Atawapiskat

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Clearwater
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Re: Atawapiskat

Post by Clearwater »

That money doesn't appear on their audited financial statements so I guess we'll just have to trust you.
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pdw
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Re: Atawapiskat

Post by pdw »

trey kule wrote:
Has anyone on here actually LIVED on a reserve (northern reserve that is - the southern ones are almost "normal")?

Yep, and like the others, I agree with you. The problem is the media plays to the chief's tune and those who know nothing else but what they see in the media are clueless. Like the University types who spend three days on a reserve listening to stories and then return to share their deep wisdom.
Yeah, the writer would have to live in the community for a good length to be able to understand to write accurately. With so much input here from the northern aviators in the know,... is maybe showing this forum has editors that could keep the good narrative about this subject on track ?
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xysn
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Re: Atawapiskat

Post by xysn »

Plenty of blame to go around, and whatever the problem is ain't gonna be solved today, or tomorrow, or even in this generation. One thing that needs to happen IMHO is the centralized negotiations between the groups "representing" first nations (e.g. AFN) and INAC, this country is too damn big to come up with policies and changes that fit everyone. Bands live in all sorts of geographies with different histories and languages and different needs.

The only places where there've been success is where smaller groups of bands / tribes / whatever have dealt with the province (e.g. James Bay Cree & Quebec; the bands in BC without treaties) ... a lot of the issues are to do with health, education, and property title where the province is better placed to help with the first nation transition to self-government anyway.

All these attempts at grand solutions between INAC and national native groups have always down in flames.

IMO Ottawa should just set a framework like it does for health and encourage the bands to deal with the province.
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longjon
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Re: Atawapiskat

Post by longjon »

Is this the band that wouldn't let an audit done on their finances?
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pdw
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Re: Attawapiskat

Post by pdw »

No trivial band spat like that now at all (actually, thought that got resolved and the mold crisis was henceforth dealth with). This is the town in northern Ontario along James Bay where the multi suicide concerns were ongoing and at the present time, even among their younger children. All reliable news sources seem to have gotten in sync on this concern; latest news is the town's chief this weekend had sent out an urgent appeal for our prayers in the matter.
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Gorgons
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Re: Atawapiskat

Post by Gorgons »

Property maintenance, a complicated matter. Band members typically don't own anything, they can't own the property they live on. But to make a simpler point lets say you want to make a repair or upgrade. Walk down to the local Northern or community store and check out the hardware section, its probably very close to the electronics section. A sheet of plywood or maybe a sheet of panelling? Maybe a 2 x 4? Nope... you could buy a hammer or a screwdriver though. Tape and glue, sure got lots of that! A plumbing problem... Hmmm maybe I can fix it with some tape and glue? Home Depot and Lowes's don't seem to be interested in establishing locations on first nations reserves.
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Rockie
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Re: Atawapiskat

Post by Rockie »

Meatservo

That was the most articulate and insightful commentary on the problem I've ever read from any source anywhere at any time. I think you nailed it, and bravo for not once opining on what the solution is because nobody outside of these places has a clue about that. Certainly not the government.

Your "editorial" if I may call it that should be published in every newspaper across the country.
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fish4life
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Re: Atawapiskat

Post by fish4life »

Ok there might not be a Home Depot on a reserve but that doesn't mean that they have to rip up floor boards to burn them for a fire or leave garbage EVERYWHERE, burned out cars and smashed windows littering the community.
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av8ts
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Re: Atawapiskat

Post by av8ts »

Sorry Meatservo but I think that is a horrible defeatist attitude. If our ancestors though like that we would all still be living in mud and stick huts in Africa and Europe. Like doesn't just happen "to" you. You go out and make it happen. That 1000 mile journey starts with one step
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CpnCrunch
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Re: Atawapiskat

Post by CpnCrunch »

av8ts wrote:Sorry Meatservo but I think that is a horrible defeatist attitude. If our ancestors though like that we would all still be living in mud and stick huts in Africa and Europe. Like doesn't just happen "to" you. You go out and make it happen. That 1000 mile journey starts with one step
No, I think Meatservo is exactly right, and the vast majority of people live like that. I'm sure Meatservo had to move around to find jobs early in his career, but most people are too lazy to even do that.

Not everyone is ambitious or adventurous. Out of a band of 100 hunter gatherers, it was probably one or two that explored a few hundred miles away, then one or two leaders who encouraged the band to move. Similar for the creativity and individualism to decide to put a different type of roof on your house to everyone else, or to build your house from a different material, etc.

If everyone was adventurous the human race would likely die out pretty quickly because everyone would always be out exploring new areas and nobody would have time to do all the boring-but-important stuff like gather food, raise children, etc.
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longjon
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Re: Atawapiskat

Post by longjon »

Does the band not stock a supply of basic material for repair of their houses. No need for the buildings to be in such a state of disrepair,
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av8ts
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Re: Atawapiskat

Post by av8ts »

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Meatservo
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Re: Atawapiskat

Post by Meatservo »

CpnCrunch wrote:
av8ts wrote:Sorry Meatservo but I think that is a horrible defeatist attitude. If our ancestors though like that we would all still be living in mud and stick huts in Africa and Europe. Like doesn't just happen "to" you. You go out and make it happen. That 1000 mile journey starts with one step
No, I think Meatservo is exactly right, and the vast majority of people live like that. I'm sure Meatservo had to move around to find jobs early in his career, but most people are too lazy to even do that.

