Alberta Gov't Air Service

[X-Savior]

So here is a theory for you...

Prentice needs votes to get in.... So calls on Mandel who has close ties and interests in the PC Party. Mandel has always been on Katz's back pocket ever since the Arena Deal and various real estate deals. As soon as they was done and Mandel made his fortune he walked away from civic politics and has been waiting for his good buddy Prentice to make his move. Now they needed more votes so called on Katz people who happen to be in the PC Party also. So Prentice got his landslide (wonder if Katz Group is a part or whole owner of the electronic voting system).

Now that Prentice made it...the time to return the favour was at hand so Mandel was placed in Healthcare (After all a dirty Slum Lord Mayor like Mandel who is not even an elected party member was a perfect fit with his experience in business deals along wih his good friend who happens to also own the largest Drug Store Chain Rexall *cough* who can really help Alberta with Healthcare solutions.... After all Alberta Health Services could really use the help of a "local" supplier who is more then happy to fill any needs required.

The last step was the icing on the cake... Shutdown the Governments Flight Department and look for a charter company who can do it instead (wonder who might own a charter company who again would love to help out his good friends in the PC Party.... Katz you say... Why yes, I am sure Aurora *cough* would love to handle his.... Let's just make a trade... Fleet for the lease that was just signed... And call it even? What are friends for after all?

Can anyone deny the corruption? Do you REALLY think they are coming clean? Politicians are only looking out for one person... Themselves!

[MrWings]

watch which government ass kisser gets the work.

Which one?

[MrWings]

So here is a theory for you...

Prentice needs votes to get in.... So calls on Mandel who has close ties and interests in the PC Party. Mandel has always been on Katz's back pocket ever since the Arena Deal and various real estate deals. As soon as they was done and Mandel made his fortune he walked away from civic politics and has been waiting for his good buddy Prentice to make his move. Now they needed more votes so called on Katz people who happen to be in the PC Party also. So Prentice got his landslide (wonder if Katz Group is a part or whole owner of the electronic voting system).

Now that prentice is in it was time to return the favour so Mandel was placed in Healthcare (After all a dirty slum Lord Mayor like Mandel who is not even an elected party member was a perfect fit with his experience in business deals along wih his good friend who happens to also own the largest Drug Store Chain Rexall *caugh* who can really help Alberta with Healthcare solutions.

The last step was the icing on the cake... Shutdown the Governments Flight Department and look for a charter company who can do it instead (wonder who might own a charter company who again would love to help out his good friends in the PC Party.... Katz you say... Why yes, I am sure Aurora *cough* would love to handle his....

Can anyone deny the corruption? Do you REALLY think they are coming clean? Politicians are only looking out for one person... Themselves!

I don't think Prentice needed any help to get a landslide. McIver and Lukaszuk ensured that themselves.

Not sure how Mandel will send more business to Rexall unless he implements mandatory vitamin supplements.

I think there will be a favored charter company for sure. Not sure if Aurora's jets are misson suitable and cost effective. But there is a big opportunity out there for the charter market.

I don't deny Katz-Mandel-Prentice are scratching each other's backs. But I don't agree with the actual linkages suggested.

[X-Savior]

Katz is not just front end Rexall but there is many other back end business.

Katz also owns building (and leased to) for government. So I am sure Aurora should be happy to take the fleet in return for the lease and then have the aircraft for the mission.

I can tell you there IS some dirty deals going on here! People need to VERY aware of the situation.

[Pop n Fresh]

Not sure how Mandel will send more business to Rexall unless he implements mandatory vitamin supplements.

The bi-yearly pandemic scare flu vaccinations. Now available at your neighborhood drug store.

[Doctor Evil]

Just waiting for a tell-all book to be released by one of the 27 union members who were laid off!!

[X-Savior]

Just waiting for a tell-all book to be released by one of the 27 union members who were laid off!!

The book is already pending.


The 27 Employees have been devastated by this event. Not one person in the department had been notified prior to the announcement (Even up to the Deputy Minister Level).

The employees were notified they were going to be unemployed from the media and not a single communication internally. In fact Minister Robin Campbell or Prentice could not be bothered to even communicate to the employees or face them in person. One of the largest decisions in decades in the Alberta government and now the bigger concern is cancelling the new license plates.

From my understanding there is not even any plan in place as of current. The announcement had been made without any planning or real consultation (just a dictatorship decision to get media attention). With a fresh 10 year lease that needs to be paid I am sure that will alone cost more then a year or two of operations.

