Is it worth it to get a float rating without extra hours ?
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Is it worth it to get a float rating without extra hours ?
Hello all,
as you might have noticed from other posts, I am in the process of converting my JAR licenses to Canadian licenses. I do not currently hold a float rating. After the conversion, I will have about 550 hours TT ( of which +- 30 hours Multi), 400 hours PIC (3 hours multi).
While this might be, with some (or a lot of) luck, enough to find a job on wheels, I would love the opportunity to fly floats as well. So my question would be: with these hours and let's say 10 hours of floats, would there be any company that would (realistically) allow me to fly on floats ? Or would it be a waste of money (of course, flying is never a waste of money, but you get the idea).
Or, a follow up question, let's say I find a job and fly wheels for a few years. So I get a few thousand hours of wheels. Would it then be possible to get a job with 10 hours of floats, or do you really need to build the first 50/100/... float hours yourself ?
Thanks again,
Digits
as you might have noticed from other posts, I am in the process of converting my JAR licenses to Canadian licenses. I do not currently hold a float rating. After the conversion, I will have about 550 hours TT ( of which +- 30 hours Multi), 400 hours PIC (3 hours multi).
While this might be, with some (or a lot of) luck, enough to find a job on wheels, I would love the opportunity to fly floats as well. So my question would be: with these hours and let's say 10 hours of floats, would there be any company that would (realistically) allow me to fly on floats ? Or would it be a waste of money (of course, flying is never a waste of money, but you get the idea).
Or, a follow up question, let's say I find a job and fly wheels for a few years. So I get a few thousand hours of wheels. Would it then be possible to get a job with 10 hours of floats, or do you really need to build the first 50/100/... float hours yourself ?
Thanks again,
Digits
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Re: Is it worth it to get a float rating without extra hours
I wouldn't say most. I've worked at a few places without hard minimums, infact I'm not sure that I've worked anywhere that had them at all. A lot of insurance policies have room for negotiation too, especially after a lengthy relationship with the operator. Maybe it's different out east, but I suspect that just as often as not the whole "you need 50 hrs" is just a polite PFO.
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Re: Is it worth it to get a float rating without extra hours
Get the seaplane endorsement anyway. Lets face it you'd have a better chance of getting a float job with the endorsement than without.
Some operators have both land plane and seaplane operations and ...you never know it could just be being at the right place at the right time.
Cheers
Some operators have both land plane and seaplane operations and ...you never know it could just be being at the right place at the right time.
Cheers
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Re: Is it worth it to get a float rating without extra hours
Digits
I assume you are a Canadian citizen or landed immigrant ? If not you have zero chance finding work.
The most common way to get a float job is to go to Northern Sask/Man/Ont as there are virtually no starter positions on the West/East coast. Plan on doing your first season working the dock and doing some nonrev flights to get some exposure. Work hard and impress the boss and you will probably get a flying gig next season. So you had better be OK with living in small Northern communities and/or Indian reservations.
As for training the reality is the hard part of float flying isn't driving the airplane it is the constant pilot decision making on knowing the where and how you are going to take off and land. The 10 hour course gives you just enough skill to be dangerous. The advantage of a properly done 50 hour course will be the exposure to many different conditions. However like any training it will only be as good as your instructor. You want a many thousand hour guy with lots of real world commercial flying experience.
I assume you are a Canadian citizen or landed immigrant ? If not you have zero chance finding work.
The most common way to get a float job is to go to Northern Sask/Man/Ont as there are virtually no starter positions on the West/East coast. Plan on doing your first season working the dock and doing some nonrev flights to get some exposure. Work hard and impress the boss and you will probably get a flying gig next season. So you had better be OK with living in small Northern communities and/or Indian reservations.
As for training the reality is the hard part of float flying isn't driving the airplane it is the constant pilot decision making on knowing the where and how you are going to take off and land. The 10 hour course gives you just enough skill to be dangerous. The advantage of a properly done 50 hour course will be the exposure to many different conditions. However like any training it will only be as good as your instructor. You want a many thousand hour guy with lots of real world commercial flying experience.
Re: Is it worth it to get a float rating without extra hours
Not yet, working on that.Class 1 Instructor wrote: I assume you are a Canadian citizen or landed immigrant ?
Thank you for the posts soo far!
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Re: Is it worth it to get a float rating without extra hours
Just to clarify something, the 50 hour insurance requirement is to carry passengers. You can be insured on the airplane with less time to do non rev and cargo flights.
