GTA Area - wanna fly me to Harrisburg on Friday?

[Sulako]

If you already have your PPL or CPL and are looking for a way to build a few hours with a chunk of your costs subsidized, here's a golden opportunity.

You = a plucky, adventurous, and proficient pilot of a GTA-based aircraft that is reliable enough to get us there with no unscheduled stops. I'm open to light piston twins as well as singles. You can feel free to bring a pal along for the ride, assuming the weight and balance agrees.

Me = One of two lazy, spoiled corporate pilots who doesn't want to drive the 7 1/2 hours to Harrisburg or sit on a commercial plane for the 8 hours it'd take us to get there (no direct flights from Toronto).

Myself and my Co-Captain need a ride to Harrisburg to pick up our plane this Friday (or this weekend, if that works). Specifically we need a ride to Capitol City KCXY, 4 miles from Harrisburg Intl (KMDT) in Pennsylvania. We cleared customs in Harrisburg Intl on the way down but I'm flexible if you have another idea.

Harrisburg is roughly 250nm southeast of Toronto, just so you know.

We are based in the Greater Toronto Area and would be open to using whatever airport is the cheapest and most convenient for all involved.

I want to do this legally so I can't pay for you make a profit on the trip, but I promise we'll smell good, we'll tell hilarious jokes, we won't touch any switches or levers in the cockpit, and most importantly we'll pay for the gas and the landing fees, ramp fees etc. I'll even throw in lunch when we get there so you aren't hungry on your solo flight back home.

PM me if this sounds like something you'd be interested in.

[bob sacamano]

Me = One of two lazy, spoiled corporate pilots who doesn't want to drive the 7 1/2 hours to Harrisburg or sit on a commercial plane for the 8 hours it'd take us to get there (no direct flights from Toronto).

From: Toronto, Pearson Int'l, ON (YYZ)
To: Harrisburg, Harrisburg Int'l, PA (MDT)


1 AC7388 08:35 09:53 BEH 0 - $768 $928 - -

1 AC7390 15:50 17:08 BEH 0 - $768 $928 - -



Op: Operated by
1 Air Georgian


To correct your post, there are direct flights from Toronto to Harrisburg. All I did was visit the Air Canada website, and punch in the originating airport and destination airport, the rest happened on its own.

You're bang on the lazy and spoiled part dude.

[Sulako]

I should have qualified that: There are no reasonably-priced direct flights from Toronto.

With taxes etc, the cheapest AC tickets add up to $1,760.52 Spending $1,760.52 for 2 tickets in a B1900 for a 90 minute flight seems a little insane, hence my post.

I appreciate your efforts toward reducing AC's debt-load though.

[niss]

I would totally take you up on your offer but alas the elusive PPL escapes me for a little longer.

[Tango01]

Sulako;

Im sure somebody from the Buttonville Flying Club can do it.

Give them a call. There are a lot of aircraft owners in that place.

http://www.buttonvilleflyingclub.com/

Good luck!

PS: The drive down Pennsylvania is really nice!

[bob sacamano]

I should have qualified that: There are no reasonably-priced direct flights from Toronto.

With taxes etc, the cheapest AC tickets add up to $1,760.52 Spending $1,760.52 for 2 tickets in a B1900 for a 90 minute flight seems a little insane, hence my post.

I appreciate your efforts toward reducing AC's debt-load though.

In your first post, you mentioned that you needed to get somewhere, and that there were no direct flights. I corrected your post and provided you with a direct flight. You did not mention that you were looking for a low cost flight, to get you to your cushy and pampered corporate gig.

My intention was to help you out and not as you put it, reduce AC's debt.

Regardless, you're welcome.

