Pilots Support Retirement

[Mechanic787]

...back to the EMJ. Enjoy it and i don't believe that falls under the CHRT guidelines.

You should have a look at Section 10 of the Canadian Human Rights Act. Moreover, you might want to have a look at some of the other sections of the Act as well. If the mandatory retirement exemption under 15(1)(c) is not applicable (as the Tribunal found, in its 2009 decision) any form of discrimination on the basis of an arbitrary age is then prohibited.

In short, any discriminatory action related to the arbitrary age of 60 (or for that matter, any other age) is prohibited under the Act. Where this will be most noticeable is not in the reinstatement of already-terminated employees, but in the cease order against Air Canada forcing it to stop terminating the employment of individuals at age 60. Age 60 will thus become a non-event, so far as rights under the collective agreement are concerned.

For the life of me, I have no idea why your union is not advising you of these basic facts. If they are obvious to me, as an outsider, they should be obvious to you, as an insider; these facts will significantly affect your future, so they should be second nature to you. Obviously they are not.

[Localizer]

I thought the environment at Air Canada was toxic before all this ... now you'll need a Hazmat suit just to get in the flight-deck.

[yycflyguy]

I thought the environment at Air Canada was toxic before all this ... now you'll need a Hazmat suit just to get in the flight-deck.

paahhleeeze. There is a big difference between debating on an anonymous forum and what happens in a professional environment. Everyone is smart enough to realize if there are differing opinions to just check them at the door before you check in.

[accumulous]

paahhleeeze. There is a big difference between debating on an anonymous forum and what happens in a professional environment. Everyone is smart enough to realize if there are differing opinions to just check them at the door before you check in.

That is entirely correct. Air Canada pilots and pilots in general have one thing in common and that is when they strap themselves into the sharp end of the airframe, it's a serious business. I highly doubt there is any Air Canada pilot who does not fit that picture. I would ride in the back end of an airplane flown by Air Canada pilots anywhere in the world, any time. Regardless of the nature of this issue and other issues that continually come up, I think the Air Canada pilot is first and foremost a real performer. and safety is the number 1 priority. No problem there. This age 60 business is a hard thing for some guys to get their noggins around but at the start of the day if they're not comfortable with it they have the luxury of excusing themselves from the flight deck under the applicable provisions of the CARS and they're likely smart enough to know when to do that.

I also do not think it matters 1 bit who comprises the flight deck on any given day. Most of the guys have been through at least 1 very difficult merger and flight decks have been populated by a lot of different personal attitudes but at the end of the day the Captain calls the shots and invariably sets the stage for the CRM environment and they all handle it with a high degree of professionalism as they are trained to do. When the dust settles on this age 60 business and there are mixed flight decks, despite what you might read on this forum, when the boys and girls walk down the finger to the ship the sole purpose will be to get it to point B in the safest manner possible.

[Localizer]

paahhleeeze. There is a big difference between debating on an anonymous forum and what happens in a professional environment. Everyone is smart enough to realize if there are differing opinions to just check them at the door before you check in.

Really? .. AC/Cdn merger? .. That sorta professional environment? In the end the "typical Air Canada Pilot" after he takes his space suit off is no different then the average joe. They have emotions and can't help but let them spill out from time to time. Its been seen at many airlines during the countless issues that arise, even in the flight-deck. So paaahhleeeeze .. next time shovel that crap somewhere else.

Loc

[yycflyguy]

paahhleeeze. There is a big difference between debating on an anonymous forum and what happens in a professional environment. Everyone is smart enough to realize if there are differing opinions to just check them at the door before you check in.

Really? .. AC/Cdn merger? .. That sorta professional environment? In the end the "typical Air Canada Pilot" after he takes his space suit off is no different then the average joe. They have emotions and can't help but let them spill out from time to time. Its been seen at many airlines during the countless issues that arise, even in the flight-deck. So paaahhleeeeze .. next time shovel that crap somewhere else.

Loc

Please explain exactly when you were in an AC flight deck when one of these "issues" (particularly the AC/CDN merger) was presented to you that detracted from the task at hand.

