Air Canada Pool

[Mr. North]

Like many I updated my resume during the latest opening but I haven't heard anything. No emails going one way or the other, nothing. Anyone else in my situation? Can I assume no news is good news?

[loadshed]

Got the PFO email

FYI...
9700+ hours
6000+ jet

Numerous Boeing type ratings.
2 year aviation diploma.
No degree / no French.

[Jean-Pierre]

I wonder why these jet jockey apply to Air Canada when they could go to Asia and make $10-30k/month USD and way lower income tax?

[LTD]

I wonder why these jet jockey apply to Air Canada when they could go to Asia and make $10-30k/month USD and way lower income tax?

Really..?
How about not wanting to uproot your wife/husband and kids from the life they have built for themselves here in Canada!? Friends and Family? How about not wanting to move to a random city half way across the world for an employer that might not have the same safety standards as most major canadian airlines? How about job security? Maybe making close to 200 thousand dollars a year at Air Canada after a few years is enough money for any reasonable and well balanced person?

What I wonder is why people ask such narrow minded questions...

[Jean-Pierre]

200 thousand dollars a year at Air Canada after a few years

Define a few.

[NotDirty!]

200 thousand dollars a year at Air Canada after a few years

Define a few.

25 years to life?

[altiplano]

"Define a few years"

EMJ captain is going to guys only 3 years in... and it's getting shorter every bid... Likely be new hires getting the opportunity to bid it immediately very soon...

That's $165K/yr

I heard from someone in the training department that 737 captain is expected to go very junior when it comes next year... ie 2-3 years seniority or less.

That's $200K/yr

Guess we'll see what happens with the C-series... It will pay better than the EMJ almost as well as the 737/320...

Future is bright in terms of opportunity at AC going forward.

[dtpilot]

Anybody that asks why people with lots if experience are applying to AC haven't worked/lived in the hole that is everything from Beijing to Istanbul. There's a reason people immigrate to canada and not the other way around! #expatforlife #getmeouttahere

[watermeth]

"Define a few years"

EMJ captain is going to guys only 3 years in... and it's getting shorter every bid... Likely be new hires getting the opportunity to bid it immediately very soon...

That's $165K/yr

I heard from someone in the training department that 737 captain is expected to go very junior when it comes next year... ie 2-3 years seniority or less.

That's $200K/yr.

Nice numbers. What I fail to understand is this : let say you're in since 3years and an opportunity to bid cpt on those aircraft shows up. You're still on the first five years payscale defined under the latest contract. How much are you paid ?
I believe the info you provide alti but what about such a short upgrade time vs. Capped five first years ?
Thanks.

[pilotman15]

It's first 4 years that has a capped pay scale regardless of type. Once you go to the left seat you are no longer on the "flat" pay and move to formula pay for your aircraft type and YOS.

[Chinaflyer]

Anybody that asks why people with lots if experience are applying to AC haven't worked/lived in the hole that is everything from Beijing to Istanbul. There's a reason people immigrate to canada and not the other way around! #expatforlife #getmeouttahere

Absolutely right! I actually love Beijing but it's not that simple working over here. It gets old always being a "foreign pilot". Sure the money is great but it's not that much when you consider the lifestyle that goes with many of these jobs is unsustainable.

[altiplano]

"Define a few years"

EMJ captain is going to guys only 3 years in... and it's getting shorter every bid... Likely be new hires getting the opportunity to bid it immediately very soon...

That's $165K/yr

I heard from someone in the training department that 737 captain is expected to go very junior when it comes next year... ie 2-3 years seniority or less.

That's $200K/yr.

Nice numbers. What I fail to understand is this : let say you're in since 3years and an opportunity to bid cpt on those aircraft shows up. You're still on the first five years payscale defined under the latest contract. How much are you paid ?
I believe the info you provide alti but what about such a short upgrade time vs. Capped five first years ?
Thanks.

4 year fixed pay rates only applies to F/O & RP's - no matter if you're on the 777 or the EMJ or rouge you get the same rate.

If you bid a left seat you go to formula captain pay for that type no matter if you are still in your first few years. Fixed rate does not apply to Captain seats.

[watermeth]

thx for the info.

[Old fella]

"Define a few years"

EMJ captain is going to guys only 3 years in... and it's getting shorter every bid... Likely be new hires getting the opportunity to bid it immediately very soon...

That's $165K/yr

I heard from someone in the training department that 737 captain is expected to go very junior when it comes next year... ie 2-3 years seniority or less.

That's $200K/yr.

Nice numbers. What I fail to understand is this : let say you're in since 3years and an opportunity to bid cpt on those aircraft shows up. You're still on the first five years payscale defined under the latest contract. How much are you paid ?
I believe the info you provide alti but what about such a short upgrade time vs. Capped five first years ?
Thanks.

4 year fixed pay rates only applies to F/O & RP's - no matter if you're on the 777 or the EMJ or rouge you get the same rate.

If you bid a left seat you go to formula captain pay for that type no matter if you are still in your first few years. Fixed rate does not apply to Captain seats.

Pardon my ignorance about AC operations but would your airline really entertain that - direct entry left seat captain position from off the street candidates.

[altiplano]

IIRC they had a few in the past when the EMJ first showed up... When we had the RJ guys were going left seat really quick too.

I don't think the company wants to our expects to hire direct left seat off the street per se but the upgrade process at AC is involved even for a for a guy who's been here a while... If someone can pass it successfully I'm sure they'll have the company's confidence.

That said depending on your background I'm not sure if I'd even want to go DEC... Sounds like a great idea when you look at the paycheque but if you can't walk the walk you might be taking on too much and set yourself up for failure...

