Air Georgian

[Kosiw]

So what is the current pass/fail rate for Georgian pilots interviewing at AC ?

[gtanorth]

About the same at the others I think, 75 yes 25 no. If you tick all the boxes then it's been high 90%

[piston12]

so gta, what date did the last GGN pilot that was on the PML list get hired at Air Canada?

How many pilots have left since that date and why?


just curious

[Roger1989]

so gta, what date did the last GGN pilot that was on the PML list get hired at Air Canada?

How many pilots have left since that date and why?


just curious

From internal source over 90% have been rejected by AC on the pml. Now they are shopping for a chief pilot. Unbelievable.
Anyone looking for work, be patient and join a real outfit. Apparently crews are being extended on a regular and they are even beginning to schedule "hot" reserve, where one loiters in Terminal 1 all day waiting to pick up the pieces as they fall. Probably the worst working conditions from what I have been told. Of the few I know all have been dwindling down their bond and interviewing elsewhere.

[Wacko]

From internal source over 90% have been rejected by AC on the pml. Now they are shopping for a chief pilot. Unbelievable.
Anyone looking for work, be patient and join a real outfit. Apparently crews are being extended on a regular and they are even beginning to schedule "hot" reserve, where one loiters in Terminal 1 all day waiting to pick up the pieces as they fall. Probably the worst working conditions from what I have been told. Of the few I know all have been dwindling down their bond and interviewing elsewhere.

I heard the same. Went out with a buddy the other day, there is now talk that management is talking to AC to keep the PFOs high so they can keep guys for another 6 months.
There is a "gentleman's agreement" netweeen Sky and GGN not to hire guys. It seems like once you're at this company you're pretty much stuck as far as the AC network... This is all speculation.
What is true is AC has shifted gears and preffer hiring pilots with post secondary to the point that guys will get PFOd after the phone interview. I think they are satisfying the PML requirements this way.
I can also confirm the extensions.... Not sure about the hot reserve though.

[gtanorth]

Lot of extensions in June as the last CRJ arrived and new routes kicked in with added freq on old Jazz routes, certainly the worst crew month since the start. May was no cake walk either, short of crew but they say they are up to a full "enough" roster now, so far July has lost of reserve guys each day with fewer but still to many extensions. Attrition has been to AC, guys rejected by AC and a handful of older guys who left. Plus side is lots of opportunity in training, checking etc so if $$$ is important they do treat the additional duty guys really well on the pay check.

No truth at all to any PML rumours relating to higher rejection rate than any other express partner and certainly no ask to AC to slow down. If you have the education it's about a 90% yes if you don't have the education it's below 50% same as at Jazz and Sky. Re Sky and GGN having an agreement that is not true but since the PML is seniority based then there is a practical deterrent and AC just views it as adding to their feed cost so it certainly does not help on your eventual interview date.

If you want to go to AC go to the first express guy that offers you a job, put you head down for 2 - 3 years and go to AC. Pros and cons at each express player but not enough difference to delay your AC date.

[Roger1989]

Lot of extensions in June as the last CRJ arrived and new routes kicked in with added freq on old Jazz routes, certainly the worst crew month since the start. May was no cake walk either, short of crew but they say they are up to a full "enough" roster now, so far July has lost of reserve guys each day with fewer but still to many extensions. Attrition has been to AC, guys rejected by AC and a handful of older guys who left. Plus side is lots of opportunity in training, checking etc so if $$$ is important they do treat the additional duty guys really well on the pay check.

No truth at all to any PML rumours relating to higher rejection rate than any other express partner and certainly no ask to AC to slow down. If you have the education it's about a 90% yes if you don't have the education it's below 50% same as at Jazz and Sky. Re Sky and GGN having an agreement that is not true but since the PML is seniority based then there is a practical deterrent and AC just views is as adding to thier feed cost so it certainly does not help on your eventual interview date.

If you want to go to AC go to the first express guy that offers you a job, put you head down for 2 - 3 years and go to AC. Pros and cons at each express player but not a be enough difference to delay your AC date.

