Flight school in Vancouver BC

[law7]

Hi, I'm thinking of starting a career in aviation and I'm now picking out a flight school in Vancouver BC. Can anyone here recommend me a good flight school in Vancouver. Thank you.

[Ralliart]

What kind of expections do you have for your aviation career over the first 5-10 years?

Where do you see yourself working/living and how much money do you think you will be making?

Honest questions.

[North Shore]

Lots of info on here about choosing a school and instructor. Thumbnail sketch: As one school is pretty much the same as another, shop around to choose an instructor that you get along with, as you will be spending 30+ hours in close proximity, and if they have BO that you can't stand, then your learning will suffer. The most important part of the equation is you - you'll get out in results the effort that you put in - do your homework and come prepared.

Google 'Peak Oil'

Good Luck.

[FlaplessDork]

Take a drive to Pitt Meadows, Boundry Bay, Langley, & Abbotsford. Chilliwack also has a school. Ask lots of questions.

[modi13]

If you want to get to the practice area quickly, go to Langley, Pitt or Abbotsford. If you want to get used to busy airspace and congested radio frequencies, which really comes in handy, go to Boundary Bay. The schools and training are pretty much the same, so take the time to go around and really get a feel for how things work; pick the one that you're most comfortable with. Try and take fam flights from multiple schools too, if you can afford it.

[loopa]

Pacific Rim Aviation.

You're looking for Alex Denham. A class act young guy who does nothing more but to satisfy your training needs past any standard you have to meet.

[Randleman]

If you want to get to the practice area quickly, go to Langley, Pitt or Abbotsford. If you want to get used to busy airspace and congested radio frequencies, which really comes in handy, go to Boundary Bay. The schools and training are pretty much the same, so take the time to go around and really get a feel for how things work; pick the one that you're most comfortable with. Try and take fam flights from multiple schools too, if you can afford it.

These days, even Langley or Pitt Meadows can be almost as congested as Boundary Bay. That being said, it's not quite as crazy.

It depends on how long you want to drive, there are excellent options at each airport. Personally I did mine in Langley. Started at Langley Flying School-couldn't beat learning on a 2000 foot runway. I later moved on to Skyquest aviation for my Multi/IFR. I'd recommend Langley airport-I've done training out of Boundary Bay as well, and I found the training in Langley (At both schools) to be more personal rather than me just being another fish in the sea.

[law7]

Thanks for the advices. I live in Richmond so I perfer using the boundary bay airport. I have heard from friends that are student pilots refering their schools. I just would like to know if anyone here knows about these schools and have any comments about them. I haven't visited these schools yet (I plan to visit very soon), but I just wanna know if anyone have heard anything about them.The schools I came down to are Pacific Flying Club,Montair, Pacific Professional Flight Training and Canadian Flight Centre. Thx.

[modi13]

PFC has the largest fleet and the most instructors, a relatively new and versatile sim, and three in-house flight test examiners. CFC is a smaller operation, but they seem to be well-run; they operate Cherokees, which are low-wing, and I find handle a bit heavier than Cessnas. Pro has a descent-sized fleet, but I've heard some bad things about the training. Stay away from Montair.

[HeavyG]

+1

[akoch]

That's my first post, but could not help it. I checked the Pacific Flying Club, did a fam flight and decided to pass on it. Reasons being (may be unrelated, so check it our yourself too) - it ws a very young instructor (200 hours), and subsequently you could tell he was not quite sure what to tell or teach you, and an old old (and dare I say crappy) Cessna 152. It just did not feel like flying, more like that collection of old outdated parts put together, just did not belong to the skies. I almost dropped the whole idea then.

Then I check the See Land Air - absolutely different experience altogetjer. Simply awesome planes (Diamond DA-20 and DA-40), my fam flight was the most rewarding experience (with MichaelP is an exceptional pilot). And I joined the school gladly, especially after experiencing this 30-year old Cessna 152 at previous school. But studying at the SeaLandAir proved to be a spotty experience at best. Most likely I was not just compatible with my instructor (would not name him), he would be late - easily 45 minutes or more for a lesson, or would cancel it at all because he did not feel like flying that day, or was tired, or did not have lunch, or need to worry about something else etc. You would drive 1.5 hours to the airport for the lesson, then to learn that your instructor just was not in the mood that day. All after waiting for 1 hour plus, then told to go home, no excuse no nothing. And that happened more than 7 times in my only 25 hours of flying. Alternatively when I would almost make this instructor to go with me he would 'pay back' in making the lesson rather miserable, which is quite miserable - OK, I am an incompetent pilot. And what is the most amazing this instructor has a wealth of knowledge, decades of experience, highly developed skills, and one could learn a lot (to say the least) form him. Very competent pilot. I can only assume I was a bad student, but it leaves a bad taste in you mouth.

Then I had to switch for another instructor, a very nice lady there. I learnt the most from her, and she has been extremely generous, helpful, and knowledgeable. I can't see a better instructor anywhere to be perfectly honest. At the end I sort of stopped taking lessons and even considering a different school, all because of my bitter experience prior there. But I don't think you can find better airplanes anywhere in Vancouver. So may be just take the younger instructors there and you may enjoy it a lot.

