Science-Based Alternative to Ease Quarantine Act Restrictions

[CPT.HarshColdReality]

masks are here to stay for decades if we don't fight back.

[complexintentions]

I am hysterical about what the politicians will do(and are doing to be honest). I believe I read about another 37 billion Justin dollars announced today. It happens so often, I don't even read the details anymore of what it is for despite exceeding, or close to exceeding last years deficit.

Umm..."close to" exceeding?

2019 deficit was about 20 billion dollars.

2020's deficit is over 350 billion dollars - so far. CERB alone is something like 8 billion/month. National debt on track for over a trillion. Highest per-capita Covid spending in the OECD. Good thing the Liberals were being so prudent when the economy was doing well before the virus hit. Oh...wait...

(Fun fact: Pierre Elliott Trudeau ran up about 160 billion dollars of debt 1968-1978. His son has run up 350 billion so far. So 2 prime ministers of the same family are responsible for over half of the entire national debt accumulated over the last 50+ years. And that's without adjusting PET's numbers for inflation. Thanks, ON and QC voters!)

Now JT has Freeland so they can REALLY open the taps without that pesky Morneau guy getting in his way. UBI here we come. Seems people prefer being paid to not work over working. Who knew?

I'm still patriotic but I'm glad I'm not a Canadian tax-payer and my net worth is in USD. The tax man cometh in a big way and so does a weaker CAD. There is no other way.

Let me know if you ever lift the quarantine so I can at least visit family without wasting 2 weeks.

[Rockie]

The ability to overspend on a national scale is essential to soften the blow of emergencies that warrant it, like worldwide pandemics and economic meltdowns in 2008. Criticizing Trudeau or anybody else for that in these times begs the question...what would you do different?

Of course the ability to do that depends on putting our house back in order between emergencies. Our failure to do that is our own fault for our unwillingness to accept a little hardship and bank surpluses to pay down debt. At the end of the day politicians only do what we want, even if we like to blame them for it afterwards.

[YYZSaabGuy]

Of course the ability to do that depends on putting our house back in order between emergencies. Our failure to do that is our own fault for our unwillingness to accept a little hardship and bank surpluses to pay down debt. At the end of the day politicians only do what we want, even if we like to blame them for it afterwards.

That pretty much sums it up. Let's just say that Canadians have never, ever shown any reluctance whatsoever to being bribed with their own money. Particularly when program spending of any type, no matter how unnecessary, is referred to as an "investment" of some type. If you're going to bribe me with my own money and saddle me with additional debt and additional taxes to pay for it, at least have the guts to call it what it is: an attempt to ensure re-election.

[Fanblade]

Another nice thing will be if we can get the cases to zero for a while, we can stop wearing these damn masks.

We will never get to zero Covid cases.

Cold viruses mutate quickly making immunity, and a vaccine for that matter, likely futile. We have enough trouble keeping up with the flu and it mutates much slower. Any vaccine produced won’t be like measles where you take it once and you are good. If will be more like the flu shot that we currently get yearly. Only a Covid Vaccine may only protect for a few month. Adding to the Vaccine challenge is that our immune system has a short memory when it comes to colds. It is why we get them year after year after year.

On the positive side, as cold viruses mutate they “normally” become more contagious but less virulent. In other words as Covid mutates we would “expect” to see more cases, but less deaths. This is why we have data directly focussed on cases vs hospitalization and death. This is what happened to H1N1, MERS, SARS etc. They all exist to this day as a cold. CDC monitors them for a bad turn in mutation. Every once in a while you will here an old strain pop up somewhere.

I used “normally” and “expect” deliberately. We expect Covid 19 to mutate like a normal cold virus would. But only scientific data will prove it one way or the other.

There are signs all over the globe currently of Covid cases increasing, while death and hospitalization rates are dropping. Is that the virus mutating as expected? Is that just more testing? Is that Doctors focusing in on those at most risk better? Don’t know, but science will figure it out.

What I do know is that focusing on cases will end. We will start focusing on death/ hospitalization rates and tracking particular strains just like the flu. Just like N1H1, MERS, SARS.