[Roger1989]

Lot of extensions in June as the last CRJ arrived and new routes kicked in with added freq on old Jazz routes, certainly the worst crew month since the start. May was no cake walk either, short of crew but they say they are up to a full "enough" roster now, so far July has lost of reserve guys each day with fewer but still to many extensions. Attrition has been to AC, guys rejected by AC and a handful of older guys who left. Plus side is lots of opportunity in training, checking etc so if $$$ is important they do treat the additional duty guys really well on the pay check.

No truth at all to any PML rumours relating to higher rejection rate than any other express partner and certainly no ask to AC to slow down. If you have the education it's about a 90% yes if you don't have the education it's below 50% same as at Jazz and Sky. Re Sky and GGN having an agreement that is not true but since the PML is seniority based then there is a practical deterrent and AC just views is as adding to thier feed cost so it certainly does not help on your eventual interview date.

If you want to go to AC go to the first express guy that offers you a job, put you head down for 2 - 3 years and go to AC. Pros and cons at each express player but not a be enough difference to delay your AC date.

NO> FALSE.
If you want to go to AC put your head down at Jazz and Sky they are hiring.
Attrition at GGN went to cargo jet, corporate and encore. If you don't believe just speak with a current ggn employee yourself and get the facts. of the half dozen I know there now, all have interviewed elsewhere. Their chief just left.... again!

[Heisenberg666]

What Roger1989 says is accurate.

[gtanorth]

Cargo jet is true. 2 Pfo's and an older guy. Encore was 1 guy with no post secondary. Those with no post secondary are applying elsewhere and why wouldn't they. Ac has seemed to change the rules since they joined. I see no conflicting information from what I said. As I said PFO and old guy attrition the sky is not falling and don't believe a guy that failed an upgrade and a washout.

[fruitloops]

Cargo jet is true. 2 Pfo's and an older guy. Encore was 1 guy with no post secondary. Those with no post secondary are applying elsewhere and why wouldn't they. Ac has seemed to change the rules since they joined. I see no conflicting information from what I said. As I said PFO and old guy attrition the sky is not falling and don't believe a guy that failed an upgrade and a washout.

AC did a whack of interviews over the past couple of months so obviously there was lots of rumors, and fall out but also lots of hiring too across all carriers including GGN. The 90% PFO rate is BS, closer to 25% so 3 hires to 1 PFO - so when you do 30-60 interviews in a company....yeah that's 10-20 PFO's...and Bad news travels fast.

So many on these boards have said before me that it's only a guaranteed interview and that's it - the rest is up to whether you can meet the standards of AC screening process and AC hiring requirements. It's a pretty comprehensive process compared to the regional hiring process.

My understanding is that there is no AC preference for a specific express carrier is my understanding. Express carrier chief pilots don't actually know what AC is doing with respect to interviewing/hiring - basically they get a notice from the pilot hired and then have to replace the pilot and that's it. If AC had to coordinate with each carrier whether to hire or not and when.... it would be a nightmare/unethical/discriminatory so dream on if you want to use that as an excuse for not making the cut... whatever makes some feel better.

Most pilots that do get PFO'd immediately start applying elsewhere as the AC bubble has been popped and why stay flying with regionals at a pace of 18-20 days month or more... when there are better gigs and pay out there like Sunwing, AirTransat, CargoJet, Corporate, etc. .... the AC hiring and pfo's generates lots of movement rightfully so.

BTW - I heard that Jazz PML 1.0 is done AC has gone through it completely and AC is moving onto 2.0 where it's proportional hiring across all express carriers. They went through it a lot faster than many predicted

[Wacko]

fruitloops you obviously have no idea what you're talking about so just stop. Jazz was getting updates on the pilots AC was taking for years. That's the whole point of the alliance, it allows (in theory) for the regionals to prepare by hiring replacements.
I don't think even Jazz PML ver 1 had a 75% success rate... And that was in ACs best interest to move those guys....

[gtanorth]

Actually, fruitloops hit the nail on the head other than I would say there is a bit of communication between AC and the carrier but numbers only not names unless someone is on the bubble then the CP gets a call. The PML is a win win win for pilot, regional and AC.

[Roger1989]

Air Georgian at it again. Every single flight was delayed or cancelled.
Folks do your homework. Do not sign a bond with those people. If you already have, apply get out and cut your losses. I'm not even sure how they are allowed to continue operating.

