Any info on RCAF would be appreciated
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Any info on RCAF would be appreciated
So I have done tons of research, called friends of friends who are in the RCAF, the whole nine yards. I am just trying to collect as much info as possible before I might have to make a big decision in a couple months. I have the interview, aptitude test, and medical coming up next week. Any help/information/tips would be appreciated.
Just a little background on myself, im a green fo working up north, operating a turbine very seasonally right now. Obviously like most newbies frustrated with how things are going.
Anyways any advice is appreciated, and I have looked through the search function and read most related topics already
Just a little background on myself, im a green fo working up north, operating a turbine very seasonally right now. Obviously like most newbies frustrated with how things are going.
Anyways any advice is appreciated, and I have looked through the search function and read most related topics already
Re: Any info on RCAF would be appreciated
What trade are you applying for?kraze wrote:So I have done tons of research, called friends of friends who are in the RCAF, the whole nine yards. I am just trying to collect as much info as possible before I might have to make a big decision in a couple months. I have the interview, aptitude test, and medical coming up next week. Any help/information/tips would be appreciated.
Just a little background on myself, im a green fo working up north, operating a turbine very seasonally right now. Obviously like most newbies frustrated with how things are going.
Anyways any advice is appreciated, and I have looked through the search function and read most related topics already
Re: Any info on RCAF would be appreciated
sorry i should have specified, I would be applying to be a pilot
Re: Any info on RCAF would be appreciated
I'm happy to try and answer whatever questions you have on the subject, you'll have to be specific though.
Now is a great time to join, the backlogs are almost gone, hell there are even some bypass guys going straight from BMOQ to Moose Jaw.
Now is a great time to join, the backlogs are almost gone, hell there are even some bypass guys going straight from BMOQ to Moose Jaw.
Consider it training for things to come...kraze wrote:Obviously like most newbies frustrated with how things are going.
Re: Any info on RCAF would be appreciated
I guess what I am mostly looking for right now are the negative aspects. I have been talking to recruters a lot and friends of friends in the military who are loving it.
What I would like is to hear about it from somebody who didnt have a good experience and why that was.
What I would like is to hear about it from somebody who didnt have a good experience and why that was.
Re: Any info on RCAF would be appreciated
I could complain all day about stuff, as could any pilot (military or civilian), but in the end it is a great job and I do amazing things I would never be able to do otherwise. Be warned though, if you join to build hours, or as a shortcut to the airlines, you will be disappointed.
The biggest gripes on the front end would have been the training delays, some guys were taking 4-5 years to get their wings, but that has eased off lately. Another negative aspect is military life in general, including being away from home a lot, being posted often, plus the general pressure and stress of being a military officer and pilot.
In the end though, the vast majority of guys know what they signed up for, and love what they are doing. Don't get me wrong, you must endure copious amounts of BS on your road to becoming a military pilot (ie, basic training), but it is well worth it, and I bet you would be hard pressed to find an RCAF pilot who regrets their decision to join.
The people who most often badmouth it are people who quit, or people who failed; take what they say with a grain of salt.
The biggest gripes on the front end would have been the training delays, some guys were taking 4-5 years to get their wings, but that has eased off lately. Another negative aspect is military life in general, including being away from home a lot, being posted often, plus the general pressure and stress of being a military officer and pilot.
In the end though, the vast majority of guys know what they signed up for, and love what they are doing. Don't get me wrong, you must endure copious amounts of BS on your road to becoming a military pilot (ie, basic training), but it is well worth it, and I bet you would be hard pressed to find an RCAF pilot who regrets their decision to join.
The people who most often badmouth it are people who quit, or people who failed; take what they say with a grain of salt.
Re: Any info on RCAF would be appreciated
Here is some second hand info for you- I was talking to a guy the other day and he was telling me a story about his stint in the Forces.
He had some programming background, so when he enrolled as a pilot, he was put on a base in an IT capacity. This was during his "on the job training".
He was being paid about 40k a year during this. He did all the various training during the period he was enrolled, basic training, French course, etc.
He washed out about 75% of the way though, before he got his wings. Unfortunately his stomach wasn't up to the training. He was also pretty sure he would have been selected to helicopter at the end, which he didn't want.
During this period he logged about 100 hours, on the Harvard II and Grob but washed out before getting his wings, and the time he was enrolled for was about 5 years.
He is now starting from scratch doing his PPL, CPL, etc. Since he can work as a self employed contract programmer he will be able to make ends meet as an entry level pilot. The hours he spent in training is loggable, but there are no credits as according to the CARS's unless you have your wings standard.
Again, second hand info, but thought I'd relay it for you.
He had some programming background, so when he enrolled as a pilot, he was put on a base in an IT capacity. This was during his "on the job training".
He was being paid about 40k a year during this. He did all the various training during the period he was enrolled, basic training, French course, etc.