Re: Is it worth it to get a float rating without extra hours
You don't need floats for the north pole, not yet anyway. 

Re: Is it worth it to get a float rating without extra hours
Get the rating. It will come in handy. I did more float flying this season in the prairies as an ag pilot with the boss's private planes then I did working as a NWONT swamper/180 wanna be back in the day. I was easily insured on a J3 (including pax) with only 20hrs on floats from 6 years previous. At the time I was not current, and was not required to be current for insurance. My 1600hrs may have played a part in that role; I'm not sure, but I doubt it. Having said that, I was not insured on the 180 until I reached 50hrs.
This run in of the magic 50hr requirement has not changed my opinion on these 50hr courses though. Yes, the 50hrs in the book is an asset. Yes, it will be easier to get on insurance....BUT it is not necessary. Get the basic endorsement, and get out in the real world and have your company train you the way they see fit. You will more than likely be a swamper first, and this is where you will gain a great deal of knowledge about company operations and float flying in general. I did not spend a penny over the basic endorsement, and the company that I work for invested their money in me. The magic 50hrs is irrelevant really ... the question should be, how much of a premium is your company willing to pay to have you insured?
Don't spend the money time building. Find a good company to work for. Have a company invest their time in you, and ensure that you return the favour as a reliable and dedicated employee.
This run in of the magic 50hr requirement has not changed my opinion on these 50hr courses though. Yes, the 50hrs in the book is an asset. Yes, it will be easier to get on insurance....BUT it is not necessary. Get the basic endorsement, and get out in the real world and have your company train you the way they see fit. You will more than likely be a swamper first, and this is where you will gain a great deal of knowledge about company operations and float flying in general. I did not spend a penny over the basic endorsement, and the company that I work for invested their money in me. The magic 50hrs is irrelevant really ... the question should be, how much of a premium is your company willing to pay to have you insured?
Don't spend the money time building. Find a good company to work for. Have a company invest their time in you, and ensure that you return the favour as a reliable and dedicated employee.
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Re: Is it worth it to get a float rating without extra hours
That's been my experience as well, you never know when it will ome in handy. If you're in the right palce at the right time suddenly your experience might not matter. Aside from my on my own dime occasionally doing some float flying, I didn't use my rating for years. Then one day "Do you got a float rating? Good I need some help..."Get the rating. It will come in handy.
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Re: Is it worth it to get a float rating without extra hours
Hey Digits
I always wanted a float rating and got one eventually. I worked for two float operators while I was in the Bush but only flew wheels. I was lucky enough to go back to near where I worked for a wedding and I talked to my old boss that had always said he would give me one and he gave me one in a few days. Greatest experience I ever had doing that rating. He didn't want anything in return he has since even helped me find a me look for a few gigs for next year.
I feel bad for people that have never flown the bush they will never know the life.
I always wanted a float rating and got one eventually. I worked for two float operators while I was in the Bush but only flew wheels. I was lucky enough to go back to near where I worked for a wedding and I talked to my old boss that had always said he would give me one and he gave me one in a few days. Greatest experience I ever had doing that rating. He didn't want anything in return he has since even helped me find a me look for a few gigs for next year.
Driving Rain wrote:Get the seaplane endorsement anyway. Lets face it you'd have a better chance of getting a float job with the endorsement than without.
Some operators have both land plane and seaplane operations and ...you never know it could just be being at the right place at the right time.
Cheers
I'm not sure about that part. Before I got my float rating from my old boss someone at another company asked if he knew any reliable pilots that work hard and want do do some bush flying. My old boss gave him my email address right away and they both know I didn't have a float rating. But Keep your head down and go to work do your work then go home don't complain and it will work out man. I'm thinking of leaving my cushy city gig for some dirty bush flying. Been flying 5 years still have yet to wear a shirt and tie.Driving Rain wrote:Get the seaplane endorsement anyway. Lets face it you'd have a better chance of getting a float job with the endorsement than without.
I feel bad for people that have never flown the bush they will never know the life.
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Re: Is it worth it to get a float rating without extra hours
I worked for a company that gave me my seaplane endorsement for free also. That was 42 years ago and it helped me launch my career.
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Re: Is it worth it to get a float rating without extra hours
I didn't have a float rating when I got my first float job either. The company did my float training for free. I did have over 2000 hours and a lot of crop spraying in my log book though.
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Re: Is it worth it to get a float rating without extra hours
There are quite a few companies flying Twin Otters on floats in Canada. FO is an entry level position, and it's a good way to learn the ropes from an experienced pilot.