Sky Regional Pilot Contract

[Takeoff OK]

There has always been and always will be someone willing to take the job, regardless of pay scale. Get over it. The real reason Sky Regional and their shitty pay exists is because in this industry, time and again, the senior pilots always eat their young. This is why the US has been running regional jets at poverty wages for over a decade. Someone always gives up scope to protect their asses at the top of the pyramid. Then they blame young guys for stealing their flying and destroying the industry.

Cue ACPA's previous MEC.

Without them, Sky would not have been able to exist. This is a fact. Once that genie was out of the bottle there was no way to ever put it back. They should have known this, and probably did, but just didn't give a shit about anyone else. The stage was set for the government (in an unprecedented move on this continent) to then divert the 175s off property. Now, Westjet is using SR pay to set the bar for Encore rates, and voila! A new "industry standard" has been establish to f*ck everyone else with when contracts come up for renegotiation.

So again: Thank you, former ACPA MEC, for helping to drive this industry even further into the ground. Assholes.

[Cisbour]

U There will always be someone in this situation and the bean counters/executives know this.

Exactly. And these bean counters aren't blind. They've heard about Georgian and CMA operating scheds without facing hard times to find new guys to fly their planes. In my opinion the laid offs guys have an excuse. The 704 PICs having well paid jobs enjoying top seniority in well established companies, not that much!

[ikarus]

Someone told me at work that SKY has tweaked its pay due to introduction of Embraers this February?

Anyone has any info on it?

[Regional Rat]

I've been working here as a Captain for about a year and half...

Let's just say it's "BOTTOM OF THE BARREL" jet flying! If you're unemployed or need some jet time to advance your career, then go for it. But if you are looking for a job to settle into, forget it! People here are unhappy. We are underpaid and nothing is going to change, as long as they fill the pilot's seats and the flights keep going management does not and will not care. I haven't met anyone with plans of staying here, that right there should tell you something.

When I came here, I looked at Russ' reputation (Founder/CEO). Everyone that worked at Sky Service loved it and were well paid, OK, great! The 'noise' from the top down was "We know the pay is not where it has to be and we will address that after start-up". OK, great! What ended up happening? "Big announcement- Pay Scale coming out".... They gave 2% = Cost of living already in our contracts over 3 years. In other words, NOTHING! Sure they give us a 5% annual bonus, but that's just a little nibble of what has been taken of the top by running this operation. Our President just bought himself a Lear with his $4.2 million bonus from AC. Upper management makes WELL into the 6 figures and a line Captain can't even own a home.

Along with Encore and Georgian, it's the place to be if you are on your way somewhere else or you have just given up on flying as a 'Profession'. The lead-hand loading the bags for Air Canada makes more than the Captain along with better benefits AND A PENSION! The travel benefits, 'C4' which is about as low as you can go without being a family member of a 'C4'! So good luck getting anywhere.

Sure I sound negative, but I'm a product of my environment and my feelings are not unique... Just ask an SR Pilot next time you see one hanging their head.

[Regional Rat]

Someone told me at work that SKY has tweaked its pay due to introduction of Embraers this February?

Anyone has any info on it?

Same pay, same story....

[Regional Rat]

They actually found guys with no self worth who will work for those wages? [/quote]

Better than that we're talking about 704 PICs in a decent company running for their lives to fly the EMJ to get some jet time and get the @#$! outta there..This is not making any good to us. Talking about a long term salary drop here...[/quote]

Maybe they will realize what they are doing to this industry and hang their heads low as you walk by them in the terminal. And if they dont, they should[/quote]


We do...

[Regional Rat]

Ok so let me get this right. What you are saying is its ok to take this pay, then next time 65k a year is ok, then 45k a year and so on. But all because of the feed the family thing. Yeah great solution. Oh I didnt say we should give these guys dirty looks. If they held their head down no one would have to.

Some pilots out there are trying to better the industry, some are making it worse. I support the first type.

There's actually one more type: Just looking out for themselves and F%@$ the industry! Get in, get what you need and sell it the highest overseas bidder! When Third World nations that fly the same types (often with much higher operating costs) can pay $10,000+ per month and the local 'Industry' you speak of can't afford $4K/month... There's a lot of dis-information going! This is the best way! Send them a message that it isn't good enough WITHOUT UNEMPLOYMENT! USE THEM LIKE THEY USE US! I support the THIRD TYPE!