He washed out about 75% of the way though, before he got his wings. Unfortunately his stomach wasn't up to the training. He was also pretty sure he would have been selected to helicopter at the end, which he didn't want.
During this period he logged about 100 hours, on the Harvard II and Grob but washed out before getting his wings, and the time he was enrolled for was about 5 years.
He is now starting from scratch doing his PPL, CPL, etc. Since he can work as a self employed contract programmer he will be able to make ends meet as an entry level pilot. The hours he spent in training is loggable, but there are no credits as according to the CARS's unless you have your wings standard.
Again, second hand info, but thought I'd relay it for you.
Re: Any info on RCAF would be appreciated
It seems like the majority of negative aspects of being a military pilot also apply to being a civi one. Obviously the culture and military life will be much different but unfortunately thats hard to experience without being there.
Another thing that kind of worries me is the whole one and done system they have there. Is the testing much more difficult than the civi side or if you apply yourself should it not be a problem.
Another thing that kind of worries me is the whole one and done system they have there. Is the testing much more difficult than the civi side or if you apply yourself should it not be a problem.
Re: Any info on RCAF would be appreciated
Military flight training is different from civilian flight training; the learning curve is very steep, and there is less room for error. The way it works during flight training is if you fail a flying test, you get a review flight and a retest. If you pass the retest, you carry on. If you fail the retest, you go before a review board which determines if you should continue training; they can either grant you another chance or cease your training. They look at all factors for each case, and decisions can go either way. Once you get your wings you have a bit more job security.
Aircrew selection exists for the purpose of selecting people who would likely succeed during flight training, it measures your ability to learn to fly, not flying ability. If you make it to military flight training and apply yourself, there is no reason you should fail.
Civilian training is a bit different, I know a guy who took 5 tries to pass his PPL exam. He is not a bad pilot by any measure, he just learns at a slower pace, and was willing to keep throwing money at it until he passed.
You can't really compare military and civilian flight training though. You are training different ways towards a different end result. Having done both though, I can tell you that military flight training is more difficult, due to the pace and learning curve.
Aircrew selection exists for the purpose of selecting people who would likely succeed during flight training, it measures your ability to learn to fly, not flying ability. If you make it to military flight training and apply yourself, there is no reason you should fail.
Civilian training is a bit different, I know a guy who took 5 tries to pass his PPL exam. He is not a bad pilot by any measure, he just learns at a slower pace, and was willing to keep throwing money at it until he passed.
You can't really compare military and civilian flight training though. You are training different ways towards a different end result. Having done both though, I can tell you that military flight training is more difficult, due to the pace and learning curve.
Re: Any info on RCAF would be appreciated
I've been selected for Pilot last year. I didn't have a bachelor so I have to go trought the military College.
Being selected for Pilot without a university degree is more harder. You have to go throught Aptitude test(It's not too hard but don't be a dumb for not study for it)
After that, medical, a light routine test + you will have to get your eyes check by a civilian Eyes Dr.
Then if your eyes passed, (you don't have to got a perfect vision) you will do interview
Interview is like any other job interview. You have better chance with experience in leadership role in your job or at a sport and volountary is highly appreciated.
Then if you got the interview right, you are leading for the hardest part of being chose. Aircrew selection (around 40% pass)
You will do a math, memory, multi-tasking, 3h test. Then 4 session in a simulator of 1 hour each.
Then if you pass, you do a very advanced medical. Your body will be analysed to see if you fit in military aircraft( You have at least need to fit in 2 of 3 categories (helicopter, jet , fighter), + a couple of other test.
If you pass all those thing, if you got a degree under your belt you will go directly on the merit list and if you got choosen you will go directly for the basic training.
Otherwise, you will be on the merit list for the military college that will choose who's get in.
Positive Point : Good salary, Paid education, flying incredible aircraft (Fighter, C-17...), see things that you never sees anywhere else...
Negative Point : You can be cut from any flight training ( total of 3), remember that at this point 40-50 % pass. You are not always flying, you do a lot of office work, Be posted every 3 years or something like that, Serve for 7 years AFTER getting your wings
Being selected for Pilot without a university degree is more harder. You have to go throught Aptitude test(It's not too hard but don't be a dumb for not study for it)
After that, medical, a light routine test + you will have to get your eyes check by a civilian Eyes Dr.
Then if your eyes passed, (you don't have to got a perfect vision) you will do interview
Interview is like any other job interview. You have better chance with experience in leadership role in your job or at a sport and volountary is highly appreciated.
Then if you got the interview right, you are leading for the hardest part of being chose. Aircrew selection (around 40% pass)
You will do a math, memory, multi-tasking, 3h test. Then 4 session in a simulator of 1 hour each.
