Two old floatplanes grounded west coast

[CoastalDog]

Heard through the grapevine that two very old floaplanes were recently grounded. According to the source this may have been due to parts being replaced but not written in the logs. A secondary issue may have been that the parts aren't being made anymore and thus there's a question as to whether the replacements are even approved.

Without naming names this company probably has the oldest fleet of floatplanes on the west coast.

Could it be that these beautiful, classic machines are starting to reach their life limit?

[jspitfire]

Also heard this. Would be sad to see them go, but yes they've certainly served their time.

[Bobby868]

Ya I heard this too. Word travels fast in the floatplane world. I hope it's just a minor paperwork issue and not the final demise of one of the great flying boats of the century.

Here's the best write up I've seen on these classic machines. Steve Harvey the owner of Harvey Flying Service in Alaska does a great job of explaining why it's so hard to keep these machines maintained.

http://www.alaskadispatch.com/article/g ... d?page=0,0

It's 4 great pages of reading.

[Bulawrench]

Unsupported aging aircraft is a growing problem.The Beaver is heading down that road too.With 14 to 16 week wait times for parts from the manuafacture it is getting harder to aquire certified parts.

[J31]

So why the secret. What airplanes are we talking about? BEECH 18, Norseman, Goose, Husky, Mars?

[jpilot77]

The Goose.

[Bobby868]

So why the secret. What airplanes are we talking about? BEECH 18, Norseman, Goose, Husky, Mars?

It's no secret son. Try following the link provided.

I know it's alot of effort to right click a link but if you can muster the energy you too will be admitted into the super duper top secret club. Perhaps you need one of those energy drinks that the young kids are drinking now a days to give you the required stamina to shuffle that mouse and push one extra button.

Sorry, sometimes I just can't resist but it's not my fault some people just make it too easy.

[bmc]

What are the registrations of the affected planes? I assume they're Pacific Coastal's machines.

[aviationsensation]

All 4. Parts are useless without certification. Even when they are sealed in the original packaging.

[Rowdy]

The Gooses! A little birdy told me they've got a couple of otters lined up on amphibs to fill in for now. I know where at least one of them is coming from too

[CamAero]

All 4. Parts are useless without certification, even if they are sealed in the original packaging.

Aviation Sensation, what sort of parts sealed in the original packaging would you be talking about? I would really like to hear the specifics of TCCA's grievances? These must be airframe parts as the engine is still well supported.

There is a process for inspecting undocumented parts:
http://www.tc.gc.ca/eng/civilaviation/r ... c-1898.htm

There is also a provision to build your own "made" parts and legally install them on an aircraft:
571.06(c) subject to subsection (6), where parts are no longer in production by the manufacturer of the part, or an authorised representative, and the type design data for the part is not available, the design data used for the making of the part may be established by inspecting and testing to determine the correct:
(i) materials;
(ii) dimensions;
(iii) hardness and temper;
(iv) surface finish; and
(v) protective coatings.

There is also very simple provision for the installation of used parts; the part must be traceable to its last airworthy installation. IE, "Control Yolk, P/N XXXXXX, Removed Serviceable G-21~ C-GPCD"

With any luck at all, they will get it all sorted out. My suspicion is that some jaundiced little dwarf in TC just wants make a name for himself.


C.A.

[Road Trip]

All 4. Parts are useless without certification, even if they are sealed in the original packaging.

My suspicion is that some jaundiced little dwarf in TC just wants make a name for himself.

C.A.

That's a strong statement given the age of these planes. I would think that it's not too far of stretch to believe that honestly the planes are getting old and that it's becoming increasingly harder to keep them airworthy.

I know in the case of the Martin Mars certain parts that aren't available are being manufactured. However there are a few differences. The main one being that the cost to go through that process for the Mars is off set by what the plane will generate in revenue. Where as the Goose is probably barely covering expense on the few sched and charter runs that it does so spending thousands to get each part approved is not financially viable. 2) The Mars was not carrying passengers on scheduled service. I believe PASCO runs a sched service with the Goose so TC will have a higher bar for any sort of specialty part and approval process.

I know people that have spent 12 months and thousands of dollars to get approval to lengthen a bolt by 5 mm on an STC that they already held and had approved. So although there is a process and it sounds simple, TC has a way of turning it all into a nightmare.

[J31]

The Goose.

Ah thank you! A classic flying boat!

[J31]

So why the secret. What airplanes are we talking about? BEECH 18, Norseman, Goose, Husky, Mars?

It's no secret son. Try following the link provided.

I know it's alot of effort to right click a link but if you can muster the energy you too will be admitted into the super duper top secret club. Perhaps you need one of those energy drinks that the young kids are drinking now a days to give you the required stamina to shuffle that mouse and push one extra button.

Sorry, sometimes I just can't resist but it's not my fault some people just make it too easy.

Classy response Feel better that you belittled me?

I have been around the patch a few times as I'm sure you have. No need to be a jerk.

The topic posted by CoastalDog noted a floatplane on the west coast where as you posted a link to a story about Grumman flying boats in Alaska. Hence the question what aircraft was being discussed. I'm sure you are wise enough to know the difference between a floatplane and a flying boat. I do having spent a few decades maintaining and flying many types.

Hopefully the West Coast operator will find a solution to keep the Grumman Goose in the air.

PS; You can save a step with the mouse and just left click, or as a lot of folks who have moved beyond the mouse and simply tap ones finger on the link.

[Bobby868]

Yep I do. And even better that I managed to get you to respond.

Now back to our regular thread.

PASCO had their Goose up for sale, I recall seeing them listed as recently a year ago. They had been for sale for a long time, I assume they didn't have any serious takers as all the machines are still registered to PASCO. I tried looking for them today but google search isn't finding the listings. Did they give up trying to sell them?

[ragbagflyer]

http://www.pacificcoastal.com/id/221/ne ... /News.html

[zeppelin]

Bobby 868......'SON' why do you always come across like such a friggin dick head...I figure all those years as a class 3 instructor drove you nuts and the relatively few years youv'e had as a working pilot,has made you feel some what important..and it's gone to your head....cut the crap....your no better than anyone else....
this is not meant to belittle instuctors...I needed a few myself....when Bobby was a little kid...my dig,Son.

[Beefitarian]

I see everyone is pretty emotional about this, as am I.


The worst part in my opinion is we had no warning. I'd like to have had a chance to ride in one of these fine classic planes.

[LeakyFloats]

Any news on the plans for PASCO's float fleet? Still just using the Beavers or has there been talk of a new type?

[angry inch]

PCC says this...

http://www.pilotcareercentre.com/Air-Ca ... l+Airlines

[Beefitarian]

So where are those gooses going? It certainly would be nice to see them continue flying but maybe not very realistic. Especially in the current economic climate.

There is a wonderfully restored Albatross for sale right now though for what I believe might be way less than it would cost to keep those gooses in flying shape.

http://www.controller.com/listingsdetai ... 175336.htm

Then you'd have to maintain it though. Plus it would use more fuel. ~sigh~

[Grummanman]

Sad news indeed, was lucky enogh to go for a ride with them a few years ago. Darn shame. Anyone know if there are any piston Geese still being used commercially in the world any more? I'm lucky enough to still be flying for what is most likely the only commercial operator of the mallards left. Other than us, and a few albatrosses scattered around the place it looks like the days are almost up for the Grumman flying boat.