Oil rig chopper down at sea (March, 2009)

[sky's the limit]

If you loose main gearbox oil pressure, typically you want to be on the ground five minutes ago. I'm not sure about the set-up on the S-92 however.

I know in any of the twins I fly, it's land immediately if not sooner.


stl

[carholme]

Stl;

The Main Gearbox (MGB) is the Main Rotor Transmission, the unit which accepts power from the engine(s) and delivers it to the Main Rotor and Tail rotor.

Here is a discussion (61 pages) of the S92 on Pprune and if you read it all, you will note the discussions and problems they are having with the MGB 30 minute run dry capability.

http://www.pprune.org/rotorheads/163206 ... tions.html


carholme

[sky's the limit]

Stl;

The Main Gearbox (MGB) is the Main Rotor Transmission, the unit which accepts power from the engine(s) and delivers it to the Main Rotor and Tail rotor.

Here is a discussion (61 pages) of the S92 on Pprune and if you read it all, you will note the discussions and problems they are having with the MGB 30 minute run dry capability.

http://www.pprune.org/rotorheads/163206 ... tions.html


carholme

Thanks,

As I said, I have no idea what the S92 is set up like. For me, "gearbox" is the combining gearbox on the 212, and oil lights there are bad news.

I'll have a read on Pprune, thanks.

stl

[ahramin]

I do not know about the particular survival suits involved in this case, but for helicopter water egress buoyancy should not be more than 40 lbs.

[2milefinal]

My thoughts go out to all the crew, passengers and their family's.
....some of the reporters at the latest news conference were a little much.

[Prairie Chicken]

I'm not clear on this. Would they have been able to autorotate, or is it totally uncontrolled?

[sky's the limit]

I'm not clear on this. Would they have been able to autorotate, or is it totally uncontrolled?

This wasn't a power problem, but a transmission/gear box issue. Been reading the Pprune thread Carholm posted above and it seems to me that loss of oil pressure to the gear box on the S92 is catastrophic in nature if certain actions are not taken asap (bypass). Main rotor transmissions are designed to uncouple from the power source (engine) in case of a loss of power, but if you have a m/r gearbox (transmission) failure, autorotation is not going to happen as it is predicated on the transmission being able to turn on it's own with the up-flowing air making the rotor system turn.

The S92 is a mulit-engined a/c, and this NOT a loss of power issue at first blush. Depending on when the tranny packed it in, that may explain why the opportunity to egress was so limited. I'm sure all the facts will come out soon, but if the tranny were to have caused the m/r to cease on short final to the water, that would make the landing very difficult as there would be no lift.

If Carholm knows a bit more about the S92 mechanical set-up, I'd like to hear what he has to say.

It'll be very interesting to hear what comes out of this, I can't imagine recovering the wreckage will be easy or feasible.

stl

[electraguy]

I have a friend who was aboard that chopper, All we can hope for now is a miracle that any of the rest of them survived. What a tradgedy!!!!

[carholme]

I am not openly speculating on the cause of this accident, that is up to others.

As well, if you read the CADOR, in one area they mention an engine oil problem and then go on to discuss MGB oil pressure problems. Where they get this type of confusing information from makes me wonder just who writes these events or that they obviously are not proof read.

An MGB oil prssure indication or an engine oil problem in and of themselves are not enough to bring down a relatively sophisticated and newer generation helicopter of this type. What happened after the initial problem will have to be seen but I am not in a position to determine that. A read through of the Pprune threads will show the problems that have been encountered with this helicopter MGB (Transmission) system.

As far as whether they did or did not autorotate, I don't think anybody really knows that as yet.

Just a tough day all round.

carholme

[sky's the limit]

Just a tough day all round.

Yes, horrible start to the year.

stl

[Tim]

the one survivor they found is banged up from the crash i believe...between a fatal impact crash and a survivable one in which they drowned, i hope it was the former...neither would have been much better

I do not know about the particular survival suits involved in this case, but for helicopter water egress buoyancy should not be more than 40 lbs.

thanks, thats what i was wondering

[Widow]

No signals from locator beacons on suits worn by oil workers: officials
Last Updated: Thursday, March 12, 2009 | 10:21 PM NT
CBC News


Hours after a helicopter carrying offshore oil workers crashed into the Atlantic Ocean southeast of St. John's, N.L., officials have still not received any locator signals from the beacons attached to survivor suits the people aboard were wearing.