Then if you pass, you do a very advanced medical. Your body will be analysed to see if you fit in military aircraft( You have at least need to fit in 2 of 3 categories (helicopter, jet , fighter), + a couple of other test.
If you pass all those thing, if you got a degree under your belt you will go directly on the merit list and if you got choosen you will go directly for the basic training.
Otherwise, you will be on the merit list for the military college that will choose who's get in.
Positive Point : Good salary, Paid education, flying incredible aircraft (Fighter, C-17...), see things that you never sees anywhere else...
Negative Point : You can be cut from any flight training ( total of 3), remember that at this point 40-50 % pass. You are not always flying, you do a lot of office work, Be posted every 3 years or something like that, Serve for 7 years AFTER getting your wings
Last edited by nic32 on Mon Dec 17, 2012 7:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Any info on RCAF would be appreciated
Nic- Good for you man. You'll have a great career ahead of you.
OP-
He mentioned a factor that's been overlooked thus far and I was going to bring up. When weighing out the pros and cons, lifestyle, pay, blah blah, remember that in the Forces, you will likely fly aircraft that many civilian pilots would give their 20 inch AvCanada schlong for, and even pay money to go for a novelty trip in- but for you that would be your daily gig.
If I knew half of what I do now, (So half of not much) and I was 20 again, or even just finished my Uni degree (for DEO), I would enroll in a freaking. heartbeat.
OP-
He mentioned a factor that's been overlooked thus far and I was going to bring up. When weighing out the pros and cons, lifestyle, pay, blah blah, remember that in the Forces, you will likely fly aircraft that many civilian pilots would give their 20 inch AvCanada schlong for, and even pay money to go for a novelty trip in- but for you that would be your daily gig.
If I knew half of what I do now, (So half of not much) and I was 20 again, or even just finished my Uni degree (for DEO), I would enroll in a freaking. heartbeat.
Re: Any info on RCAF would be appreciated
I agree big time with this. Even during training, you will be flying aircraft that many people only dream of flying. First you will do about 30 hours on the Grob, it is a blast to fly. Then you will move onto the Harvard II...you will go solo in an 1100 shaft horsepower, fully aerobatic turboprop with around 40 hours under your belt. It just gets better from there.DanWEC wrote:you will likely fly aircraft that many civilian pilots would give their 20 inch AvCanada schlong for, and even pay money to go for a novelty trip in- but for you that would be your daily gig.
Re: Any info on RCAF would be appreciated
Agree with all the above and let's not forget that as a 25 year old Captain you will be making just shy of 100k a year with full benefits, pensions and a fair amount of annual leave. Show me anything close to that in the civilian world?
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Re: Any info on RCAF would be appreciated
I just found out they now accept eye surgery? I sure wish they did this 10 years ago. It was always my dream to be a pilot in the CF. My current eyesight is -3 diopters so I would need surgery for sure (nearsighted). I'm just not sure they would even look at a 30 year old now. Anyone have insight on this? I have an education in aeronautical engineering technology from SAIT (3 year diploma program - not quite an official degree), plus an interprovincial journeyman license in automotives and currently within a few hours of getting my PPL.
Re: Any info on RCAF would be appreciated
I am a current CF pilot (fighters).
It is a great career. I am 12+ years in, I lived in every province between Quebec and Alberta inclusively, I make more than 100K a year and I have the most fun someone can have with his pants on at work. The people are great, the job is probably the best in the world for a pilot (purely for flying). It is very demanding mentally but it's what makes it interesting.
The drawbacks now. Be ready to work long hours. 10+ hours every day. Yes, you make a lot of money for a pilot early on. However, you will find yourself at work for long periods of time. Flying takes a lot of time, and you also have secondary duties. You will be posted every 3-4 years and while you may be able to say your preferences (and they really do try to give you your number 1 choice), but you will sometimes be disappointed. But that's just part of life. Every posting is an experience and in the end, it will be what you make of it. You will spend time away from your family for work. We deploy a couple of times a year for 3-4 weeks at the time for training (in very nice location most of the time). In 2012, I have been to Florida for an exercise with F-16s (and got to fly in the backseat of a Viper), Cold Lake for Maple Flag, Alaska, for Red Flag, Greenwood for Air-to-Air Gunnery and Air Force/Navy integration. Other people have been to Hawaii for a Joint-Combined exercise. So, lots of time away from the family but lots of fun too. There are also some random away duties on top of that. But overall, nothing an understanding family cannot deal with.
Now, there is also the question of deploying in a zone of war. Yes, it may happen and no you don't have a choice. Yes, you may have to put your life on the line if you go. Yes, you may have to kill people. But that's what the military trains you for. Regardless of what you fly, in the end, you support the pointy end.
Hope it helps,
It is a great career. I am 12+ years in, I lived in every province between Quebec and Alberta inclusively, I make more than 100K a year and I have the most fun someone can have with his pants on at work. The people are great, the job is probably the best in the world for a pilot (purely for flying). It is very demanding mentally but it's what makes it interesting.
