Overdue Cargo Airplane Bound for CYXS

[boeingboy]

The wing overheat has 2 ways of operating. If the light is on steady - it was an ACM failure, bleed duct rupture, or short/overheat in the leading edge wiring bundle. If it was flashing - it was a wheel well overheat, caused by a ruptured bleed line or brake fire.

Power back - gear down and land asap.

[PointyEngine]

Don't hold your breath. If a couple of my buddies had just died I wouldn't be in a rush to explain everything to you or to avcanada.

+1

[77W]

The wing overheat has 2 ways of operating. If the light is on steady - it was an ACM failure, bleed duct rupture, or short/overheat in the leading edge wiring bundle. If it was flashing - it was a wheel well overheat, caused by a ruptured bleed line or brake fire.

Power back - gear down and land asap.

Close but no. Steady wing overheat light covers the wheel well and engine nacelle. Flashing is the leading edge. Doesn't really matter because the drill is the same. Reason being is a steady signal could be flickering on off as things are electrically getting out of control.

[boeingboy]

Close but no. Steady wing overheat light covers the wheel well and engine nacelle. Flashing is the leading edge. Doesn't really matter because the drill is the same. Reason being is a steady signal could be flickering on off as things are electrically getting out of control.

Also close - It is wheel well only - the engines have there own "engine fire" light. Flashing is leading edge/acm.

Thanks for the clarification on flash/no flash. I could never keep those two right.

[77W]

Close but no. Steady wing overheat light covers the wheel well and engine nacelle. Flashing is the leading edge. Doesn't really matter because the drill is the same. Reason being is a steady signal could be flickering on off as things are electrically getting out of control.

Also close - It is wheel well only - the engines have there own "engine fire" light. Flashing is leading edge/acm.

Thanks for the clarification on flash/no flash. I could never keep those two right.

My apologies, I should have clarified. I realize there are temp sensors for the ENGINE FIRE lights in the nacelle. I just was thinking back to my grond school days where the diagram points to the 450F sensor in the AC duct near the engine nacelle. This is all beside the point though. I believe most operators adopted the same procedure for flashing/steady overheat lights because of the accident in Montreal a while back. The light was flickering, and thought it was a leading edge problem, when really a fire was raging in the gear well and burning through the circuit. If the drill had been the same, they would have put the gear down and maybe bought more time?

https://www.tc.gc.ca/eng/civilaviation/ ... _e-651.htm

[co-joe]

That's one of the more counter intuitive emergency procedures I've ever heard. So if the gear is on fire, put it down, which feeds it more air, but then at least it burns away from the wing spar buying more time?

I suppose if the gear is already down, then you can shut down electrics if visual to eliminate additional sources of combustion?

[Ki-ll]

That's one of the more counter intuitive emergency procedures I've ever heard. So if the gear is on fire, put it down, which feeds it more air, but then at least it burns away from the wing spar buying more time?

I suppose if the gear is already down, then you can shut down electrics if visual to eliminate additional sources of combustion?

I would imagine that 140 knots of air should create lean enough conditions for the fire to not burn.

[gimmepars]

A photo of the recovered wreckage at the TSB lab

[gimmepars]

The leading edge of that half of the stabilator is bent 90 degrees at the root end. Also the trim tab does not seem to be attached at the trailing edge.

[arctic_slim]

Brutal.

[cncpc]

Metros have a Trimmable Horizontal Stabilizer similar to that of the Alaska Airlines MD-83 that crashed off the coast of San Francisco in 2000.
About a year or two after that accident, a Carson AME was using a push broom to brush a light dusting of snow off of a Metro that spent the night in YLW. After he climbed up the ladder and started on the tail, he gave about 2 sweeps with the broom and the entire stab came detached from the actuator and just flopped around freely on the tail. You can only imagine what would have happened if this would have come apart in flight.

Just a speculation. I'm sure Carson's maintenance program is all above board but these are old cargo airplanes that have been ridden hard and sometimes things fail.

With that in mind, what do you think about what can be seen on the fin and in the up down travel slot at the front of the stabilizer. It looks like a lot was going on there. Also seems like the boot is missing on the fin, just epoxy there.

[77W]

Vertical stab has no pneumatic boot, just the horizontal. Its usually a black or light brown epoxy looking rubber cover.

Brutal.

Brutal.

That's one of the more counter intuitive emergency procedures I've ever heard. So if the gear is on fire, put it down, which feeds it more air, but then at least it burns away from the wing spar buying more time?

I suppose if the gear is already down, then you can shut down electrics if visual to eliminate additional sources of combustion?

The idea is that you are taking the fire out of the wheel well and into the airflow where it can do less damage. There are hydraulic and electrical lines as well as some fuel seepage in the gear well. If you've taken off with the brake on, and it's not on fire, the airflow could cool the brakes, and resolve your situation. Tires that are on fire tend to explode too.