Now the employees are left with no more information then what was provided by the media. All they know is they are losing their jobs and something will happen sometime with some sort of plan yet to be determined. As Prentice said they will be put down humanely... And screwed over in typical government fashion most likely.

It is a horrific disaster and many of the employees do not have enough years to be able to start over again being forced out of the industry.

Prentice is out of control and these employees have paid for the PC Party's transgressions with their careers.

[azimuthaviation]

Katz and Mandel. I cant believe it only took two Shylocks to dominate the whole city. Do you guys have any will for independence or do you like being dominated by a higher grade of people? I dont get it.

Moderated: Really?! Take a holiday for a week or two, and re-read the guidelines for posting.

[Stu Pidasso]

watch which government ass kisser gets the work.

Which one?

Let us see, there is a little charter outfit out of EG owned by Edmonton Royalty, I'll place my bet there. Anyway you slice it, the costs will at least triple.

[Oxi]

Who are the players to take the operation over?

[it'sme]

Employees have been devastated by this event

As were the employees of the Province of New Brunswick flight dept last year. Precisely 15 mins notice prior to the Minister rising in the house to make the announcement. Although there was an "unofficial" story the night before from Canadian Press making the "announcement". Also as a result of a media dog-pile.

In Alberta's case, I wonder how the information that employees found out from the media fits into Prentice's notion of humane treatment?

[longjon]

The AB Gov't Helicopter employees got the same treatment back in the day, No one told them they were being shut down.

[MrWings]

While I feel for those losing their jobs, it is the risk of working for that employer. And for that risk, they were paid handsomely for one of the better corporate jobs out there.

[Cessna driver]

Airco will likely get the contract i would guess, b1900, king air 100s, and navajos

[X-Savior]

I am sure there will be turbine only and no older then clause so I doubt 100's and HO's will ever meet government requirements....

Plus their minimum pilot experience is 3000 hours (either seat) so that rules out almost all Airco pilots most likely.

[Cessna driver]

Airco has quite a few over 3000, at YXD i saw airco at ab gov'ts hangar quite often when the rest of the fleet was out

[Oxi]

EDMONTON - The price tag for Premier Jim Prentice’s visit by chartered jet to northern Alberta on Monday was $8,500 less than it would have been using Alberta’s taxpayer-funded fleet, his office says.

Prentice and seven other government officials flew a Citation Sovereign jet chartered for a round trip from Calgary to Fort Chipewyan to speak with First Nations and Métis leaders. The quoted price for the chartered flight — including a stop in Fort McKay — was quoted at $11,542.29, said spokeswoman Emily Woods. The costs could change after final calculations.

“In the case of the flight to Fort Chipewyan, calculations show that the cost of flying a charter is significantly lower than using a government plane,” Woods said in an email. “There will be occasions when the cost of flying commercial or by charter will be more than the cost of a government plane, and other times it will be less.”

A similar flight on a government plane would cost an estimated $20,098.83, Woods said, based on a formula broken down by distance and labour costs. That higher estimate also reflects the additional distance between Calgary and the Edmonton International Airport, where the government kept its fleet of three Beechcraft King Airs and one Dash-8.

Prentice scrapped the controversial fleet on Sept. 16, the day after he was sworn in as premier. On recent trips, he has flown a combination of commercial and charter flights. A trip to the Lubicon Lake Cree — 450 kilometres northwest of Edmonton — on Oct. 30th was by a charter flight. His trip last Monday to visit B.C. Premier Christy Clark in Vancouver was a commercial flight, while a trip east to Saskatchewan on Wednesday was a charter on the way there, commercial on the way back.

The decision followed months of allegations of abuse under Alison Redford’s government. In August, auditor general Merwin Saher issued a report concluding Prentice’s predecessor derived a personal benefit from the planes and used them to attend multiple Progressive Conservative party events.

The RCMP is investigating the allegations and an internal government review has found Redford could face criminal charges. Last week, Rachel Notley asked Saher’s office to expand his investigation to Redford’s cabinet ministers.

The Air Transportation Service cost the province $9.3 million per year for four planes — or roughly $25,500 per day — according to Saher’s report.

Saher’s report also showed that the program cost $3.9 million more than comparable travel alternatives in 2012.

