Training Bonds
Moderators: sky's the limit, sepia, Sulako, lilfssister, North Shore, I WAS Birddog
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snaproll20
- Rank 7
- Posts: 636
- Joined: Tue Jun 01, 2004 7:50 pm
Of course, everyone on here is correct. Since the views vary, this matter will never be resolved.
The problem with the pilot owing the company on a signed agreement, with no up-front money, is that if he/she walks away, then the company has to hire a lawyer to sue. Now your PPC costs just doubled.
The comment about management not researching prospective pilots sufficiently well and it serves them right if the "bad" apples leave is patently ludicrous. The comment about the increased complexity (and therefore, cost) of recognized training is on the other hand, very accurate.
Most pilots who fall into the "need for financial security" category are usually at an experience level where they will be with the company for a minimum of one year anyway. If they take out a bank loan for $x over one year, with the company making the payments, plus a couple of percent over their loan rate, what is wrong with that?
One guy once put up his car as security. Never did the paper on that because he just demonstrated his commitment.
The problem only starts when someone behaves dishonourably.
Any agreement signed should have input from both sides. Included should be "if the company goes bust, you will be repaid" etc etc. (Jetsgo guys, please note.) Make yourself a legal creditor. Should the company not wish this term in the agreement, then tell them to 'pound sand'. If all of this, including a'hand-shake" was adequate, there would be no need, would there?
People will always pay for training as it is a means of clawing their way to the 'top'.....whatever that is.
If I show up at Mercy Hospital and tell them I will work there 'forever' doing surgery if they will train me for free, what kind of response do you think I would get? Free admission to the psych ward, probably.
The problem with the pilot owing the company on a signed agreement, with no up-front money, is that if he/she walks away, then the company has to hire a lawyer to sue. Now your PPC costs just doubled.
The comment about management not researching prospective pilots sufficiently well and it serves them right if the "bad" apples leave is patently ludicrous. The comment about the increased complexity (and therefore, cost) of recognized training is on the other hand, very accurate.
Most pilots who fall into the "need for financial security" category are usually at an experience level where they will be with the company for a minimum of one year anyway. If they take out a bank loan for $x over one year, with the company making the payments, plus a couple of percent over their loan rate, what is wrong with that?
One guy once put up his car as security. Never did the paper on that because he just demonstrated his commitment.
The problem only starts when someone behaves dishonourably.
Any agreement signed should have input from both sides. Included should be "if the company goes bust, you will be repaid" etc etc. (Jetsgo guys, please note.) Make yourself a legal creditor. Should the company not wish this term in the agreement, then tell them to 'pound sand'. If all of this, including a'hand-shake" was adequate, there would be no need, would there?
People will always pay for training as it is a means of clawing their way to the 'top'.....whatever that is.
If I show up at Mercy Hospital and tell them I will work there 'forever' doing surgery if they will train me for free, what kind of response do you think I would get? Free admission to the psych ward, probably.
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Hey___Pilot
- Rank 1
- Posts: 41
- Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2004 3:21 pm
If your word isn't good enough then you are a waste of skin....goes for the pilot and the employer.
Training bonds are not the answer....
You are correct in that this will never be settled but I've known far more mangers who were terrible at their jobs than pilots (read Jetsgo), the industry tends to weed the pilot side out.
Training bonds are not the answer....
You are correct in that this will never be settled but I've known far more mangers who were terrible at their jobs than pilots (read Jetsgo), the industry tends to weed the pilot side out.
Listen to the pilot with the most grey hair....
HO Driver,
Would you even consider signing a bond after the training had been completed? If it wasn't mentioned to you before the training started I don't see that you have any obligation to sign one after the training is completed. But if a person was foolish enough to sign at that point it would probably be just as valid as if you had signed it before the training started.
The first time I ever heard of a bond was a situation like this. The training had been completed, I was flying the airplane on a regular basis, a couple of other pilots left the company for bigger equipment...........the boss then thought it would be a good idea to ask me to sign a bond.
All I could do was laugh, "You aren't serious are you?" was my response. I didn't sign then nor at any time since then with any other company.
Would you even consider signing a bond after the training had been completed? If it wasn't mentioned to you before the training started I don't see that you have any obligation to sign one after the training is completed. But if a person was foolish enough to sign at that point it would probably be just as valid as if you had signed it before the training started.
The first time I ever heard of a bond was a situation like this. The training had been completed, I was flying the airplane on a regular basis, a couple of other pilots left the company for bigger equipment...........the boss then thought it would be a good idea to ask me to sign a bond.
All I could do was laugh, "You aren't serious are you?" was my response. I didn't sign then nor at any time since then with any other company.
I see no problem whatsoever with "Training Bonds" as such. If the person signing for the "Management" will put some chattel of their own "on the table" as security that the agreement will be fulfilled by the company, then I would sign same. Unfortunately, that's not the way it works though and the agreement is signed by/for "the Company". If said "Company" reneges on said agreement by going bankrupt as such, then I am not on the list of "guaranteed creditors" and am left to "whistle in the wind".
Based on the above present conditions, the only one of the signing principals who looses is ME if some company "pulls another Jetsgo". My $30,000 may be "small potatoes" compared to the hundreds of millions in Bankruptcy Court, but since I'm still working on earning my first million, that's still a sizeable amount of ducats that this pilot isn't willing to gamble away without more guarantees of a similar pain on the other side if the "Company" falters/reneges.
Based on the above present conditions, the only one of the signing principals who looses is ME if some company "pulls another Jetsgo". My $30,000 may be "small potatoes" compared to the hundreds of millions in Bankruptcy Court, but since I'm still working on earning my first million, that's still a sizeable amount of ducats that this pilot isn't willing to gamble away without more guarantees of a similar pain on the other side if the "Company" falters/reneges.