Some people are less cautious and want to push a head immediately as death/hospitalization rates drop. Others are more cautious and want to be ultra slow. Both are rational and understandable responses. We will find a balance so long as we don’t let irrational fear cloud decision making.



What isn’t rational is thinking you can drive Covid cases to zero. It’s too late. It’s here to stay.

[Fanblade]

CDC in US drops quarantine recommendation. Doesn't mean anything if law makers don't act on it. But it is a science based body moving in the direction of easing restrictions. To be fair to lawmakers the science has to come first. Let's see what they start doing now. My bet is a very very reluctant approach to easing.


https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.afar.c ... ave-to/amp

[Rockie]

The CDC has destroyed their once sterling reputation with the testing fiasco when this all started and by taking orders from the White House.
Unfortunately they are no longer trustworthy for purely scientific guidance as it is tainted by the worst kind of politics.

[RRJetPilot]

The CDC has destroyed their once sterling reputation with the testing fiasco when this all started and by taking orders from the White House.
Unfortunately their guidance can no longer be taken as purely scientific and is therefore not trustworthy.

Of course, if it doesn't fit your bias or narrative it must not be "trustworthy".

[Rockie]

The CDC has destroyed their once sterling reputation with the testing fiasco when this all started and by taking orders from the White House.
Unfortunately their guidance can no longer be taken as purely scientific and is therefore not trustworthy.

Of course, if it doesn't fit your bias or narrative it must not be "trustworthy".

They botched the test, and they've changed their guidance in the past on orders from the White House. Those are the unfortunate facts that have nothing to do with bias or narrative. Bias is ignoring those facts.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/educatio ... Fstory-ans

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/05/1 ... rus-259565

[RRJetPilot]

Both very left leaning rags. Do you have any non bias or Center sources for the information you posted?
When I google it all I find is the CDC message at odds with the government and their message consistently put down. So this gives me the impression that the CDC is not taking talking points from Trump.

[Rockie]

Both very left leaning rags. Do you have any non bias or Center sources for the information you posted?
When I google it all I find is the CDC message at odds with the government and their message consistently put down. So this gives me the impression that the CDC is not taking talking points from Trump.

Look at the dates the CDC was at odds with the WH (May) and then look at the dates they suddenly weren't (June/July). If you bothered to read the article you'd find out what changed in that time. Left leaning in your world is anything not pegged at the extreme right edge and the WP is not a rag. Their reporting is fact checked and pretty much always turns out true despite claims of "fake news" from your camp. Facts are facts...you don't get to choose them.

['97 Tercel]

Their reporting is fact checked and pretty much always turns out true

...and 28% of the time all of us here are "pretty much always" right.

[Rockie]

Wouldn't that be an interesting exercise? You cite a time they were wrong, then I’ll cite a time they were right when the White House said they were fake news. See how far you get.

[Inverted2]

The WP is owned by Jeff Bezos who is making out like a bandit thanks to the Plandemic. The more Karen’s that stay home and shop online, the richer he gets. They will keep the fear going.

[Rockie]

Yeah I’ve heard this “plandemic” stuff before. Anyone who actually believes that nonsense is out of their f**king mind stupid.

[2R]

A weatherman and two friends went into the Airport lounge and ordered Drinks , a Corona and two Hurricanes.
The Barkeeper said that will be 2020

[Fanblade]

https://youtu.be/o7A-MLVEeMA

[pelmet]

South Korea cases surging. Another one off the AC list.

Lockdowns re-imposed.

[pelmet]

And that is with hardly anybody flying. What if it opens up? I suspect Aug 18 was the last day analyzed when this article was written.

"Nearly two dozen more flights have landed at major airports in Canada with passengers infected with COVID-19
According to the federal government, more than 55 flights have landed in Canada between Aug. 1 and Aug. 18 that had passengers who tested positive for COVID-19 after arriving in the country.
The vast majority of the flights with COVID-19 passengers have landed in Toronto, but a number of them also touched down in Montreal, Vancouver and Calgary."