A search and rescue operation will continue throughout the night for the 16 people still missing, out of a total 18 who were on board when the Cougar Helicopters chopper went down Thursday, officials said during a news conference.

"At this time, all we’ve got is the debris field. No indications of any survivors, but the search will continue, and obviously, we’ll hope for the best," said Maj. Denis McGuire, a spokesman for the Rescue Co-ordination Centre in Halifax.

One man, Robert Decker, was recovered alive from the area where the Sikorsky S92 chopper, known as Cougar 911, crashed.

Searchers also brought back the body of one person killed in the crash to St. John's. No further details were released. Two empty life-rafts were also found near the crash site.

The helicopter was heading to two offshore oilfields. At about 9:18 a.m. NT, or 7:48 a.m. ET, its crew issued a mayday and an alert about technical problems, saying there was a main gearbox oil-pressure problem and requesting clearance to return to St. John's.

The Transportation Safety Board said the helicopter, which had turned back to St. John's after issuing the mayday, crashed into the water about 37 minutes later. The crash is believed to have occurred about 65 kilometres east-southeast of Newfoundland.

McGuire also said that so far, there were "no signals, whatsoever from any of the [beacons]."

"I cannot speculate on why they wouldn’t have worked or what the issues may have been, but we did not receive any signals," he said.

The low-power beacons are designed to work when people are on the surface of the water, officials said. All passengers and crew must wear a survivor suit before they board a helicopter. Authorities said a healthy adult wearing a survival suit could be expected to live for about 24 hours in the frigid Atlantic waters.
(CBC)(CBC)

Decker was listed in critical condition in hospital in St. John's. A source told CBC News he had aspirated sea water and was being treated in intensive care for hypothermia and a broken bone.

Earlier Thursday afternoon, officials in St. John's were unable to say how many people survived after the helicopter, which was heading to two offshore oilfields, ditched into the ocean.

"We only have one person at this point," Rick Burt, general manager of Cougar Helicopters, told reporters in St. John's.

"This is a very difficult time for Cougar, our colleagues, our customers and their families," said Burt, who was visibly shaken during two afternoon briefings with journalists.
From left to right, Maj. Denis McGuire of the Search and Rescue Co-ordination Centre, Rick Burt, general manager of Cougar Helicopters and Trevor Pritchard of Husky Energy speak at a press conference regarding the helicopter crash in the North Atlantic.From left to right, Maj. Denis McGuire of the Search and Rescue Co-ordination Centre, Rick Burt, general manager of Cougar Helicopters and Trevor Pritchard of Husky Energy speak at a press conference regarding the helicopter crash in the North Atlantic. (Paul Daly/Canadian Press)

The crash is the first time a helicopter carrying offshore oil workers has gone down since oil was first pumped on the Grand Banks in 1997. The choppers are essentially shuttles for workers coming on and off shift, and are familiar sights in the skies of St. John's.

Julie Leroux, an official with the Transportation Safety Board, said the helicopter's crew reported mechanical problems, but they did not know the nature of those problems.

In 1982, the then-developing industry was rocked when 84 men died when the Ocean Ranger, a drilling rig that was exploring for oil in the Grand Banks, sank during a winter storm.
Worried relatives gather at family centre

Crew aboard Cougar 911 were largely working at the White Rose offshore oilfield, southeast of St. John's. Two were stationed at the nearby Hibernia platform. Two of the people aboard the helicopter worked directly for Cougar Helicopters.

Calgary-based Husky, the operator of the White Rose project, and Hibernia Management both said they are assisting with the search and rescue effort.

Another chopper, also operated by Cougar Helicopters, arrived at the Health Sciences Centre in St. John's at noon with Decker, who was rushed into the hospital on a stretcher.

Hopes had been high earlier in the day for a larger, immediate rescue. Eastern Health told CBC News that it had cleared its emergency rooms to prepare for what it described as patients who are critically ill and hypothermic.

However, officials later told ambulances that had been waiting near a helipad that they were not needed for the time being.

A family centre has been set up at the Comfort Inn next to the headquarters of Cougar Helicopters at St. John's airport. Worried relatives could be seen walking back and forth between the two buildings, while other people sat in their vehicles in the parking lot, listening to news reports on the radio and talking on cell phones.

Joe Delaney said he's concerned for his nephew, who went out on a flight this morning.

"He was here yesterday, got bumped off his flight, ended up coming back again this morning," he said. "So we're uncertain now as to where it stands."
High winds reported

High winds were reported as aircraft — including a military plane and two Cormorant helicopters — were dispatched to the scene.

