Orca Airlines CYYJ

[upup_away]

A16P0108
14:19:00 UTC

A Piper Chieftain operated as ORK311 by Orca Airlines was arriving at CYYJ on a VFR flight plan from CYVR. As ORK311 was inbound at 500 feet ASL weather conditions were variable with multiple cloud layers. At 2 nautical miles on final, the flight entered IMC. The pilot then executed a 180 degree turn in order to return to VMC. A deHavilland DHC-8-300 operated as JZA55 by Jazz Aviation was on final at 5 NM from CYVR and was instructed to go around with vectors provided for a second approach. Meanwhile, ORK311 was able to re-establish VMC and returned to land at CYYJ.

Do those chieftains not have serviceable ifr equipment? I get it - that's the flight school method of getting out of IMC rate 1 turn, 180deg... but seems like an odd procedure while on final. It's not like those clouds creep up on you.

Bad spot to be in, regardless. Any thoughts from people flying in/out of YYJ?

[IWANTTOFLYYIN]

....mm interesting, the guys who fly for ORCA in AB almost always fly through the worst weather.

[sportingrifle]

Hmmmm...an IFR equipped and crewed airplane is VFR, 2 miles from the runway, and loses required visual reference. At an airport less than 30 minutes away with weather reporting and webcams. And the flight was planned VFR why? To save 10 minutes? Sorry to be cynical, but they may not be so lucky next time. That turn might take them into one of the many hills around there. Just like many that have tried to save a few minutes by .. running VFR on the coast have learned at the hard way in decades past.

[bezerker]

VFR go arounds were concern enough to be discussed at the recent ALPA Safety Forum in DC.

VFR approaches are very handy for everyone involved.

There are no consistent procedures in Canada for going around when visual.

I've been caught before when I was positive I would remain visual throughout maneuvering.

Anyway...if the guys didn't have instructions from ATC that they violated...it seems like they followed the TC AIM according to what was written above.

Sh*t happens. Maybe next time they will be more cautious going VFR in marginal wx and maybe ATC will be more cautious allowing VFR aircraft into airspace or allowing close proximity to IFR aircraft when remaining VMC is not assured.

[Meatservo]

Sh*t happens.

Yup. Everyone did what they were supposed to do, no-one got hurt, no rules were broken, and the ATC guys got to write up a CADORS which I am secretly convinced they enjoy doing. Case closed.

[co-joe]

A16P0108
14:19:00 UTC
...

Do those chieftains not have serviceable ifr equipment? ...

For sure they would but having to take IFR fuel would really cut into the useful load. Probably enough that this flight would have gone to someone else. Not making excuses, but if you can get in VFR, your boss can sell that capacity with seats or cargo.

[Go Juice]

Or you take the IFR fuel and your boss can sell two revenue flights.

[goingnowherefast]

Load up the IFR fuel and say to the customer, "we need to leave 100lbs of bags behind, we will sell you a second charter" Customer thinks $$$
Then customer goes to the guys across the street who loaded VFR fuel and takes the 100lbs of bags in one run. Or take IFR gas, the extra bags and just flies overweight...that happens too at certain operators.

The real trick is to explain the problem to the customer in a way that they understand and gain a level of trust. That's how you get repeat business.


Of course, we all know weather never changes rapidly or unexpectedly.

[upup_away]

Appreciate the insight everyone

Edit:
As an aside.... if i were jazz and had to pay for the fuel to overshoot because another operator is too cheap, id be a little ticked