Hi guys!
Can someone tell me what is the correct head position to maintain during a turn? I'm interested especially in steep turns. My instructor told me you have to maintain your head perpendicular to longitudinal axis of the airplane but I heard instructors say it is necessary to tilt your head opposite to the direction of turn, somehow perpendicular to horizon.
Thank you very much!
Head position in turns
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YYZSaabGuy
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Re: Head position in turns
Two points:
1. Keep your head on a swivel - maintaining a look-out for other aircraft is always
important, including (and particularly) during a turn in a high-wing aircraft; and
2. Keep it right where it is when flying straight and level, i.e. don't tilt it to try and
somehow compensate for the bank angle. From TC's FTM (4th edition): "Posture is
important in all aircraft manoeuvres, but especially so in turns. Sit comfortably upright;
do not lean away from the centre of the turn, but do not make a conscious effort to
keep your body stiffly vertical. Relax and ride with the turn. Stiffening up or continually
changing sitting positions affects visual references and may cause handling of the controls
to become tense and erratic."
1. Keep your head on a swivel - maintaining a look-out for other aircraft is always
important, including (and particularly) during a turn in a high-wing aircraft; and
2. Keep it right where it is when flying straight and level, i.e. don't tilt it to try and
somehow compensate for the bank angle. From TC's FTM (4th edition): "Posture is
important in all aircraft manoeuvres, but especially so in turns. Sit comfortably upright;
do not lean away from the centre of the turn, but do not make a conscious effort to
keep your body stiffly vertical. Relax and ride with the turn. Stiffening up or continually
changing sitting positions affects visual references and may cause handling of the controls
to become tense and erratic."
Re: Head position in turns
Also, I have another problem and if you don't mind I will post it here, an instructor told me to push, press the yoke a little forward before entering a turn and for me it makes no sense. When I asked him for an explanation, he said something about the adverse effect of controls or smth like that and I assumed I have a lack of knowledge and didn't want to contradict him or so, but I searched for this and I didn't find any related subject. Have you heard about this technique?
Thank you!
Thank you!
Re: Head position in turns
Pushing the yoke makes no sense.... unless you're trimmed wrong. You should probably ask him to clarify, cuz it's probably just a misunderstanding. Ask him to explain until you get it.
The reason you tilt your head in a car when you turn is because of centrifugal force (Pedantic physicists: you tell Beckman-Coulter and Eppendorf that they've been making machines to create a force that doesn't exist then!) In an airplane, if you're properly coordinated, there should be no lateral force, thus no need to tilt your head. In fact, tiling your head will make it more disorienting. I think most people find this natural in that the lack of a lateral force means they automatically don't tilt their head.
The reason you tilt your head in a car when you turn is because of centrifugal force (Pedantic physicists: you tell Beckman-Coulter and Eppendorf that they've been making machines to create a force that doesn't exist then!) In an airplane, if you're properly coordinated, there should be no lateral force, thus no need to tilt your head. In fact, tiling your head will make it more disorienting. I think most people find this natural in that the lack of a lateral force means they automatically don't tilt their head.
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Masters Off
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Re: Head position in turns
One thing i've picked up.
Regardless of the movement, there's a fundimental concept that should be taught:
When moving the controls (read: control column, stick, rudders,whatever) Look forward. At the horizon, not the panel, straight forward.
Once you've stabilized (i.e. straight and level, in the turn, even inverted) as long as you're stable, you can look wherever you want.
Of course, glance back at your horizon often to make sure you've continued the position. Things like trim/power being set properly and you not subconsiously adding pressure to any control column/stick/peddle. Once something changes, so will your horizon, and by looking forward you will recognize and fix that change.
As for tilting the head, I don't believe it's necessary. Just like you wouldn't tilt your head with the artificial horizon in the IFR world (or at least no IFR flying I've ever seen goes that way). A horizon is a horizon. So the same rules apply.
Regardless of the movement, there's a fundimental concept that should be taught:
When moving the controls (read: control column, stick, rudders,whatever) Look forward. At the horizon, not the panel, straight forward.
Once you've stabilized (i.e. straight and level, in the turn, even inverted) as long as you're stable, you can look wherever you want.
Of course, glance back at your horizon often to make sure you've continued the position. Things like trim/power being set properly and you not subconsiously adding pressure to any control column/stick/peddle. Once something changes, so will your horizon, and by looking forward you will recognize and fix that change.
As for tilting the head, I don't believe it's necessary. Just like you wouldn't tilt your head with the artificial horizon in the IFR world (or at least no IFR flying I've ever seen goes that way). A horizon is a horizon. So the same rules apply.
Re: Head position in turns
Well I guess it depends if you're offensive or defensive. If you're offensive you kind of naturally look at the target while selecting gun and pulling lead. Couldn't tell you what it's like being defensive, AuxBatOn is the guy to talk to about that. He seems to find himself in those situations quite often...andrew172 wrote: Can someone tell me what is the correct head position to maintain during a turn? I'm interested especially in steep turns. My instructor told me you have to maintain your head perpendicular to longitudinal axis of the airplane but I heard instructors say it is necessary to tilt your head opposite to the direction of turn, somehow perpendicular to horizon.
