Tips for float flying on the West Coast

[The Old Fogducker]

After a few of our pilots stumbled into fog banks or snow showers after being berated into taking off in super-crummy weather ... going to zero-zero vis in the blink of an eye because you were in it before you could detect it coming up and take evasive action, it took a "strike" by our pilots before management pressure in all its most negative possible forms ceased ... all of us agreeing that we wouldn't initiate a departure in less than 1/2 mile vis ..... one quarter of the minimum legal requirement.

Part of the withdrawal of our services was that we were going to go to the media and contact the company's customers directly to explain our concerns ... the lack of response from Mgt required me calling a friend who was a news anchor on a Vancouver TV station while I was sitting in the Ops Mgr's office. He finally backed off from his bluff and bluster when I was placed on hold waiting for my buddy to pick up the extension.

When we all started flying in 1/2 mile or greater, it seemed like we'd gone on vacation.

The Old Fogducker

[buck82]

This accident and a couple of others are very fresh in my memory, I read the report and its was sickening.

Case in point would be to refresh your memory of the Grumman Goose fatal crash out of Vancouver and have a look at the weather he departed in and the weather enroute.

Laughable.

I doubt you've been employed with every operator out on the coast. Don't kid yourself, this stuff (pushing weather) does happen, and will continue to happen as it always has for the past 50 years.

Very true, I have not, and also do not plan to be employed by every operator on the coast. That you find my post laughable intrigues me. You seem to be saying that because this has happened for the past 50yrs, so it should for the next 50. How can you as a professional pilot condone reckless and negligent operation of aircraft? Or excuse it because of past practices?

My hat is off to The Old Fogducker who actually had the balls to do something about it. The only remaining question is why go out in 1/2 mile if the min was 2 miles? Surely (again) the press would have a field day; especially if it was shown that Transport Canada was not doing its multi-million dollar job to deal with problem operators.

[Cat Driver]

The only remaining question is why go out in 1/2 mile if the min was 2 miles? Surely (again) the press would have a field day; especially if it was shown that Transport Canada was not doing its multi-million dollar job to deal with problem operators.

For many decades I did everything in my power to improve flight safety including taking TCCA to court for refusing to enforce the law in an airline.

Never, ever have I experienced any back up from TCCA, however should a pilot try and expose any operator who is operating outside the law by going to the news media you are almost certain to be unemployed.

If you are interested in how TC works all you need do is read all the stuff I have posted on Avcanada and see where it got me even after I won my legal battle with them.

There is only one person who can ensure safe flight and ensure you stay within the law.

"""YOU """

[El Capitan]

There have been three times during my career when I had to land in virtually zreo zero visibility conditions.

The first time was Penticton in a Tri gear Beech 18 at night .

The second time was in Whitehorse in a DC3 in ice fog on one engine.

The third time was in Niamey Niger in a Harmattan dust storm in a PBY.

On each occasion I was on an IFR flight plan and the weather went to hell and I had no choice but land.

I was taught how to land zero zero by one of the best pilots I ever met, so that should I ever have to I could do it with confidence.


Hey, Cat. Is there a Coles notes version of what you were taught for this situation, for us young-ins?

[Cat Driver]

Hey, Cat. Is there a Coles notes version of what you were taught for this situation, for us young-ins?

Not to my knowledge.

My training was really quite simple and uncomplicated, the pilot who trained me just put a map in the windshield in front of me and I flew the ILS normally except at the later stage of the approach I was set up in a glassy water attitude and held the center line using the localizer needle until I contacted the runway.

If at any time I got off the runway the other pilot just tapped my hand on the power levers and executed a missed approach and took the map away so I could see how far off the center line I had gotten.

Really not to difficult a way to train.

[West Coast Swell]

I have not posted on Avcanada for a very long time. However .. this topic is special for me and I felt it only appropriate to make my West Coast comment.

So here goes.

My suggestion to the new guy is just this.