Not everyone is ambitious or adventurous. Out of a band of 100 hunter gatherers, it was probably one or two that explored a few hundred miles away, then one or two leaders who encouraged the band to move. Similar for the creativity and individualism to decide to put a different type of roof on your house to everyone else, or to build your house from a different material, etc.

If everyone was adventurous the human race would likely die out pretty quickly because everyone would always be out exploring new areas and nobody would have time to do all the boring-but-important stuff like gather food, raise children, etc.
Guys, I think you're missing my point a little bit. You don't need to worry about me: I have a pretty good job and I've done things in and out of aviation you'd probably be pretty impressed by.

My POINT was that if an average professional person with all of life's advantages can be temporarily immobilized by a small bout of non-chronic depression, imagine what can happen to a population whose average member has valid cause to suffer chronic, systemic and life-long discouragement.
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oldncold
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Re: Atawapiskat

Post by oldncold »

in the interest of not being band of reserve (b.c.r.) d i will keep my statements simple in point form

1/ native leadership dont trust white man education due previous history

2 funding formula of block grants per capitia to band councils provides no incentive for change, because an educated native person will more than likely seek a better life off reserve where which reduces the income and fiefdoms of local band chiefs not a smart play over a few generations .

3/when mining town runs out of ore it shuts down > sandon BC// Cassiar BC // Kitsalt bc // just to name a few we should look at this in the same hard light //no economic opportunity is the root cause, and all the fed money does is postpone this inevitable truth .This the real injustice to both native and non native alike

4/ the feds should stop lying to native peoples there are 600+ reserves and not a chance in hell that we can fund all to a descent standard of living. chiefs in each treaty area should hold election to decide which 1 or two should be properly funded the rest closed and cleaned up. they can live anywhere as all Canadians can but if you want services this where they are.

5/ 99 percent of Canadians have no racism to natives BUT THEY DO ALOT OF ANGER to weak and inept gov'ts as previous poster have alluded to about the social welfare industry ;consultants ,theory experts , do gooders pissing billions down rat-holes while they pay 40 percent in taxes with no end in sight or =return on the money .
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Re: Atawapiskat

Post by Tubthumper »

Let’s be clear, what’s going on in the Northern Ontario First Nation of Attawapiskat is awful – the attempted suicides, the suicide pacts, the decrepit housing and foul water, the chronic unemployment, substance abuse and general despair.

But let’s be equally clear: a legion of government social workers flown in from down south, visits by consoling cabinet ministers, emergency Parliamentary debates and a few barge loads more of taxpayer dollars aren’t going to make an ounce of difference.

Because the problem is neither lack of government nor lack of other people’s money.

When we see images of the squalid homes in Attawapiskat (or scores of other northern reserves) and hear about how residents use buckets as toilets because their towns lack water and sewers, we wonder how such Third World conditions can occur in a First World country such as Canada.

It’s only natural, then, to conclude First Nations are being starved for funds by Ottawa or the provinces.

Then you hear someone such as Ontario Regional Chief Isadore Day say “What if even just 25% of the profits from the diamond mine [90km from Attawapiskat] went to the First Nation, do you think they’d have a new school? They might have two or three. Do you think they’d maybe have a swimming pool for the kids? I think so.”

And that sounds pretty reasonable to you.

But consider this: Diamond company DeBeers already pays the Attawapiskat council nearly $3 million a year for a town of under 2,000 people.

Five years ago, DeBeers gave the community 22 housing units after former Chief Theresa Spence declared a housing emergency. Spence (whose Idle No More hunger strike made her famous) was only too happy to tour southern reporters around the walled tents and uninsulated shacks some residents were living in during the winter. But what most newscasts missed were the empty DeBeers units that Spence and council couldn’t figure out how to distribute.

The mining company has also done over $350 million in business with companies at Attawapiskat since 2006 to supply DeBeers with helicopters, camp catering, fuel, dynamite and other supplies. Many of those businesses are owned by the band.

The proceeds are supposed to go towards new housing, sanitation and recreation. But by the looks of Attawapiskat, the money isn’t making it to where it’s supposed to go.

Moreover, one in seven adults at Attawapiskat is employed by DeBeers – 20% of the mine’s workforce.

Ottawa sends the community another $18 million or more a year, plus more for new houses. Then there is the million or more from the Ontario government and a similar amount from a revenue-sharing agreement for proceeds from aboriginal casinos in southern Ontario.

It’s not uncommon for the Attawapiskat council to receive $30 million annually, or somewhere around $18,000 per resident.

A typical non-aboriginal community in Northern Ontario would have revenues of about $3,500, mostly from its own taxes. It wouldn’t have to pay for its residents’ clinics or housing, the way the First Nation does, but it would have to pay some of its own infrastructure, plus sewage, snow clearing, garbage collection, policing, rec centers and so on.

Now recall that an audit of Attawapiskat’s books in 2013 found over 80% of the band’s transactions lacked sufficient paperwork to determine where or how the money was spent.

The problem is not too little money. If anything, it’s too much money – money that comes too easily and is replaced too quickly if the first batch dries up; money with too few strings attached and too little accountability; that leaves the impression the solution to Attawapiskat’s woes are someone else’s responsibility.

....and where does the $$ go, anyways.....?
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