At the time of Prentice’s announcement, the government said it planned on selling the fleet within four months. The decision involved the breaking of a 10-year lease signed in the fall of 2013 for a hangar at the Edmonton International Airport. The government has not provided an estimate of the costs of breaking the lease.

http://www.calgaryherald.com/news/polit ... story.html

[J31]

I think there are a lot of self serving numbers been tossed around. The Auditors report quotes a 3350 mile return trip to Toronto costing $13,084 in the King Air. http://www.oag.ab.ca/webfiles/reports/a ... report.pdf Yet Premier Jim Prentice spokeswoman Emily Woods quotes a that a trip to Fort Chipewyan would have cost $20,089 to fly 1389 miles!?

[Doctor Evil]

So either Ft Chip should have cost $5424.00 or Toronto should have been $48458.00.
Interesting math.

[X-Savior]

If anyone was to dig into the AG Report there is some glaring inaccuracies. They come up with 9.3 Million without any proof where it comes from. They officially state the 2013-2014 Budget was only 8.1 million (Page 33). 2011-2012 budget was 6.3 Million and 2012-2013 was 6.7 Million. The reason for the spike in 2013-2014 was the forced move from the City Center Airport and the need to lease a new facility. Companies like Airco were given over 10 million dollars to find a new home but ATS only get 30 days notice and a kick in the ass.

Another reason for the spike was that the 2 Engines and props in the Dash 8 were due for overhaul/replacement (total price tag of 5 million with a 2 million core return). That 2 million was put back into General Coffers not ATS budget. The actual budget is approx 6.5 million (Only 1 million over the alternatives... And if you look closely the alternatives are driving and commercial flights.... NOTHING about them chartering everywhere like they currently are). It is expected The budget would overall increase about 18% due to higher costs at the International Airport. The AG office has publicly confirmed that the values used in the report were not researched or verified. The report was only a report on Policy and Abuse.... Not a financial report about the business viability of the department and alternatives.

It has been found that Katz owns 8% of the 10-12 Million dollar lease. It is understood the lease does not have a sublease clause and has a VERY stiff exit cost because of the custom upgrades and design to Government specs required for the building. So now the Government just spent several million dollars building the place, then will pay a huge cost (enough to operate the department for 10 years compared to the alternatives). Now that the lease will be broken they will be ready to lease out the facility again to a new operator and make millions again. The new hangar was completed only 2 days before Prentices announcement... smells like a bad deal and corrupt business practices.

The media is starting to see the abuse of Prentice and charter already. Seriously who needs to charter a trans-continental Jet to fly from Calgary to Ft Chip... It is insane!!! And how can it be cheaper then a King Air 350. They stated it was an initial quote by Sunwest but final bill would be recalculated. Looks like a low ball quote and then will hit them up on this or another trip to recover the costs. Sunwest is trying to compete for the sole source contract right now (looks like they are greasing the wheels). The Government is now racing to shutdown the department before the Alberta general public learns the truth and public outrage occurs. Quick sweep it under the rug so there is nothing that can be done later.

Prentice recently flew From Edmonton to Regina on a charter (CanWest) and then sent the plane back empty. Then took Airline with his group to Calgary. Of course this must be more cost effective then flying Govt Kingair 200 to Regina waiting until they were done then fly them to Calgary and then find some Calgary passengers trying to get to Edmonton and fill some of the seats. If he was that eager to save money why did he not fly to McMurray commercial and charter from there for the Ft Chip trip? This has nothing to do with saving Albertans money. He has an agenda and albertans will pay the price.

When prentice flys commercial he must book all seats around him (6-9 seats) for security. In addition the security people have had to change weapons and require special training similar to Air Marshals. Now what most people do not know is Prentice is one of the top 5 terrorist targets in Canada. So he is now putting innocent Canadians at risk who are flying on a commercial flight with him.

My friends this is going to be an epic scandal that will put Redfords scandals to shame.... The government is so corrupt it wants to make you throw up!

[Old fella]

Folks, it politics and perception - nothing else. The AB government can/will say the fleet of aircraft are not required thus saving millions of dollars to the Alberta taxpayers - nuff said. It was an embarrassment because of the said abuse by the previous adminstration and the new Premier is trying to save face towards the electorate. Of course, they will charter as that isn't visible, government business requires mobility. always did, do now and always will. Some AG report may indicate the cost of travel but it won't be in the public domain(in your face) like a fleet of government assets(planes). The Govt of NB had a BE200 and that was sold and I do believe few yrs back Govt of NS did same as well as NL Govt(I think).

It's the same shit, nothing changes. Political types abuse the system and with aircraft, no difference.