The coast guard also sent one of its ships, and companies active in the offshore oil industry have joined the effort. A supply ship was also en route to the scene.

Newfoundland and Labrador Premier Danny Williams described the crash as a "terrible tragedy off of our shores."

"We are a seafaring people who have for centuries lived from the sea, people risking their lives every day to provide for their families and contribute to this province. And yet, we will never, ever be able to accept the loss of precious lives to the sea," Williams said in a statement.

Prime Minister Stephen Harper, speaking during question period on Thursday, said he had called Williams earlier in the day.

"I know all of us in this chamber want to share our thoughts and prayers with the families who are anxiously awaiting word on their loved ones."
Flights to Hibernia platform suspended

Meanwhile, crews that arrived at Cougar's base, near the main terminal at the St. John's airport, were told they could not be ferried offshore on Thursday morning.

"All of a sudden, we saw the cameras and police," said Rick Strickland, a steward aboard the Hibernia platform, describing the scene as he learned his transport to the Hibernia platform had been suspended.

Having made regular shuttles to the Hibernia platform since 1997, Strickland said safety is a priority. He has such confidence in the helicopters and their crew that he usually sleeps during the flights, which take between 75 and 90 minutes.

"It doesn't scare me as such, no. [But] it always crosses your mind at some point," he said.

Cougar 911 usually flies crews to and from the Hibernia platform, about 315 kilometres southeast of St. John's, and St. John's International Airport. On Thursday, however, it was working with a crew stationed at the floating Sea Rose platform, at the White Rose field.

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/newfoundland-l ... opter.html

[Jastapilot]

"At this time, all we’ve got is the debris field

oh shit.

[airbournesailor]

It's been 24 hours now since the ditching, looks pretty bleak! My heart goes out to the families and friends.

I'm curious as to why Cougar changed from the Super Pumas to the S92? Better A/C, cheaper, safer, cheaper maintenance?

[Cobber]

I think they went from the Puma to the S92 mainly for payload - most other factors were relatively similar. I know of a few of the guys there, my heart goes out to everyone. Cougar themselves have an ultra safe environment, top notch maintenance, engineers, & crews. They will continue searching during daylight hours today, my thoughts and prayers are with all the families.

[2R]

They are saying twenty four hours is the benchmark for survival in the suits issued but some guys in ww2 survived for almost a week without survival suits after lossing their ships in the north atlantic.

They should keep looking until the find everyone as if the guys managed to get out and are together they may survive much longer than twenty fours hours .

[Widow]

TSB to try to raise wrecked helicopter

By Tara Brautigam and Michael Tutton,
THE CANADIAN PRESS


ST. JOHN’S, N.L. — A helicopter that crashed in the ocean while carrying 18 crew and workers to offshore oil platforms off Newfoundland will be raised from the ocean floor, investigators said Friday.

Mike Cunningham, lead investigator for the Transportation Safety Board, said the recovery of the downed chopper from 120 metres of water on the Grand Banks could take about a week.

“We don’t know a lot about what we’ll be facing,” he said during a news conference. “We want to do it safely and we want to do it as quickly as possible.”

Cunningham said it’s possible that balloons could be placed under the helicopter and then inflated to raise it to the surface.

But before that happens, he said a remote submersible equipped with cameras will be sent to the ocean floor as soon as Saturday to examine the wreck.

Cunningham said they will have to be careful not to damage the chopper during the lift.

“This helicopter is full of water now, so it’s quite heavy and it’s not designed to be lifted full of water. It’s designed to fly through the air.”

Ships and aircraft continued to scour the ocean Friday for 16 people still missing from the crash a day earlier. Officials said the search would continue until nightfall before a decision is made on whether to continue.

“We’ll continue until there is no chance of locating any survivors,” said Maj. Denis McGuire of the Joint Rescue Co-ordination Centre told another news conference.

Crews on a Cormorant helicopter and Hercules aircraft used night-vision goggles to search a vast expanse of ocean overnight but found no sign of those missing.

“Our intent is to go until at least last light,” McGuire said.

“Our goal is to find anyone who may be on the surface.”

A body and one survivor were pulled from the ocean on Thursday morning after the Sikorsky S-92 issued a mayday and ditched southeast of St. John’s.

McGuire corrected times the military had previously released for when the crash happened on Thursday, saying the initial times were off by about 30 minutes. The mayday call was sent at 9:40 a.m. and the helicopter crashed at 9:48 a.m. local time.