[Maxpwr]

So what have YOU done to try and make Sky a better place to work??? Have you personally spoken to anyone in management about your concerns? My guess would be a great big no. I've also been there for about a year and a half and I've seen only timely responses to my concerns. Shit just the other day I was griping about pairing quality to our HR person and by the next day I had gotten emails from
the C.O.O. and spend almost 2 hours on the phone with the head of scheduling. Here's the funny thing...when you actually communicate with the right people instead of just whining on the internet you can actually get something accomplished. If you really can't stand to look at yourself in the mirror, or if you really want to improve the day to day life at Sky then just LEAVE! We don't need dead weight! And one more thing, nobody pulled the wool over your eyes. You knew exactly what the pay was when you signed up. And sign up you did.

[Localizer]

Lol. Maxpwr I'm sure pairing construction will change now that you've added your two cents. I hope my sarcastic tone came through clearly.

Regional Rat thanks for sharing the truth about the lifestyle and operation, hopefully your post will reach some people. All the best.

[Regional Rat]

So what have YOU done to try and make Sky a better place to work??? Have you personally spoken to anyone in management about your concerns? My guess would be a great big no. I've also been there for about a year and a half and I've seen only timely responses to my concerns. Shit just the other day I was griping about pairing quality to our HR person and by the next day I had gotten emails from
the C.O.O. and spend almost 2 hours on the phone with the head of scheduling. Here's the funny thing...when you actually communicate with the right people instead of just whining on the internet you can actually get something accomplished. If you really can't stand to look at yourself in the mirror, or if you really want to improve the day to day life at Sky then just LEAVE! We don't need dead weight! And one more thing, nobody pulled the wool over your eyes. You knew exactly what the pay was when you signed up. And sign up you did.

How's that KOOL-AID Maxpowr?! As long as people like you are 'buying the BS' the industry in this country is doomed! You'll get lost in 'Pairing quality', the exchange rate on $1.50 and "Who should tip the driver" all the while missing the REAL point... They don't pay, they led us to believe they will pay and THEY AREN'T GOING TO PAY! You wanna believe that getting 'pairing quality' talked about by your COO is doing something to make it better?! Get your head out of your BUTT! These people are brilliant at the smokescreen tactics, too bad your aren't just as brilliant, or you'd see through it.

Actually, I disagree... The picture was painted differently, so yeh the wool was pulled over my eyes. I didn't see it. Fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me! I'm not going to waste my time squabbling over pennies on the dollar, 2% raises, who tips the driver and 'pairing-quality' when I fly $30M Jet (Left seat) and get paid less than a TTC bus driver.

Of course, if the highest point in your 'Career' was to be an FO in a PC12 up North and now you're on the shinny jet, then I guess life is pretty good here! Wait until you have a little more invested in your career there buck-o, you'll see it different!

I might be the 'dead-weight' at Sky, but you're the 'dead-weight' on the Canadian industry. That's my opinion, and I'm entitled to it (as you are to your own). If you don't like it... TOO F'N BAD!

PS: Enjoy that "PAIRING QUALITY"....

[Regional Rat]

Lol. Maxpwr I'm sure pairing construction will change now that you've added your two cents. I hope my sarcastic tone came through clearly.

Regional Rat thanks for sharing the truth about the lifestyle and operation, hopefully your post will reach some people. All the best.

Amen Brotha!!!

[Maxpwr]

Lol look at you now. Best of friends cuz he gives you what you want to hear? I never said I had anything to do with pairing construction. Simply providing feedback to the powers that be...trying out this new fangled thing called communication (I hope my sarcasm came through there).

[Regional Rat]

Lol look at you now. Best of friends cuz he gives you what you want to hear? I never said I had anything to do with pairing construction. Simply providing feedback to the powers that be...trying out this new fangled thing called communication (I hope my sarcasm came through there).

MASTER WARNING!!! HEAD-IN-ASS!!

Bet you don't know the memory items there Buck-o! LMAO!

[Maxpwr]

Wow Master Warning? How clever! I see what you did there, tied it into an aviation term and everything. I appreciate the effort you put into slagging me. I'm flattered you get a gold star and big hug! Mwah! Goodnight friends.

[Regional Rat]

Wow Master Warning? How clever! I see what you did there, tied it into an aviation term and everything. I appreciate the effort you put into slagging me. I'm flattered you get a gold star and big hug! Mwah! Goodnight friends.

Goodnight ML! xoxo

[rocket81]

Interresting reading you Regional Rat, thanks for sharing.

I will send those lines to a few friends that are looking forward to apply at skyreg. I was recently told by a friend sky reg were loosing pilots. To prevent the bleeding they are planning on making pays much better... I guess it's rumours BS...

[Regional Rat]

Interresting reading you Regional Rat, thanks for sharing.

I will send those lines to a few friends that are looking forward to apply at skyreg. I was recently told by a friend sky reg were loosing pilots. To prevent the bleeding they are planning on making pays much better... I guess it's rumours BS...