I might be looking to switch the school. I wish somebody else had the Diamonds here.

So this is my 2 cents....

Cheers,
Alex

[moocow]

Well I'm a product of CFC and the Cherokee but the most important thing is the instructor you're with, then follow by school policy. Pacific Flying Club got tons of Cessna but their weather minimums are stricter than CFC (please don't start a flame war over training weather minimums). Sealand Air looks pretty nice but I haven't rented from them yet, go see their office at Aberdeen Centre and apparently they have ground school there. Stay away from Montair, I have not run into one instructor that liked working there. They have a major contract with some Chinese airline to train their cadets so you probably won't get good service. I won't lie, CZBB can be a stressful place to fly out of. Not only packed to the gills with students, you also have to contend with broken English which force you to be on the look out for other people. Perfect time to start thinking since the VFR flying season is practically over now.

Seriously what kind of career are you looking at? Trying to join Cathay Pacific Cadet? PPL won't help give you an edge, I been there.

Modi which Cessna you comparing the Cherokee to? I find the PA28 better handling than the C172.

[modi13]

Mostly the 152; it handles like a sports car compared to the minivan of the 172 or Cherokee. Lighter is more manoeuvrable, and I can handle a 152 like an RC plane on final. I find that even the 172 is lighter on the controls than a Cherokee, which handles too much like a Seneca for an initial trainer for my liking. It plummets like a rock when you pull the power too.

[loopa]

I would personally stay away from CFC & I don't want to start a war here, but I've got some pretty good info on why you would want to stay away from there.

Then again, the choice of flight school is something very personal. Some people like certain schools, and others don't like certain schools. I'm one of the ones who don't like CFC.

Apparently there's a new owner; but there still are some old faces around that haven't changed much.


PM me for more details as I'm sure this thread will become a war otherwise.

[CarbHeat]

Good point Alex. Instructor compatibility isn't always a reason to switch schools.

Personally, I'm satisfied with Sea Land Air. Happy with my instructor and the whole atmosphere. Law7, have you taken a look at them? I don't see them in your "narrowed-down" list.

Best of luck,

A fellow Richmondite.

[canadapilot924]

I'm a product of CFC too, great school would definately recommend. Cherokees are a good stable platform and harder to grease on than a Cessna or Diamond (I've instructed in all 3). Old RH runs a great show (may have retired??) and his right hand lady kept everything in line.

[law7]

Then I check the See Land Air - absolutely different experience altogetjer. Simply awesome planes (Diamond DA-20 and DA-40), my fam flight was the most rewarding experience (with MichaelP is an exceptional pilot). And I joined the school gladly, especially after experiencing this 30-year old Cessna 152 at previous school. But studying at the SeaLandAir proved to be a spotty experience at best. Most likely I was not just compatible with my instructor (would not name him), he would be late - easily 45 minutes or more for a lesson, or would cancel it at all because he did not feel like flying that day, or was tired, or did not have lunch, or need to worry about something else etc. You would drive 1.5 hours to the airport for the lesson, then to learn that your instructor just was not in the mood that day. All after waiting for 1 hour plus, then told to go home, no excuse no nothing. And that happened more than 7 times in my only 25 hours of flying. Alternatively when I would almost make this instructor to go with me he would 'pay back' in making the lesson rather miserable, which is quite miserable - OK, I am an incompetent pilot. And what is the most amazing this instructor has a wealth of knowledge, decades of experience, highly developed skills, and one could learn a lot (to say the least) form him. Very competent pilot. I can only assume I was a bad student, but it leaves a bad taste in you mouth.

Then I had to switch for another instructor, a very nice lady there. I learnt the most from her, and she has been extremely generous, helpful, and knowledgeable. I can't see a better instructor anywhere to be perfectly honest. At the end I sort of stopped taking lessons and even considering a different school, all because of my bitter experience prior there. But I don't think you can find better airplanes anywhere in Vancouver. So may be just take the younger instructors there and you may enjoy it a lot.

I might be looking to switch the school. I wish somebody else had the Diamonds here.

So this is my 2 cents....

Cheers,
Alex

Thx for the details Alex. Would you mind pm me the name of the two instructors in your post?

Seriously what kind of career are you looking at? Trying to join Cathay Pacific Cadet? PPL won't help give you an edge, I been there.

Modi which Cessna you comparing the Cherokee to? I find the PA28 better handling than the C172.

Actually the CX cadet program was the very first thing I looked into when I decided that I want to take a career in aviation. I know that having a PPL doesnt mean much for joing the CX cadet, since many of my frds had PPL and only one made it thru and are flying as second officer for CX now. I will for sure apply for the CX program if that doesn't work out than return here continue on getting the CPL. Have you got any idea what the kind of quality the CX program is looking for? Becuase I can't really see the quality that the frd of mine who got accepted as compare to my frds that failed.