[Pratt X 3]

Hasn't this topic been discussed before?
viewtopic.php?f=54&t=45239&hilit=chisel+charter
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=35715&hilit=chisel+charter
viewtopic.php?f=54&t=37439&hilit=chisel+charter
etc. (search.php?keywords=chisel+charter&term ... mit=Search)

Mr. Sulako, I understand you are trying to keep expenditures down for your company and also provide an opportunity for someone to build some time but this doesn't seem kosher to me. Not only are you cutting pretty close to breaking CAR 401.28 (http://www.tc.gc.ca/CivilAviation/Regse ... htm#401_28), as most of those search results quote, but because you are crossing the border, the FAA as well as US Customs/Department of Homeland Security might not approve if they started asking questions. As the ops manager of an established corporate/charter company, what would be your reaction if one of your customers starting hitching rides this way instead of giving your company the business? What protections for yourself, employee and company are in place should the worst happen in this situation with respect to the Canada Labour Code or even insurance?

Look, I'm not trying to pick a fight however these thoughts popped into my head as I read your post. I have read your posts here as well as your blog and enjoy the knowledge that you pass along. But this doesn't seem like the normal stuff you impart.

[Sulako]

No worries, Pratt X 3, I found your post very interesting.

I didn't intend to impart knowledge in my post because I don't have any on this subject, and I can see that I should have done my homework first. This is the first time I've thought about hitching a ride somewhere and offering to cover some of the costs and among the things I didnt know, I didn't know that the pax who help pay for gas had to be incidental to the flight, so thanks for that.

I copied n pasted the CAR here:

(2) The holder of a private pilot licence may receive reimbursement for costs incurred in respect of a flight if the holder
(amended 2005/12/01; previous version)

(a) is the owner or operator of the aircraft;
(amended 2005/12/01; previous version)

(b) conducts the flight for purposes other than hire or reward;
(amended 2005/12/01; previous version)

(c) carries passengers only incidentally to the purposes of the flight; and
(amended 2005/12/01; previous version)

(d) receives a reimbursement that
(amended 2005/12/01; previous version)

(i) is provided only by the passengers referred to in paragraph (c), and

(ii) is for the purpose of sharing costs for fuel, oil and fees charged against the aircraft in respect of the flight, as applicable.


So I have a question now, based on an reply to my initial post:

The guy owns the plane. He's heading down south anyway to attend some meetings, and intends to clear customs in Harrisburg on the way to North Carolina.

Is it legal for us to hitch a ride to Harrisburg, and offer to pay for some of the fuel then?


Otherwise, screw it, we'll just get a rental car and drive. I don't want to break the law, and certainly not in the USA.

[Hiflyer2]

I am sure yer boss can afford the ticket. I will fly you down for $7000.00. NP and we will be legal!!


MJ

[sepia]

It kinda cracks me up that an outfit operating corporate jets finds the thought of $1500 for two people to fly to a off the beaten path destination as cost prohibitive.

[Sulako]

Highflyer, I edited your post to remove even a trace of who my boss is. I'm sure you understand - I haven't ever actually posted where I work and I'd rather keep it that way.

Oh, btw tell your boss he still owes me 200 lbs of Jet-A :p

Anyway, it looks like we'll be driving as my Co-Captain says this is too Craigslist for him.

I learned something tho' - it was my impression that as long as the private pilot owned the plane and was covering most of the cost it was fine to help pay for a chunk of gas and incidental costs but I didn't know that we had to be incidental to the flight. Again, thanks to Pratt X 3 for letting me know.

[Hedley]

This is why it's really useful to have a piston twin
around - eg Navajo/C421/C414, or even a little
Baron or C310 - for running these kinds of
short-distance errands, to economically move
people and parts around. These aircraft can
comfortable operate off shorter (eg 3000 foot
paved) runways, too, that larger aircraft might
not be very happy on.

[Sulako]

It kinda cracks me up that an outfit operating corporate jets finds the thought of $1500 for two people to fly to a off the beaten path destination as cost prohibitive.

Yow, a snipe from another mod. Et tu, Brute?

