar 03, 2009 11:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
swervin
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Re: Newhires FYI

Post by swervin »

Did the deductions you put in there include all your Benefits, pension payments, insurance, etc?
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Canoehead
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Re: Newhires FYI

Post by Canoehead »

swervin wrote:Did the deductions you put in there include all your Benefits, pension payments, insurance, etc?
Yeah, every last deduction on the face of the earth...
It seems there were some higher than normal deductions (ALPA Ins) and also uniform.
Federal tax alone was close to 6K.
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mattedfred
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Re: Newhires FYI

Post by mattedfred »

your ALPA insurance should have only been a few dollars a month. do you mean your jazz group benefits?
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Re: Newhires FYI

Post by Canoehead »

I should point out that I didn't post this to show 'disappointment' with Jazz. I simply wanted to give some straight goods for new hires who seem to be asking about weather they can afford to live at Jazz. Naturally they tell everyone what they will 'make' in first rear at the company, but nobody seems to know how much they can count on to be deposited in the bank.

My wife has the 'real' job at our house, and being able to live was not difficult for us. For single folks, or the 'bread-winners', you should know what you'll be bringing in.

FWIW, I am happy to be working at JZA.
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Re: Newhires FYI

Post by Canoehead »

mattedfred wrote:your ALPA insurance should have only been a few dollars a month. do you mean your jazz group benefits?
There was a deduction called 'ALPA BEN PREM'. It was $815. Not sure when or how it came out... I'd have to go through all my stubs to find it.
Any idea what that deduction is? I don't have any supplemental ALPA insurance.
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mattedfred
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Re: Newhires FYI

Post by mattedfred »

that is the benefits premiums for the great west life group benefits coverage through jazz for the pilot group

check out the pay codes for pilots document somewhere on jazzops and jazznet to find out what all of those acronyms mean
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Re: Newhires FYI

Post by Canoehead »

I'll check that out, but now I've raised my own question I guess...
I thought out GWL premiums were under 'DENTAL' and 'EHC'.
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Inverted2
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Re: Newhires FYI

Post by Inverted2 »

The one thing I am disappointed with Jazz is the amount of deductions that come off the paycheque. Aside from the usual federal tax, CPP, EI etc, the deductions for short term disability, dental, medical are HUGE. We have to pay 50% of our dental/medical which I was surprised. Also, no offence to ALPA, but I paid $960 in union dues last year (3rd year FO). New hires pay 50% of their uniforms, so you will be paying that back for the first 18 months or so. When its all said and done, I take home roughly 2600 dollars a month, after 3+ years with the company.
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Re: Newhires FYI

Post by mattedfred »

Canoehead wrote:I'll check that out, but now I've raised my own question I guess...
I thought out GWL premiums were under 'DENTAL' and 'EHC'.
they are now. it used to be listed under one code up until 2006 i.e. ALPA BEN PREM. it has been coded separately since then. click on the links menu of jazzops and choose the ops info menu. you'll find the pay codes for pilots document listed at the bottom.
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Re: Newhires FYI

Post by mattedfred »

Inverted2 wrote:The one thing I am disappointed with Jazz is the amount of deductions that come off the paycheque. Aside from the usual federal tax, CPP, EI etc, the deductions for short term disability, dental, medical are HUGE. We have to pay 50% of our dental/medical which I was surprised. Also, no offence to ALPA, but I paid $960 in union dues last year (3rd year FO). New hires pay 50% of their uniforms, so you will be paying that back for the first 18 months or so. When its all said and done, I take home roughly 2600 dollars a month, after 3+ years with the company.
you can thank the last CCAA for the percentage that we pay. we used to only pay 25%. you can opt out of the EHC and Dental coverage if you have coverage through a spouse, although they are the least expensive premiums. union dues are 1.94% of your income and you can choose to donate your dues to the charity of your choice if you feel that you aren't getting your monies worth. perhaps if interviewees asked more specific questions during their interview new hires wouldn't be so surprised when they see their first pay stub. perhaps the interviewers could provide more details of the deductions as well.
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Re: Newhires FYI

Post by Flight 714 »

Thanks so much Canoehead! That is great for doing up a new budget - I start groundschool March 23rd! Will I be on the payroll beginning with Day 1 of groundschool?

Thanks again,

714
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Re: Newhires FYI

Post by mattedfred »

yup
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flyinhigh
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Re: Newhires FYI

Post by flyinhigh »

Just to make it simple.

Yes it is 35 K the first year. divide that by 26 you'll get around 1200. Right....

Wrong,

Your take home in the first year is pathetic. The cheque on the 10th is around $900 take home, and the cheque on the 25th is around 1000.

The deductions are brutal, Benefits are a massive hit on us now.