On the other hand if you're experienced in 705 jet ops and want to earn some cake out of the gate why not?

[fruitloops]

it's not just the pay but the potential schedule that in my opinion is worth it's weight in gold. It's pretty tough to find a better schedule anywhere else once you collect a bit of seniority

[Old fella]

IIRC they had a few in the past when the EMJ first showed up... When we had the RJ guys were going left seat really quick too.

I don't think the company wants to our expects to hire direct left seat off the street per se but the upgrade process at AC is involved even for a for a guy who's been here a while... If someone can pass it successfully I'm sure they'll have the company's confidence.

That said depending on your background I'm not sure if I'd even want to go DEC... Sounds like a great idea when you look at the paycheque but if you can't walk the walk you might be taking on too much and set yourself up for failure...

On the other hand if you're experienced in 705 jet ops and want to earn some cake out of the gate why not?

If I wore a much younger man's clothes and AC were interested in hiring me, I would opt for RP position preferably on the B777 or B787 if direct entry was available. Continuing with the younger clothes theme, I would do my very best to stay on the heavy iron wide body or bid on those asap from the narrow body domestic fleet. I am only interested in Air Canada, nobody else, not wanting to smash Q400 on the "Fogo, Twillingate, Mortons Harbour all round the circle type flying jobs, even WJ as good as they are, just not my style- being honest.. Anyway knowing me, and I know "me" very well, kinda doubt AC would entertain the thought of"me", to many better guys/gals out there even though I am university educated - which doesn't mean eff all. It would be "bugger" aviation and off the either DAL or UNB Law school to be a shine of a CDA............

[MagicMilkshake]

I'm just going to leave this here

[DEFPOTEC]

If anyone has info on the phone interview, I would appreciate a pm!

Thanks

[DEFPOTEC]

Nobody's done one yet?

[Soar]

Whoa horsie!!! I can honestly say my jaw just dropped after reading the salary quote!

The whole reason for my family and I not returning to Canada was I couldn't afford to take a huge pay cut. Those number are at least 20% more then what I've been quote from friends at AC. I'm assuming you guys/gals work there? I'm actually really happy at the company I'm at now, 14-20 days off a month, 3 or so long haul flights a month, with the exchange rate making a bit over 260k ... but 200k from a junior position (let's not talk about tax) and living in one of the best places in the world is a huge draw! I'm going to have to look into this indeed!

So what would a wide body captain make!? Did you guys get a pay raise?

Those numbers

"Define a few years"

EMJ captain is going to guys only 3 years in... and it's getting shorter every bid... Likely be new hires getting the opportunity to bid it immediately very soon...

That's $165K/yr

I heard from someone in the training department that 737 captain is expected to go very junior when it comes next year... ie 2-3 years seniority or less.

That's $200K/yr

Guess we'll see what happens with the C-series... It will pay better than the EMJ almost as well as the 737/320...

Future is bright in terms of opportunity at AC going forward.

[rudder]

Those NB Capt numbers are all top-scale so that is 12+ YOS.

[aV1aTOr]

Good point rudder. No one in their 3rd year is making 165k at AC. 90k is more likely (especially if at rouge). And the few junior (4-5 year sen.) emj captains are making 140k at best. The 737 capt positions going junior is just a theory at this point. Let's wait til the planes arrive and positions are awarded.
I'm not out to pour cold water on the excitement, but let's be realistic. AC is a fantastic employer, and as has been said the future looks bright (at the moment. This is aviation, remember). But don't expect to crack 150k at AC in any position until at least 5-6 years in at best, and only if you are based in YYZ and are willing to sacrifice lifestyle for paycheck.
Opportunities will come, but keep in mind there are 3300 pilots already on property waiting to move up the ladder ahead of you.

[altiplano]

I don't think I'm that far off...

Here goes...

4th year day/night blended rate on the EMJ is about $157 or so?

a little over $140K is the least you're going to make as a 4th year EMJ captain if you only get the 900 hour annual guarantee... you can count on that as minimum.

But assume you do an average more like 80 hours/month - that's over $150K right there.

If you really want to earn and look at max out opportunity to bring in cash, let's look at what else you have...

-50% ESOP match on 10% of your earnings would bring another $7500+
-Strong likelihoods of profit share moving forward... that's about $15000+
-might aswell count SIM and ART pay - that's another 20 hours pay for the year... so $3000+ ...
-add a bit of draft and OT premium and you're going up on that... crew sked calls daily for draft... a few of the junior EMJ captain's in YYZ maxed out on OT for the year, surely at draft rates too...

Anyway, lots of ways to make money at this company beyond straight flight pay if you're so inclined.

[The Raven]

I don't think I'm that far off...

Here goes...

4th year day/night blended rate on the EMJ is about $157 or so?

a little over $140K is the least you're going to make as a 4th year EMJ captain if you only get the 900 hour annual guarantee... you can count on that as minimum.

But assume you do an average more like 80 hours/month - that's over $150K right there.

If you really want to earn and look at max out opportunity to bring in cash, let's look at what else you have...

-50% ESOP match on 10% of your earnings would bring another $7500+
-Strong likelihoods of profit share moving forward... that's about $15000+
-might aswell count SIM and ART pay - that's another 20 hours pay for the year... so $3000+ ...
-add a bit of draft and OT premium and you're going up on that... crew sked calls daily for draft... a few of the junior EMJ captain's in YYZ maxed out on OT for the year, surely at draft rates too...

Anyway, lots of ways to make money at this company beyond straight flight pay if you're so inclined.

Add on to the above a good health and dental plan. While my wife was being treated for cancer (chemo and radiation treatments) all we had to pay for was parking at the hospital. Drugs, etc were all covered under the health plan.