First of all, it's $1760.52 :p Anyway, it's not cost-prohibitive but that's not really the point. No offense, but I'd rather not fly commercial even if it was cheap - I'd rather drive a big-ass SUV or fly in a small plane, and since we drove up here from Harrisburg last week, I was thinking it would be cool to fly down in a small plane because I haven't done that in ages and I thought it would be fun to pilot-geek-out for a few hours. My last flight in a piston plane was in a 172 last July and I really enjoyed it, and in my mind I had visions of a nice VFR day and staring at scattered puffy clouds and cars on the highway and cows in their pastures (I assume there are cow-filled pastures enroute) and talking about airplanes while the pilot demonstrated all the cool things their plane could do, then landing, having lunch and saying ciao. Clearly I was too idealistic, so thanks for bringing me down a notch :p

[KnownIce]

Would not the easiest thing be to have your company pay the local flight school for a charter flight using one of their instructors?

500nm x $200/hr = $1000. cheaper and faster than AC, more fun, and equally legal.

[Sulako]

The easiest thing is just to rent a car and drive, but it's not the most fun thing and that's what I was going for. You're right though, a local flight school might have something cool.

[sepia]

Not so much a snipe, as a fine appreciation for the irony in life.

[Rowdy]

Wow.. and this is why I think I'm gonna fade from the avcan scene..

Sully just wanted to geek it out and have a fun way of going south and help someone buildin some time in the process and the fine gems decided to go after'em in such a negative way.. almost looking to pick fights. Jesus guys, lighten up a little.

Have a safe drive down Sulako, sorry it didnt work out for ya man.

[SkyWolfe]

Lemme know when you need a flight in the YVR area No questions asked

Wolfie

[Offset]

I'm speechless. Other than good on you Sulako for making the offer in the first place.

A crossborder trip for a CPL timebuilder is worth way more than another 10 hours in the circuit at their home airport.

If this thread represents the state of aviation in Canada, then I guess the pieces are starting to come together for me.

[roger.roger]

Clearly I was too idealistic, so thanks for bringing me down a notch

not like you couldn't use it.

[ScurvyDog]

While I feel it is important for everyone to play fair, there is a point where we as pilots should relax a bit. It sounds as though some people around here either have an axe to grind or are worried about doing well on their Transport Canada Inspectors interview. In the previous 8 years or so many in the industry have lemming towards the TC's vision if you are not a mid size or larger a/c you are dangerous and don't belong in the sky's. A pour dude in a 172 can't even gain a little real world experience unless he has paid out of his own pocket. Thats sad!!!

Sully, regardless of the BS being flung around here, I would take time out of my day to fly one of my planes down to PA and you could buy me a $1000 or so worth of beer in the bar later that night

[niss]

and you could buy me a $1000 or so worth of beer in the bar later that night

You better be 8hrs bottle to throttle!

[Cat Driver]

Wow.. and this is why I think I'm gonna fade from the avcan scene..

Yeh, you would think Sully had suggested sodomizing his grandmother or something.

You are right Rowdy its time to find somewhere where the posters are not so paranoid or just plain moronic.

At least he did not mention Indians or airline pilots zinging off the end of ten thousand foot runways.

This site is getting pathetic.

[Pratt X 3]

Sully, I appreciate your response to my post. I am glad that you saw my post as a friendly 'point-out' and not an attack or an opportunity to practice my TC interview as others may have. I understood your thought process and wish that what you proposed to do was possible. However, in this day and age, the bureaucratic bullspit has reached unbelievable levels. Not only do the rules of Transport Canada, the FAA and the almighty Department of Homeland Security frown upon doing something like this, I also wanted to point out the serious consequences that might occur if something happened on the flight. Nowadays, we must look at personal and corporate liability just as we look at weather and NOTAMS to ensure that we clear all the hurdles we need to clear. Call it sad, or paranoid, or moronic; unfortunately, it appears to becoming the norm.

[roger.roger]

You are right Rowdy its time to find somewhere where the posters are not so paranoid or just plain moronic.

But transports out to get you.

and canada's system is worst than south africa duing appartide.