The drawbacks now. Be ready to work long hours. 10+ hours every day. Yes, you make a lot of money for a pilot early on. However, you will find yourself at work for long periods of time. Flying takes a lot of time, and you also have secondary duties. You will be posted every 3-4 years and while you may be able to say your preferences (and they really do try to give you your number 1 choice), but you will sometimes be disappointed. But that's just part of life. Every posting is an experience and in the end, it will be what you make of it. You will spend time away from your family for work. We deploy a couple of times a year for 3-4 weeks at the time for training (in very nice location most of the time). In 2012, I have been to Florida for an exercise with F-16s (and got to fly in the backseat of a Viper), Cold Lake for Maple Flag, Alaska, for Red Flag, Greenwood for Air-to-Air Gunnery and Air Force/Navy integration. Other people have been to Hawaii for a Joint-Combined exercise. So, lots of time away from the family but lots of fun too. There are also some random away duties on top of that. But overall, nothing an understanding family cannot deal with.
Now, there is also the question of deploying in a zone of war. Yes, it may happen and no you don't have a choice. Yes, you may have to put your life on the line if you go. Yes, you may have to kill people. But that's what the military trains you for. Regardless of what you fly, in the end, you support the pointy end.
Hope it helps,
Re: Any info on RCAF would be appreciated
thanks for all the responses. I suppose I can tell you guys where im at and what I am thinking right now.
Currently have commercial multi IFR license, employed as a first officer, as well as a 2 year college program which is transferrable to a degree. I have made it through the interview, medical, and aptitude test and was told that I am very competative for the ROTP program. Currently in the process of getting the civi medical done, then aircrew selection is next.
Essentially I think it would be a good route for me, I work much better in a structured environment, and I honestly think I would enjoy the military aspect of it, obviously I cant really tell for sure.
I was wondering about the flight testing/training once you go in to the military, is it like the civi side where you have a commercial ride/written, and so on. Or is it more like a college course where you complete exams/flight tests throughout and all count towards your grade.
Also for aircrew selection how can you prepare for this, other than brush up on some basic flight theory?
Currently have commercial multi IFR license, employed as a first officer, as well as a 2 year college program which is transferrable to a degree. I have made it through the interview, medical, and aptitude test and was told that I am very competative for the ROTP program. Currently in the process of getting the civi medical done, then aircrew selection is next.
Essentially I think it would be a good route for me, I work much better in a structured environment, and I honestly think I would enjoy the military aspect of it, obviously I cant really tell for sure.
I was wondering about the flight testing/training once you go in to the military, is it like the civi side where you have a commercial ride/written, and so on. Or is it more like a college course where you complete exams/flight tests throughout and all count towards your grade.
Also for aircrew selection how can you prepare for this, other than brush up on some basic flight theory?
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Re: Any info on RCAF would be appreciated
Wow, that must be an intense medical if all that's left at the end is a corpse...nic32 wrote:Your corpse will be analysed to see if you fit in military aircraft...

Re: Any info on RCAF would be appreciated
During your flight training you will do a number of tests and written exams throughout the courses. It is kind of like university in that there are a series of subject, both theory and flying, but unlike university in that you must pass every test in order to complete the course. Failing multiple tests, or failing the same test more than once might lead to course failure and cease training.
For example, ground school is broken down into different subjects, you will take classes on things like aerodynamics, instrument flying, met etc... and each subject has it's own exams. Same with flying, it is broken down into clearhood (circuits, aerobatics etc...), instrument, low level navigation, formation and later on composite missions mixing them all together.
The only real tip I can give for aircrew selection is make sure you have a solid instrument x-check and follow the instructions.
For example, ground school is broken down into different subjects, you will take classes on things like aerodynamics, instrument flying, met etc... and each subject has it's own exams. Same with flying, it is broken down into clearhood (circuits, aerobatics etc...), instrument, low level navigation, formation and later on composite missions mixing them all together.
The only real tip I can give for aircrew selection is make sure you have a solid instrument x-check and follow the instructions.
Re: Any info on RCAF would be appreciated
Keep in mind there are a lot of different air frames in the RCAF. Would you be happy flying helicopter(BTW they are super cool) and spending a lot of time playing with the army or spending months at sea aboard a ship? Just something to consider as I don't think you know where you are going until just before your wings.
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Re: Any info on RCAF would be appreciated
You'll be an officer, so it's not like you'll have to work hard 

Re: Any info on RCAF would be appreciated
Haha sorry, I made the change, my first language is not english as you see :pDiadem wrote:Wow, that must be an intense medical if all that's left at the end is a corpse...nic32 wrote:Your corpse will be analysed to see if you fit in military aircraft...