[Diadem]

On the bottom left corner of the photo is what looks to me like the inboard section of a wing, with the flap still attached, and it appears to be completely torched...Am I seeing that right?

[Ki-ll]

One of the propellers appears to be bent in coarse pitch position on all the blades, while the other one seems bent in fine pitch. Maybe it is just me...

[Diadem]

It also looks like the piece of wreckage between the fuselage and the landing gear is blackened, but I can't tell what that is or whether it normally looks like that.

[cncpc]

One of the propellers appears to be bent in coarse pitch position on all the blades, while the other one seems bent in fine pitch. Maybe it is just me...

On the left prop remains, the blades seem to be in feather. The farthest left has a split along the length from the tip. I've never seen that before. On that same hub, there seems to be a blade which fractured along the chord line about a foot from the hub, clean break. Can't tell much about the prop on the right, other than there is one blade there. I'm not sure if those thin band like strips are blades or what.

The chunk of fuselage beside the main chunk is the over wing part and the piece of to where the cockpit was torn off. You can see one emergency exit which is on the close side and bent inwards. There is metal bent outwards at the front bottom.

One main gear leg isn't visible in what they show. I think the right nacelle with the burn marks is just to the left of the left prop.

It appears that the left wing was severed just inside the nacelle. I'm thinking that must be some part of the right wing in the bottom right just behind the left wing bit.

[boeingboy]

The leading edge of that half of the stabilizer is bent 90 degrees at the root end. Also the trim tab does not seem to be attached at the trailing edge.

That's the LH horizontal stab. There are no trim tabs - that is an access panel that is basically a strip that runs the length of he stab on the bottom. It allows access to the bolts for elevator removal. The elevator is missing and it appears the trim actuator for the stab is still attached.

On the left prop remains, the blades seem to be in feather.

They are in feather - if oil px is lost the blades will go to feather.

On the bottom left corner of the photo is what looks to me like the inboard section of a wing, with the flap still attached, and it appears to be completely torched...Am I seeing that right?

It appears to be an outboard section of wing with the aileron attached - It's the outboard RH wing - I can see the SAS probe hanging from the end of the wing. The RH flap is just fwd of the LH wing. There are parts that do show what looks like fire damage, however - we are dealing with an inflight breakup. If the wing broke apart or the engine separated, there is a real possibility that fire was secondary to the breakup and not the cause. Of note - the rudder is missing and the Cargo door is still attached to the fuse.

One thing that stands out to me is the left wing and nacelle are relatively intact, I don't see the right wing and only a bunch of pieces. I also don't see the other gear. They may be out of frame though. I can also see just one engine - but it appears it has been split in two and the whole hot section is missing.

[Unit 969]

It appears to be an outboard section of wing with the aileron attached - It's the outboard RH wing - I can see the SAS probe hanging from the end of the wing. The RH flap is just fwd of the LH wing. There are parts that do show what looks like fire damage, however - we are dealing with an inflight breakup. If the wing broke apart or the engine separated, there is a real possibility that fire was secondary to the breakup and not the cause. Of note - the rudder is missing and the Cargo door is still attached to the fuse.


Metro 3 has dual Conrac SAS vanes attached to the front of the cockpit area. The cargo door is on the left side of the fuselage and doesn't seem visible in this photo.

My mistake. It was a SA226

[boeingboy]

etro 3 has dual Conrac SAS vanes attached to the front of the cockpit area. The cargo door is on the left side of the fuselage and doesn't seem visible in this photo.

Yes on all counts.....except

This 226 still had the old rosemont SAS (some 226's were modified to single Conrac on the nose) and the cargo door is on the left - but the hinge line is almost at the 12:oo position and if you look at the pic carefully, you can see the cargo door with it's hinge still attached. It's right at the base of the dorsal fin.

[Unit 969]

I don't see it. The cargo door hinge is hidden by the vertical stab fairing. Can you please highlight what you are seeing?
I too don't feel it was a cargo door failure, but I don't see what you see.

[ogc]

I don't see it. The cargo door hinge is hidden by the vertical stab fairing. Can you please highlight what you are seeing?
I too don't feel it was a cargo door failure, but I don't see what you see.

Its just ahead of that. You can see the top part of the door.

[boeingboy]

I don't see it. The cargo door hinge is hidden by the vertical stab fairing. Can you please highlight what you are seeing?
I too don't feel it was a cargo door failure, but I don't see what you see.

Cargo door circled in red. It is clearly still attached to the fuse.

[boeingboy]

in better days.....

[PointyEngine]

Any sign of the main door, or have to assume it's still attached and not visible in the photo?

[cncpc]

in better days.....

May well be coincidence, but the cockpit is severed right in the plane of the prop.

The top prop is the right hand in the wreckage photo.

Anybody venture an opinion as to what that is lying in front of the left flap at the left side. That flat piece just below the rudder torque tube.