Talk to the line pilots and ask them questions. Usually ... you are line indocted at each destination and then slowly feed into the system. I don't know which part of the coast you are going to or who you are being hired by ? North .. Mid or South coast operator... they all have equal operating dynamics just not as severe the further south you go. My advice is to talk to the line pilots once you get there... they will know best. Be open minded and listen to what they say.... If you are wise enough to listen ... apply what they are telling you into your daily flight schedule and all will be fine. Have a plan with your fellow pilots on the shitty days. Where I worked ... if you where the new guy ... we would all go to the alternate if the weather was poor. Rather than only you going to the alternate because you where not comfortable to land at the poor weather destination. It's called sticking together ... ie .. being a team. Again ... if I was still online on midcoast and the weather was marginal or the wind was blowing the wrong way for the lodge move that we where scheduled to do... I would probably walk up to you and tell you ... dude ... today is looking like an alternate day. Usually the most experienced pilot goes first when the weather is marginal and decides if it is possible re company weather wind minimums. Always respecting the weakest link which would be you. So really ... I don't think you have too much to worry about it. Any quality operator on the coast will have a procedure (SOP) for poor weather operations. I can say for a fact there are no operators on the Coast looking to scare their passengers, risk damaging aircraft or are willingly to push the new guy out into a crappy conditions. The challenging poor weather conditions that evereyone talks about on the B.C. coast are usually flown by the most experienced pilots first and they make the call weather you junior pilots should come out and play. And when it gets really crappy ... no one goes. So what am I getting at here.... My summary is as follows ... remember ... First hand experience is the key to your safety and survival. Listen and learn... don't have a know it all attitude... be open to problem solving solutions. If your asked to do something that you don't think is safe ... don't just not do it ... identify why you don't want to do it and talk it out with the experienced pilots. Coastal Float flying was great for me. It made me who I am now. I survived 10,000 hours of Mid Coast time on a 180, 185, beaver, turbine beaver, amphib beaver, turbine otter , Goose and was fortunate to have learned from the Best. The best is still up there ... If you have been fortunate to be hired to fly floats on the coast my recommendation is to Look ... Listen and Learn ....you will have great time. It's been done before!

[West Coast Swell]

After having had a chance to re - read what I wrote above ... I can see I have possibly opened the door to negative comments re .. poor weather flying. As I sit here and ponder the negative comments to follow ... I can say this. In my time as a line pilot on the Coast I have been immediately impacted by the tragic loss of many lives via plane crash. Many close Co- workers ... friends ... regular trusting passengers have lost there lives due to poor decision making ..... not only have I as a line pilot been a witness to the death and destruction that arrives from CFIT ... so too has management. Ultimately ... after the tragic loss is experienced by the families and friends who suffered from the accident... management is left with the crisis of creating new policy to never .. ever .. permit this from happening again. In my circle of life... I can say for a fact .. proactive solutions have been implemented to reduce ... if not eliminate the risk of CFIT by all mid coast operators after every instance. Some people my role there eyes at reading this but its the truth. Take it from a Line Pilot who has first hand inside exposure. One crash .. two crashes ... three whatever.... the inevitable fact is that after each accident the world becomes a safer place for the travelling public. At a huge cost I agree. Where I work.... I'm not going to get into specific policy here but .... both management and line crew have since sat up and taken a hard line look at why! From my experience the Mid Coast operators have changed their SOP's to mitigate the "chance". Some operators make you sign a termination of employment document .. others have minimums published in there SOP's. Other operators just say no. Where I work the poor weather flying days of the past are very much just that. We do not do it anymore. So to end this email to the new guy about to begin flying the B.C. Coast.... If your lucky enough to be hired by a pro-active company like the one I work for and you are wise enough to respect the operational parameters and restrictions that have been put in place re poor weather flying by the operator I think you will have a great summer flying floats on the B.C. Coast.

Ps. I kinda went all over here on this posting sorry. I know what its like ready long postings. But as I said earlier, this topic is special to me. And I know there are a few people out there in the world who would appreciate what I have commented on re float plane issues on the B.C. Coast.

[DHCdriver]

I'll listen to long winded expierenced guys any day, Keep it up, I really enjoy your posts. Fly Safe.

[180]

Ya, good stuff West Coast Swell...

[beaverbob]

Bump, Because everybody can use a friendly December reminder.
Bob