[Tiessen]

Not to kick a dead horse but has anyone heard anything from Georgian lately? Looks like their online application page is back up but haven't heard anything in the way of confirmation that my application was received or not. Sent my resume to the HR email listed several times as well but have only ever gotten the "out of office" automated response...

[schnitzel2k3]

Apply to Jazz or Sky instead. Their requirements are the same as GGN with better everything.

Don't waste another second with GGN.

S.

[Wacko]

Apply to Jazz or Sky instead. Their requirements are the same as GGN with better everything.

Don't waste another second with GGN.

S.

As it stands right now +1

[Roger1989]

Im not sure why anyone applies to air Georgian with so much out there.
They are currently joining alpa but that will have no effect for a minimum of two years. Be smart about where you sign a contract. Unless your coming off an instructing gig I don't see how you could possibly want to work for those people.

[Tylerjohnston]

I was just wondering if anyone had some current info on the flight follower position or the crew schedule position. Feel free to PM.

Much appreciated,
Cheers

[flying4dollars]

Im not sure why anyone applies to air Georgian with so much out there.
They are currently joining alpa but that will have no effect for a minimum of two years. Be smart about where you sign a contract. Unless your coming off an instructing gig I don't see how you could possibly want to work for those people.

I seriously don't understand this mentality. You don't think people would have gone to fly a Q4 at jazz or encore first? The people that end up going to Georgian end up doing so because they were first offered jobs by them. Are you suggesting everyone puts their eggs in other baskets? That's a terrible decision. One of the lessons I've learned in aviation is to apply where you WANT to go, and take what's offered in front of you first.

The mentality of turning down some jobs is quite unbelievable around here. Not everyone is in a place to not apply or not take a job, whether it be at Georgian or anywhere else.

[gtanorth]

Not everyone parts ways with their previous employers on good terms. I hope that young people seeking career advice take some of these posts with the grain of salt. I won't call people out but one of the long time GGN bashers was let go from GGN for "non-flying related reasons" and another washed out of upgrade training. I am sure they have their side of the story and who knows what is correct but in general always consider the source and put the appropriate weight to it if you are making career decisions based on an anonymous forum.

If you want to go to ac then apply to Jazz, Sky, GGN and maybe EVAS if that is appropriate for your experience level. They are all on a seniority based PML. Go to the first one to offer you a job. The conditions at any of them are not far enough apart to have it weigh into your decision and waiting for one over the other just puts you at AC a bunch of seniority numbers later and that can have a big long term impact on career earnings, far far more than any difference in your first 2 -3 years of airline flying. If you want to make a regional a career then stick with Jazz, they are still the only one with a high enough top end to make it a career place.

[MrTurbine]

Really, from a washout.........

The only washout is the company who's flying broken down rj's with ridiculous attrition rates that you seem to be so well educated on. Ggn is an absolute joke and what they make passengers go through is horrible. Just take a stroll down that terminal late one night. now that Jazz is gone its apparent how incompetent ggn is. Only a matter of time before they run out of candidates then nicky nick will have a crack at flying a giant deferral.

Nicky Nick at GGN? Doubt he's that lucky

[Oxi]

Im not sure why anyone applies to air Georgian with so much out there.
They are currently joining alpa but that will have no effect for a minimum of two years. Be smart about where you sign a contract. Unless your coming off an instructing gig I don't see how you could possibly want to work for those people.

I seriously don't understand this mentality. You don't think people would have gone to fly a Q4 at jazz or encore first? The people that end up going to Georgian end up doing so because they were first offered jobs by them. Are you suggesting everyone puts their eggs in other baskets? That's a terrible decision. One of the lessons I've learned in aviation is to apply where you WANT to go, and take what's offered in front of you first.

The mentality of turning down some jobs is quite unbelievable around here. Not everyone is in a place to not apply or not take a job, whether it be at Georgian or anywhere else.

The folks I have known as previous co workers have been PFOd by both and/or Jazz and Encore and only then took Air Georgian.

[Jimmy2]

So how are things at Georgian these days for a CRJ F/O? Is it still $37/hour plus per diems? What's a typical day/week/month like working there?
Approximately how long for upgrade to Captain? What happened with the ALPA vote? Are they still deciding if they are going to join? How many months/years is it currently taking to get your PML interview at AC? Thanks.

[AvLife]

Also curious about current GGN situation. Is anyone here flying the 1900 or CRJ for them?