Jazz CRJ crash at LaGuardia

[pelmet]

Looks like the RELs were operating properly and the truck ignored/missed them?

If I read the report correctly for the RWSL system, there is no red stop bar perpendicular to the taxiway. What they did have were taxiway centreline lights and the red lights that are also on the centreline. It appears that they had the same situation that I encountered in my last post, a situation where red lights can end up not being noticed.

Ah yes you're right. That shounds like a horrible design... Very easy to miss in a sea of lights...

My thought at the time of my encounter was that if the red lights cycle on and off, perhaps once every second, they would be more likely to be noticed.

[330heavy]

If I read the report correctly for the RWSL system, there is no red stop bar perpendicular to the taxiway. What they did have were taxiway centreline lights and the red lights that are also on the centreline. It appears that they had the same situation that I encountered in my last post, a situation where red lights can end up not being noticed.

Ah yes you're right. That shounds like a horrible design... Very easy to miss in a sea of lights...

My thought at the time of my encounter was that if the red lights cycle on and off, perhaps once every second, they would be more likely to be noticed.

Actually good idea to have them flash

[7ECA]

It is also noted in the preliminary report that the lights shut off 3-4 seconds before the arrival of an aircraft at the intersection. It seems like that's a rather stupid "feature", and may have created a false sense of security if the lights are red when you arrive at an intersection - and then shut off, except there's still an aircraft on the runway travelling at 100+ knots.

Ultimately, though, it seems as though Truck 1 had a crew that seemed to be overly task saturated with tunnel vision. Maybe there was some element of normalization of deviance, it's hard to say. But only one truck barrelled onto the runway, when the others stayed well back or stopped.

[pelmet]

Still remember being told as a kid to look both ways before crossing the street(as a pedestrian). I see people on a regular basis not do this.

One should always do it to the point that it became instinct long ago. It could take a very long time until it eventually saves you. In my case, many, years later, I did it by instinct after looking left and starting to move forward. I looked right and a cyclist was right there about to hit me, but I pulled back.

As a car driver, it is not necessarily instinct to look both ways before crossing streets with a green light when on a fairly busy road as we pass so many streets and focus frequently needs to kept on the vehicle in front of us.

But one should be doing that when crossing runways at an airport, whether in a ground vehicle or aircraft.

[7ECA]

As a car driver, it is not necessarily instinct to look both ways before crossing streets with a green light when on a fairly busy road as we pass so many streets and focus frequently needs to kept on the vehicle in front of us.

But one should be doing that when crossing runways at an airport, whether in a ground vehicle or aircraft.

It should be instinctual that you clear left and right when approaching an intersection. Not to mention when a light turns green and you're stationary, clear the intersection - don't just put your foot down. The amount of times people blow through reds, or a truck can't stop in time, etc...

It's unfortunately a very human factors heavy accident, where the holes lined up due to a variety of factors beyond the control of the Jazz crew.

[co-joe]

Still remember being told as a kid to look both ways before crossing the street(as a pedestrian). I see people on a regular basis not do this.

...

Especially on one-way streets. I've seen people get run over by cars going the wrong way on one-way streets in yyc twice! Both times the j-walkers only looked one way and went for it. The one lady in front of the courthouse went under both sets of wheels before the guy was able to stop.