The international flights since Aug. 1 with COVID-19 cases include:
Air Transat flight TS831 from Punta Cana to Toronto on Aug. 1
United Airlines flight UA375 from San Francisco to Vancouver on Aug. 1
Air Transat flight TS893 from Cancun to Montreal on Aug. 1
Air France flight AF034 from Paris to Montreal on Aug. 1
Air Canada flight AC1297 from Punta Cana to Montreal on Aug. 1
Air Canada flight AC1241 from Cancun to Montreal on Aug. 1
Pakistan International Airlines flight PK797 from Lahore to Toronto on Aug. 2
Etihad Airways flight EY141 from Abu Dhabi to Toronto on Aug. 2
Air Canada flight AC992 from Mexico City to Toronto on Aug. 2
Egypt Air flight MS995 from Cairo to Toronto on Aug. 2
Ethiopian Airlines flight ETH552 from Addis Ababa to Toronto on Aug. 2
American Airlines flight AA1354 from Dallas to Calgary on Aug. 2
United Airlines flight UA3488 from Newark to Toronto on Aug. 3
Qatar Airlines flight QR763 from Doha to Montreal on Aug. 3
Air Canada flight AC7682 from Chicago to Toronto on Aug. 3
Air France flight AF348 from Paris to Montreal on Aug. 3
Air Canada flight AC849 from London to Toronto on Aug. 4
Tap Air Portugal flight TP253 from Lisbon to Montreal on Aug 4.
Delta Airlines flight DL7203 from Atlanta to Calgary on Aug 4.
American Airlines flight AA4719 from Philadelphia to Montreal on Aug. 4
Air Canada flight AC873 from Frankfurt to Toronto on Aug. 4
Air Canada flight AC879 from Switzerland to Toronto on Aug 4.
Air Canada flight AC870 from Montreal to Paris on Aug 4.
AeroMexico flight AM680 from Mexico City to Montreal on Aug 4.
Lufthansa flight LH492 from Frankfurt to Vancouver flight LH492 on Aug. 5
KLM Royal Dutch Airlines flight KL671 from Amsterdam to Montreal on Aug. 5
Air Canada flight AC8021 from New Jersey to Toronto on Aug. 5
Air Canada flight AC7682 from Chicago to Toronto on Aug. 5
Air India flight AI187 from Delhi to Toronto on Aug. 6
Air Canada flight AC873 from Frankfurt to Toronto on Aug. 6
AeroMexico flight AM68 from Mexico City to Montreal on Aug. 6
LOT Polish Airlines flight LO45 Warsaw to Toronto on Aug. 7
KLM Royal Dutch Airlines flight KL691 from Amsterdam to Toronto on Aug. 7
Ethiopian Airlines flight ET552 from Addis Ababa to Toronto on Aug. 7
Air Canada flight AC873 from Frankfurt to Toronto on Aug 7
AeroMexico flight AM696 from Mexico City to Vancouver on Aug. 7
Air India flight IA187 from Delhi to Toronto on Aug. 8
Air Canada flight AC873 from Frankfurt to Toronto on Aug. 8
Air Canada flight AC1295 from Aruba to Toronto on Aug 8.
Air India flight AI1143 from Delhi to Vancouver on Aug. 9
Lufthansa flight LH492 from Frankfurt to Vancouver on Aug. 9
Air Canada flight AC879 from Zurich to Toronto on Aug. 9
Air Canada flight AC1255 from Kingston to Toronto on Aug. 10
Air Canada flight AC905 from Athens to Montreal on Aug. 10
United Airlines flight AC4552 from Chicago to Toronto on Aug. 11
Air Canada flight AC871 from Paris to Montreal on Aug. 11
British Airways flight BA99 from London to Toronto on Aug. 13
Air Canada flight AC992 from Mexico City to Toronto on Aug. 13
Westjet flight WS3923 from Georgetown to Toronto on Aug. 14
Hifly flight HF352 from Guatemala to Montreal on Aug. 14
Air India flight AI1143 from Delhi to Vancouver on Aug. 14
Air Canada flight AC1231 from Cancun to Toronto on Aug 14
Air Canada flight AC992 from Mexico City to Toronto on Aug. 14
Air Canada flight AC7491 from New York to Toronto on Aug. 14
Royal Air Maroc flight AT2208 from Casablanca to Montreal on Aug. 15
Air Canada flight AC1291 from Punta Cana to Toronto on Aug. 15
Air Canada flight AC879 from Zurich to Toronto on Aug. 15
Turkish Airlines from TK17 from Istanbul to Toronto on Aug. 16
Royal Air Maroc flight AT2208 from Casablanca to Montreal on Aug. 16
Lufthansa flight LH470 from Frankfurt to Toronto on Aug 16
KLM Royal Dutch Airlines flight AF8464 from Amsterdam to Montreal on Aug. 16
Lufthansa flight LH470 from Frankfurt to Toronto on Aug. 17
Air Transat flight TS765 from Porto to Toronto on Aug. 17
Air France flight AF342 from Paris to Montreal on Aug. 18