Officials said shortly after the crash that a person wearing a survival suit could last about 24 hours in water as cold as the North Atlantic this time of year.

McGuire conceded that the “survivability model” of 24 hours in the water had passed since the crash, but said searchers hadn’t given up hope.

“As the time progresses, obviously it becomes less likely that we’re going to be able to find someone,” he said. “But we’re always optimistic, which is why we extend these searches as long as possible.”

Cunningham said the families of those on the helicopter are being briefed regularly.

“We want to be able to give them, and they want, obviously, as much information as they can get in timely fashion,” he said.

Winds were gusting to about 60 kilometres an hour and sea swells were choppy in the search area.

Everyone on board the chopper owned by Cougar Helicopters would have been required to wear a survival suit that could help them stay alive for an estimated 24 hours.

Jeri Grychowski of the search and rescue centre in Halifax said the sky was clear over the search area, which covered 4,400 square kilometres of ocean.

“That’s good for the aircraft,” said Grychowski. “Swells, well, it moves things around.”

The only known survivor, Robert Decker, was in a St. John’s hospital where he was reportedly being treated for a broken bone and hypothermia. He was listed in critical but stable condition in the hospital’s intensive care unit.

“He is starting to show signs of some recovery, but what’s his status, I’m not too sure,” said Trevor Pritchard, general manager of Husky Oil, operator of the Sea Rose floating production vessel on the White Rose oilfield.

McGuire said they didn’t know how Decker was able to get out of the ditched helicopter.

The helicopter, piloted by two crew members, was carrying 14 workers to Sea Rose and another two to Hibernia when it experienced technical problems.

The sister-in-law of one of the missing, Derrick Mullowney, a steward on the Sea Rose, was in tears as she spoke about the accident.

“We only buried his father about a month ago. His father died on Jan. 30 and now this,” said Sharon Mullowney.

She said Mullowney, who lives in the Bay Bulls area near St. John’s, is 52 and has been working in the offshore for 28 or 29 years.

The helicopter reversed course on its way back to St. John’s but soon fell into the Atlantic eight minutes after issuing a mayday.

Two life-rafts were spotted in the water, but rescuers later confirmed they were empty.

Workers who have made the flight to the offshore platforms — located roughly 350 kilometres east of St. John’s — say they are fully aware of the risk inherent in their jobs.

Perry White, an offshore worker since 1982, said the possibility of a crash enters his mind every time he climbs into one of the helicopters.

“But then again, when you look at fatalities for helicopters and you look at fatalities for cars, you’re more likely to be hit by a bread truck crossing the road,” said Perry, who was supposed to fly out to a rig later Thursday but was home sick with the flu.

“My way of looking at it is, if you let that stuff play on your mind, then you’re not going to be out there at all.”

The survival suits that those on board the chopper were required to wear are equipped with water-activated locator beacons. It was initially believed a number of the beacons had been triggered, but officials later said no signals had been picked up from the suits.

The crew of a Provincial Airlines fixed-wing aircraft spotted the helicopter floating upside down about 10 minutes after it hit the water.

Within 45 minutes, two Cougar helicopters hovered above the crash scene, but the chopper had already sunk.

It was equipped with emergency flotation bags, but Rick Burt of Cougar Helicopters said he didn’t know whether they malfunctioned.

The crash comes three weeks after a British Super Puma helicopter went down near an oilfield in the North Sea. All 18 aboard that chopper managed to survive on two inflatable life rafts.

Burt said the company had grounded all of its helicopters.

The Sikorsky, which can seat about two dozen, was on its way to two of the three production platforms on the Grand Banks.

Burt said the helicopter was a “new generation aircraft” that was no older than four years.

The 90-minute shuttle flights are a regular occurrence at St. John’s International Airport, with rig workers typically working offshore for about three weeks at a time.

As many as seven of the workers on the helicopter are believed to be from communities on the province’s south shore, where an estimated 30 per cent of residents are employed in the offshore.

Bay Bulls Mayor Don Drew said people in the community were trying to find if they know anyone on the downed chopper.

“We’re just basically in limbo,” he said Friday. “We’re trying to find out, both through phone calls, emails, Facebook and everything.

“Everyone is just trying to find out who’s involved, hoping for the best, talking to each other. Everyone is just very sombre and hoping for the best. ... It’s just taking the life out of the area.”