Anyway, the job is awesome and I have NO intention of going anywhere else for now anyway.

cheers
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Re: Newhires FYI

Post by teacher »

"fred" is right, you can thank CCAA for the low pay and massive deductions. WestJet pilots were lucky enough to renegotiate since the downturn ater 9-11 (and a booming economy), Jazz pilots were not thanks to the 5 year contract. Here's hoping for some better things in '09.
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Re: Newhires FYI

Post by swervin »

Just another point to remember. As your hourly wage goes up, all your deductions follow it up as well. Certain benefits, ALPA dues, taxes, etc. are based on a percentage of your income. At 9th year pay I'm still only doing about $2700 a month plus per diems. My gross pay has gone up by close to 90% over the last 9 years, but the take home has only gone up around 15%. The previous guy who said he's doing $2600 a month at 3rd year does that include Per Diems?
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Re: Newhires FYI

Post by Stinky »

I was able to opt out of Dental but keep medical, crunch the numbers and opt out of one or both if you have coverage with a spouse.
If you do WDO's you can increase your pay quite a bit. Year 1 gross was $42K and year 2 was $50k.
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Re: Newhires FYI

Post by mattedfred »

swervin wrote:Just another point to remember. As your hourly wage goes up, all your deductions follow it up as well. Certain benefits, ALPA dues, taxes, etc. are based on a percentage of your income. At 9th year pay I'm still only doing about $2700 a month plus per diems. My gross pay has gone up by close to 90% over the last 9 years, but the take home has only gone up around 15%. The previous guy who said he's doing $2600 a month at 3rd year does that include Per Diems?
the following deductions are based on your pay with no limit; ALPA Dues, STD and LTD premiums, FED tax, RST Employee, Jazz DB Plan (pension)

the following deductions are based on your pay with limits; CPP/QPP, EI

the following deductions are set amounts that are not based on your pay; ALPA Merg/Ass (insurance/best doctors), EHC, Dental , Life

the only other difference is whether you have family or single group health benefits, jazz and alpa optional insurance

let me know if i missed anything
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Re: Newhires FYI

Post by Inverted2 »

swervin wrote:Just another point to remember. As your hourly wage goes up, all your deductions follow it up as well. Certain benefits, ALPA dues, taxes, etc. are based on a percentage of your income. At 9th year pay I'm still only doing about $2700 a month plus per diems. My gross pay has gone up by close to 90% over the last 9 years, but the take home has only gone up around 15%. The previous guy who said he's doing $2600 a month at 3rd year does that include Per Diems?
No, you are correct, I looked over my old pay stubs and I took home about $2500 a month for year 3 (not including perdiems).

Sad isn't it? 8)
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Re: Newhires FYI

Post by JZA »

What's sad is year 1 & 2 AC pay. Same pay as at JAZZ during the first couple years but flying heavier equipment.

While I hope JAZZ is able to up the pay for the guys/gals flying there it's a pretty nice place to work overall that's for sure.
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Re: Newhires FYI

Post by Inverted2 »

True, but your pay goes way up at AC after 2 years, while at jazz, as mentioned earlier, a 9 year FO is taking home less than 3k a month. I had no problems sucking up shitty pay for the first 2 years but its going to suck for a long time (till I get an upgrade) :?
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Re: Newhires FYI

Post by KAG »

Canoehead wrote:I'm working on my 2008 tax return, and was looking back at my 2006 information, and thought you'd be interested in my income for my first year as an F/O at Jazz...

I should add, I don't do WDO's and we are a family of 5 (for purposes of deductions).

Gross Pay: 35,682
Net Pay: 22,745
Deductions: 13,256

This does not include any per diems (range between 600-800 /month).

I can tell you that third year looks like this:
Gross: 50, 488
Net: 32,251
Deductions: 18,237

The first year is tight, but if you can stick it out, it gets better.
Still pretty poor though IMHO!

I'd be curious to know if and WJA'ers would share with us.
I'm a second year FO. The first year Salary is 40K, 2nd is 50K, keep that in mind...
I got my 2nd year pay raise in Q2 of last year. I should have made $45,500.
My T4 was $59,000. Thats with some overtime (maybe 40 hours for the year), 2 good profit share cheques (clear about $3500 total), and only doing 10% ESP. If I had of done 20% my T4 would have been around 64K.
My deductions were around $16,000 total. I have about 18K in ESP stock put away, worth about 13K - stocks are down. I also have about 1000 shares in Stock options, not worth anything yet.
Hope this helps.
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Re: Newhires FYI

Post by highflyer188 »

A couple questions I have for you regarding your first year. What kind of schedule did you have and how many days off per month did you get.
Are you required to do any on "call duty"? If you were on Reserve were you off the hook after the morning phone call from flt ops or on reserve for the 24 hr period.

Thanks
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Re: Newhires FYI

Post by Stinky »

If you end up on reserve you will have 12 days off per month. Your "on call period" commences at 3am until 5pm (Reserve A) or 12pm until 2am (reserve B) You can check available flying at home. Basically what you do is check the available flying at home for the next day between 4pm and 7pm (you can check anytime but this is the best due to people being off sick have until 4pm to book back on) If you see flying that you like multi day, single turn, whatever you call the "next day desk" and bid on the flying. It is awarded in order of seniority generally, but exceptions may apply. Then, after 8pm you check online or call to see what, if anything has been assigned to you. If nothing has been assigned you may get an early morning wake up call. If you haven't been called by 3pm you are off the hook. You are required a 2 hour call out so your show time has to be no later than 5pm. You also cant work more than 8hrs past 5pm.
There are a lot of other things to get into as far as reassignment rules and much more, you really need to know the contract when you are on reserve. It's tougher to plan your life around a reserve schedule but on the plus side, it doesn't cost you any salary the first 2 years due to the pay structure (just less per diems generally) The other bonus is quite often you will get better flying than a junior blockholder and often travel to other bases for some variety.
There are a lot of people who bid reserve so don't be scared of a reserve schedule, it's got some advantages.
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