Do you see any problem Gilles?

[RRJetPilot]

I dont understand your point? THE VIRUS IS HERE FOREVER.
There is no amount of shut down or quarantine that will prevent the virus from spreading and reappearing.
There is no Vaccine, nor will there be one that is highly effective.
The virus already has many strains.
Get off the internet and enjoy life with precautions if you have health issues.
I hope you take this advice because if you dont your mental health with really take a toll, if it hasn't already.
There will be more and more flying not less. Get that through your thick skull.

[CPT.HarshColdReality]

Yeh no kidding pelmet.....Gilles posts are well written arguments and backed by real facts. The man even uses his real name...No troll in my opinion....Aren't you a pilot? Aren't you supposed to be a man of science. Physics, chemistry heck even biology if you throw the FAs in there..(lol bad jk)...but seriously...Science says:

1. Same family as the flu.
2. New strain to human thus more aggressive and and deadly in some cases.
3. Hence the deaths and the rapid transmission at the beginning when the virus made the jump.
4. Flu-like diseases come back in different strains every year and vaccines have a certain efficiency depending of the strain.
5. So called "regular" flu still kills xx thousands of people with underlying conditions worldwide every year.
6.As the virus and the humans learn to coexist in some mildly aggressive form of symbiosis, the death rate will be similar to regular flu...this is already happening fast as we speak. If you study biology and chemistry in medicine you will begin to see things differently. By killing you the virus has failed to achieve its goal of reproducing and living. Once it discovers it actually destroys its host mutation will happen.
7. At the same time the collective human species starts developing some form of immunity via what we call herd immunity.
8. Covid is here to stay forever in different forms and different vaccine immunity levels. It's a living organism.....
9. The hysteria is also created by REAL-TIME tracking and I can't stress this more. Imagine if we tracked other diseases and causes of death in REAL-TIME and blasted them thru all media channels possible. Can you imagine the panic.
10. Take a deep breath. Stay clean. Follow the science like you do when you believe in Bernoulli's principle when you hit Vr. Let's pressure #@*^#&$^#&$ JT to wake the F up and start acting to open our airspace and boost our economy to new heights instead of strolling from ethics scandal to another....I take a deep breath now!!

[AuxBatOn]

1. Same family as the flu.

Hmmm, no. Flu is cause by the influenza virus family. COVID-19 is caused by the coronavirus family. Two different things....

[CPT.HarshColdReality]

1. Same family as the flu.

Hmmm, no. Flu is cause by the influenza virus family. COVID-19 is caused by the coronavirus family. Two different things....

perhaps family isn't the right word to describe what I mean.

[2R]

Schools that opened in Florida two weeks ago have over 9,000 positive Covid tests . Gonna be a lot of orphans when they take that home .

Good news no school shootings , yet.

[AuxBatOn]

1. Same family as the flu.

Hmmm, no. Flu is cause by the influenza virus family. COVID-19 is caused by the coronavirus family. Two different things....

perhaps family isn't the right word to describe what I mean.

The only common thing is that it is a virus. Like the flu and ebola are viruses. I thought your “list” was based on science?