Let's just believe it when you see it! I've heard rumors here that the "New Pay Scale" is coming out but I'm prepared to be disappointed. The last time this happened, they re-published our 2% cost of living (already in contract), re-announced the 5% profit share (already told we would get) and then called it 11% over 3 years!!!! For those at lower IQ levels or sipping Kool-aid, they might have bought it... Realists, nope!

Apart from that, if your friends want/need Jet or 705 time and are willing to suck-it-up for awhile to get elsewhere then I see the motivation. But if they already make decent money, fly decent equipment then don't bother. The plane is decent here, the day-to-day is pretty routine and there's not too many Kool-aid sippin dipsticks to deal with on the line. But a few!

[tincanflyer]

Regional Rat, Thanks for the posts and telling us how it is. I'll pass it on to people I know in industry.

[fruz]

Regional rat,

You must be a real treat to fly with. I hope for the sake of your fo's, you don't go on rants like this when you work. I'm not defending the situation at sky regional. Your argument is valid. But youre barking at the wrong people.

Fruz

[Regional Rat]

Regional rat,

You must be a real treat to fly with. I hope for the sake of your fo's, you don't go on rants like this when you work. I'm not defending the situation at sky regional. Your argument is valid. But youre barking at the wrong people.

Fruz

On the contrary Sir! I get along great with all my FO's and I also treat my entire crew with respect they deserve, after all we're in the same boat! To be quite honest, they're getting a worse deal than I am so a lot of what upsets me is on their behalf. Again, I'm a product of my environment not just some crusty instigator! I'm sure there's one or two that haven't enjoyed flying with me for various reasons... But hey, nobody's perfect least of all me! The rants I have gone on at work are normally mutual rants, as I also said, there's a lot of unhappy people here. So it isn't hard to find common ground on the issue whether it be the flight deck or the cabin!

On your second point, if I understand you, I don't think you could be anymore incorrect! A forum IS for barking, debate and just 'putting it out there'... That's how we pass on information to other colleagues.

[timel]

What it is with personal attacks!
Thanks for RR to share latest infos.
It is actually very valuable coming from a captain IMO.

[Regional Rat]

What it is with personal attacks!
Thanks for RR to share latest infos.
It is actually very valuable coming from a captain IMO.

If there is something you need to know, just ask. I'll do my best.

[timel]

What it is with personal attacks!
Thanks for RR to share latest infos.
It is actually very valuable coming from a captain IMO.

If there is something you need to know, just ask. I'll do my best.

I find interesting to read your process with sky regional.

I've been speaking to a couple pilots lately that were saying sky regional is the future place you want to work at, they are going to surpass jazz and porter, work conditions are going to improve strongly... It looks like it is not true. Some people seems very good at putting stories up or pilots just want to believe...

I agree that most pilots go work for a company believing it will be great. Seems it is a just a loop of lies that perpetuates if we do not get informed. So thanks for speaking up.

[timel]

When is the new pay scale coming out?

[Regional Rat]

I find interesting to read your process with sky regional.

I've been speaking to a couple pilots lately that were saying sky regional is the future place you want to work at, they are going to surpass jazz and porter, work conditions are going to improve strongly... It looks like it is not true. Some people seems very good at putting stories up or pilots just want to believe...

I agree that most pilots go work for a company believing it will be great. Seems it is a just a loop of lies that perpetuates if we do not get informed. So thanks for speaking up.

Agreed... Of course we all want to believe that we work for the 'Next Big Thing' in aviation, if it were only true! LOL A start-up (like Sky) will paint nice pictures to attract the people they need. Maybe they believed some of it themselves in the beginning, we were getting lines from management like:
-"We know the pay isn't were it should be, but we will address it after start up."
-"If we do a good job with the E175 we might get ALL the E190's and possibly some 319s"
-"We want to be the best Airline in Canada to work for"
-"FO's will upgrade as soon as they are ready and have the required time, despite the 'Seniority list'"

None of it has happened. We didn't get a raise (pay scale), IMHO we will never see a 190 let alone a 319. There's a lot of discontent here and not one FO has made it through the upgrade that I know of but they keep hiring direct entry. And yes, there's more than a few that a ready to go!

It is the place you want to be to 'check' some more boxes on your resume and get some good time in the book... But there's no long term or even a future here. JAZZ has seen it's day. Porter, we'll see how it goes for them but Bob's grand dreams seem to be stalled maybe not to recover. Georgian isn't doing to well from what I hear. Encore, well, what can I say. Another disappointment in a growing list of Canadian Regionals!

If you get into Big Red and put in a 25-30 year career, you'll do alright. If that's not your thing then get experience from these Regionals and go overseas, get treated and paid like the professional you are!