[Localizer]

Please explain exactly when you were in an AC flight deck when one of these "issues" (particularly the AC/CDN merger) was presented to you that detracted from the task at hand.

I have not witnessed this take place. I can only go on hear-say from those that were heavily involved, but my point stay's the same. You are trying to tell me that the "typical Air Canada pilot" is special in some way to compress their feelings and emotions once the job is at hand, and for the most part sure, lots of people can and will but not all.

Don't misunderstand what i'm saying here .. I don't believe that these issues would lead to some catastrophic event or incident. All i'm talking about here are two individuals getting into a heated debate about the issues while at work.

[yycflyguy]

Understood. You didn't actually witness it in the flight deck. Only assumptions made from hearsay.

[Localizer]

Understood. You didn't actually witness it in the flight deck. Only assumptions made from hearsay.

YYCflyguy .. I like your use of misdirection ..

I would still like to know what makes the "typical Air Canada pilot" immune to emotion.

[Rotten Apple #1]

I wouldn't call it misdirection; perhaps 'qualification' might be a better choice.

[yycflyguy]

Understood. You didn't actually witness it in the flight deck. Only assumptions made from hearsay.

YYCflyguy .. I like your use of misdirection ..

I would still like to know what makes the "typical Air Canada pilot" immune to emotion.

Misdirection? I hope to follow in Ray's footsteps and become a lawyer... oh, and I have emotion. Why just last night I cried like a little baby when I found out I didn't win 6/49. Nobody ever said we were immune to the issues, just look at the ACPA forum getting shut down and the banning of individuals here and Pprune. Obvious emotions. Like you pointed out, the merger was, and still is, a hot topic for some. However, I have never witnessed, nor have I heard of guys jeopardizing a mission just cuz they don't see eye to eye on the politics of the job.

That said, you know what grinds my gears? Captains who wont buy the FO beer OR coffee on the layover. TIGHTWADS WITH ALLIGATOR ARMS CAN'T REACH THEIR WALLET!!

[Localizer]

Misdirection? I hope to follow in Ray's footsteps and become a lawyer... oh, and I have emotion. Why just last night I cried like a little baby when I found out I didn't win 6/49. Nobody ever said we were immune to the issues, just look at the ACPA forum getting shut down and the banning of individuals here and Pprune. Obvious emotions. Like you pointed out, the merger was, and still is, a hot topic for some. However, I have never witnessed, nor have I heard of guys jeopardizing a mission just cuz they don't see eye to eye on the politics of the job.

That said, you know what grinds my gears? Captains who wont buy the FO beer OR coffee on the layover. TIGHTWADS WITH ALLIGATOR ARMS CAN'T REACH THEIR WALLET!!

I cry twice a week for the same reason .. 6/49 and lotto max .. I'd like to think no one would jeopardize the "mission" .. but i've heard of lots of refusals to fly with certain individuals. (i'm talking merger, not age 60) but could you see this happening in the future? .. Time will tell ..

And agreed .. in regards to the tightwads ..

[yycflyguy]

Misdirection? I hope to follow in Ray's footsteps and become a lawyer... oh, and I have emotion. Why just last night I cried like a little baby when I found out I didn't win 6/49. Nobody ever said we were immune to the issues, just look at the ACPA forum getting shut down and the banning of individuals here and Pprune. Obvious emotions. Like you pointed out, the merger was, and still is, a hot topic for some. However, I have never witnessed, nor have I heard of guys jeopardizing a mission just cuz they don't see eye to eye on the politics of the job.

That said, you know what grinds my gears? Captains who wont buy the FO beer OR coffee on the layover. TIGHTWADS WITH ALLIGATOR ARMS CAN'T REACH THEIR WALLET!!

I cry twice a week for the same reason .. 6/49 and lotto max .. I'd like to think no one would jeopardize the "mission" .. but i've heard of lots of refusals to fly with certain individuals. (i'm talking merger, not age 60) but could you see this happening in the future? .. Time will tell ..

And agreed .. in regards to the tightwads ..

If individuals are so emotional that they refuse to fly with other certain individuals I am glad they took a "personal" day and avoided the confrontation. Keep it outta the flight deck.