Good point Alex. Instructor compatibility isn't always a reason to switch schools.

Personally, I'm satisfied with Sea Land Air. Happy with my instructor and the whole atmosphere. Law7, have you taken a look at them? I don't see them in your "narrowed-down" list.

Best of luck,

A fellow Richmondite.

Actually I did took a look in them but a BCIT instructor gave me some bad reviews about the school and he also told me that the Diamond are not as common and easy to fly when compare to a Cherokee or Cessna and that is y it was not in my list. Do u mind pm me the name of your instructor. I will definitely give them a visit.

[modi13]

One of my coworkers flew the DA20 at SLA and said that it's a nice aircraft to fly, but the school's management doesn't have the best reputation. It's things like promising to get a DA42 for a couple of years (how many students and instructors have they been stringing along with that instead of letting them advance their training and careers with another school?) or posting an ad with a photo of a DA42, which they don't have, and a by-line saying that you can get your instrument rating on the newest equipment on the West Coast. The implication is that you can do so on their brand new twin, but when you read the fine-print you find it's just for renewals, in the sim which doesn't match any of the aircraft types they fly. MichaelP also made a comment to me in front of customers which demonstrated a complete lack of professionalism and common courtesy, and has posted job ads filled with his personal opinions while representing the company for which he works. I couldn't tell you anything about the quality of the individual instructors, only that the aircraft are nice, and the CFI is someone whose business practices I find deplorable.

[moocow]

Well sorry to burst your balloon but there are tons of instructors with fresh ratings and sub-300 hours. Also, not a lot of places have "brand-new" equipment. Go look around at the other airports and it's mostly Cessna 152 and 172 that's at least 25 years old. Sure it's nice to fly the newest toy but if most of the planes you end up flying are steam gauges, may not be the best idea to learn in glass cockpit.

As for CX, it's hard to say what kind of quality they're looking for. It's very common to see people trying to mold themselves to what the ideal CX candidate. Like they said on PPRUNE, there is no mold to follow, either you have it or you don't. Now as for my own personal failure, you can PM me about it since it's not the right place to explain in this thread.

Oh and I did fly with Pacific Rim out of Pitt for a month. Planes are clean and appeared to be well organized. The airport is less stressful compare to CZBB and extremely close the practice area. Plus they got a float plane if that's interests you. I stop flying with them because I found out my old instructor went back to CFC and I have a very good relationship with her.

[OntheNumbers]

I've flown with all of the above at ZBB, except for CFC, so can't comment on them. The outfit I'd never go back to is Montair. The instructor at the time was very nice, but the guy in charge always seemed angry about something.

I like Pro a little more than PFC because they are a little more flexible with their equipment, but// along with the flexibility comes responsibility. I've been out of it for a while now and I wonder whether the stricter regulations at PFC are in reaction to past students who bent the rules too much. PFC has the largest fleet, mind you.

OTN

[katana_instructor]

BCIT instructor gave me some bad reviews about the school and he also told me that the Diamond are not as common and easy to fly when compare to a Cherokee or Cessna and that is y it was not in my list

Being a Diamond instructor myself, I strongly disagree with this BCIT instructor. I believe that diamond is a perfectly nice aircraft to fly. I was trained with BCIT as well and know the Cessna pretty well. I also have some hours on piper before but I think that nothing is as good and as easy to fly as a diamond aircraft. After flying the diamond for a year, I did a summer job flying Cessna and I didn't enjoy it as much as I did before. Once you get a taste of good aircraft, it is very hard to go back to some old aircraft.

Instead of listening to some of the rumors on this forum, what you can do is try out different flying school. As you can tell, some rumors are not accurate about certain flying schools. Most schools have intro flight that you can do. This will give you an idea of the school atmosphere, procedure, staff knowledge…etc.
Give it a try!

[C-FABC]

where ever you go just stay away from a place called Montair at zbb.

[skyhawk172]

Stay away from Montair, I have not run into one instructor that liked working there.

geez. what is with that place?

[Big Pistons Forever]

I think all instructors have opinions on what is the best aircraft to learn to fly in. Personally I think the C 150/152 make is best of the commonly available trainers and I do not particularly care for the Katana series or Cherokees. BUT the type of aircraft you learn to fly on has IMO the least impact on how well you are trained. The quality of the instructor has, by far, the biggest impact on the kind of pilot you will become. This quality manifests itself in several forms. One is the that he/she has mastered the art of piloting an aircraft (that is the hands and feet aspect), another is the abilty to convey information in a way that is understandable and the patience to ensure it is hoisted aboard. Finally enthusiasm, personal organization, and a sense of humour are highly desirable. Unfortunately finding a good instructor can be a bit of trial and error exercise but when you have found one don't let him/her go !

[katana_instructor]

the type of aircraft you learn to fly on has IMO the least impact on how well you are trained. The quality of the instructor has, by far, the biggest impact on the kind of pilot you will become.

Strongly Agree! I am lucky to have couple good instructors teaching me when I was a private pilot... It really make a big difference.