120 metres isn't so bad. AQW was down over 250 metres ... they should call Kevin if they need help

Again, my heart goes out to all involved. Fingers are still crossed.

[ragbagflyer]

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2009/03/ ... suits.html

Pretty impressive pieces of gear. Interestingly they talk about how people will often unzip the suit to keep a little cooler. I'm not surprised, i'd wondered about that myself. Purely speculation but if it that was the case and the helicopter went down without autorotating I wouldn't be surprised to see a bunch of guys with open suits. I'd probably do the same as you can't really assume the machine is literally going to fall out of the sky, an occurrence which already stacks the odds against you surviving a ditching. A very sad situation all around though.

Survival suits
Last Updated: Friday, March 13, 2009 | 2:22 PM ET Comments0Recommend4CBC News

A Nautilus E452 survival suit made by Helly Hansen Canada Ltd. (Helly Hansen)
A bright orange garment with water-sensitive beacons, the survival suit is designed to give victims those precious extra hours needed for rescue crews to find them.

When a Sikorsky S-92 helicopter ditched in the Atlantic off the coast of Newfoundland Thursday with 18 passengers aboard, all would have been wearing Nautilus E452 suits, made by Helly Hansen.

Such suits are typically sold to oil and gas companies doing exploration work over water, but are also used by the coast guard, military and navy.

The Nautilus suit is outfitted with an inflatable life-jacket that immediately activates in water, said Shawn Amirault, vice-president of sales and marketing for Helly Hansen Canada Ltd.

Other suit features include a breathing system to supply air to the person in emergencies.

The suit is also equipped with a personal locator beacon so rescue crews can quickly locate the individual in the wide expanse of ocean.

In the case of the Sikorsky S-92 helicopter, search and rescue crews reported that no signals were received from the beacons of the 16 missing passengers. One man was pulled alive from the ocean and one body has been recovered.

Experts surmise that the lack of signal may indicate the suits were submerged deep under water.

"It certainly could be depth. It's troubling that there are 16 individuals missing and we haven't heard from a single one of them. So that's one of the … nagging issues out there with the rescue operation right now," said Stephen Cheung, an expert in hypothermia from Brock University, in St. Catharines, Ont.

Cold, heat both pose risks
Cheung, who has trained to survive a ditched helicopter, says it can be "catastrophic" if the seal on the suits break, allowing any water to get in.

That eliminates the suit's ability to keep the person dry, enabling a healthy person in their 30s to survive 24 hours in near freezing water.

"The whole purpose of this is to have an air layer between you and the outside water to keep you as dry and as warm as possible," said Cheung.

Once your body is in contact with water, the water begins conducting heat away from your skin and puts you at risk of hypothermia.

As muscles start shivering to try to stay warm, it becomes increasingly difficult to move your limbs to try to open a flare or even get into a life raft, said Cheung.

Water leaks also decrease the buoyancy of the suit, which can weigh 15 to 20 pounds.

But while the suit is designed to be impenetrable, helicopter passengers can put themselves at risk.

Helicopters can heat up quickly in the sun, causing some passengers to unzip their body suits during the ride.

"It's a natural temptation.… It is like a big fish bowl with the sun blaring in the helicopter, lots of glass. And it can be very, very hot in there," said Cheung.

Cheung is currently working on a project looking at whether heat stress from wearing survival suits can also impair reaction during emergency situations.

[looproll]

they have called off the search

what a stupid headline:

http://www.canada.com/news/hope+finding ... story.html

No hope of finding N.L. crash survivors: Officials

[sky's the limit]

I feel for everyone involved, families, co-workers and those at Cougar, I know Mgt is taking this very hard. A class organization from the top down.


stl

[r22captain]

x2 stl

[Old fella]

X 3. I know some folks at Cougar, they are taking this quite hard. The look on RB's face say's it all!!

[Crobe]

"The Nautilus suit is outfitted with an inflatable life-jacket that immediately activates in water" ????

Can anyone confirm this? That seems to go against everything we know about surviving a ditching. Could this explain why only two have been found so far?

My thoughts and prayers are with the families, friends, and staff at Cougar

[rotorhead350]

I agree as well, VIH/Cougar is a top notch organization.

rh350

[Prairie Chicken]

Code: Select all

 I feel for everyone involved, families, co-workers and those at Cougar, I know Mgt is taking this very hard. A class organization from the top down.

I share the same feelings. The company is very well run and safety is gospel. My heart goes out to all those involved.