Re: Head position in turns
On top of my shoulders at the end on my neck has always worked for me.
Why do people/instructors have to complicate things? Do what works for you. The body position is more relevant than head position.
Why do people/instructors have to complicate things? Do what works for you. The body position is more relevant than head position.
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Colonel Sanders
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Re: Head position in turns
Looking left at the sight line on my canopywhat is the correct head position to maintain during a turn?
Re: Head position in turns
Most of the time (although this is difficult for some) your head should be outside of your ass.
Re: Head position in turns
Is this a serious question? Talk about the dumbing down of this industry! Your instructor's head is nestled deep within his anal cavity. If you can't figure out where to place your head, don't ride Greyhound!andrew172 wrote:Hi guys!
Can someone tell me what is the correct head position to maintain during a turn? I'm interested especially in steep turns. My instructor told me you have to maintain your head perpendicular to longitudinal axis of the airplane but I heard instructors say it is necessary to tilt your head opposite to the direction of turn, somehow perpendicular to horizon.
Thank you very much!
Re: Head position in turns
Where are you learning to fly. Both your questions border on the bizarre to me. Why would one be told to push the yoke when commencing a turn? The head position question has me shaking mine.andrew172 wrote:Also, I have another problem and if you don't mind I will post it here, an instructor told me to push, press the yoke a little forward before entering a turn and for me it makes no sense. When I asked him for an explanation, he said something about the adverse effect of controls or smth like that and I assumed I have a lack of knowledge and didn't want to contradict him or so, but I searched for this and I didn't find any related subject. Have you heard about this technique?
Thank you!
Re: Head position in turns
Omg thats funny! I just about fell off my chair I was laughing so hard. Good one Doc!Doc wrote:
Is this a serious question? Talk about the dumbing down of this industry! Your instructor's head is nestled deep within his anal cavity. If you can't figure out where to place your head, don't ride Greyhound!
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YYZSaabGuy
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Re: Head position in turns
Holy crap - some angry people here today....didn't AvCanada used to be
a place, a long time ago, where a student pilot could come on, ask questions,
and get some pointers from more experienced guys without being ridiculed?
As a matter of interest, TC for what it's worth thought that head
positioning during turns is a matter of enough importance to warrant discussion
in its FTM. So...I didn't find Andrew172's question on that point unreasonable. I
also doubt he's the first one to ask.
For an alleged "profession", it's interesting that some people on here can't
maintain even a veneer of civility on an on-line discussion with a colleague or
fellow aviation enthusiast who's posing a serious question. Some of you people
must be a treat in a face to face meeting.
a place, a long time ago, where a student pilot could come on, ask questions,
and get some pointers from more experienced guys without being ridiculed?
As a matter of interest, TC for what it's worth thought that head
positioning during turns is a matter of enough importance to warrant discussion
in its FTM. So...I didn't find Andrew172's question on that point unreasonable. I
also doubt he's the first one to ask.
For an alleged "profession", it's interesting that some people on here can't
maintain even a veneer of civility on an on-line discussion with a colleague or
fellow aviation enthusiast who's posing a serious question. Some of you people
must be a treat in a face to face meeting.
Re: Head position in turns
You have basically three things you have to look at while turning VFR so youll need to adjust to all three . First you need to be looking for traffic and that meas looking into the turn, in some planes leaning forward makes that easier. You need to be looking at the horizon for bank and pitch reference and the odd look at you altimeter airspeed ball etc. so there is no single position. You need to adjust as required.
Re: Head position in turns
LOL and even worse ...could you imagine some these people as your flying instructor ? BRUTAL !!!YYZSaabGuy wrote:Holy crap - some angry people here today....didn't AvCanada used to be
a place, a long time ago, where a student pilot could come on, ask questions,
and get some pointers from more experienced guys without being ridiculed?
As a matter of interest, TC for what it's worth thought that head
positioning during turns is a matter of enough importance to warrant discussion
in its FTM. So...I didn't find Andrew172's question on that point unreasonable. I
also doubt he's the first one to ask.
For an alleged "profession", it's interesting that some people on here can't
maintain even a veneer of civility on an on-line discussion with a colleague or
fellow aviation enthusiast who's posing a serious question. Some of you people
must be a treat in a face to face meeting.
Re: Head position in turns
...and NEVER EVER EVER should you (in the turn) fixate on the neckline of the blouse of the hottie you invited to sit in the right seat. Don't do that. Much.cgzro wrote:You have basically three things you have to look at while turning VFR so youll need to adjust to all three . First you need to be looking for traffic and that meas looking into the turn, in some planes leaning forward makes that easier. You need to be looking at the horizon for bank and pitch reference and the odd look at you altimeter airspeed ball etc. so there is no single position. You need to adjust as required.
<psst. Doc. You forgot to shake your fist and tell him to get the hell of your lawn!>
g
