Air Canada Revises the Terms of its Capacity Purchase Agreement with Chorus Aviation for Regional Flying

[throwaway123]

LOL...

Keep dreaming guys.

Yep, funny thing is some think there will be gains out of this, they will be sorely disappointed!

I don’t know how the Jazz MEC could possibly manage to not extract gains from this. You guys have them by the stones. I don’t care what Claude says AC wants to consolidate, it’s a done deal and you guys hold the keys to getting it that last mile.
Good luck.

If Randy, Paul and Kim are still on the negotiating committee I'm sure they will get some gains.

[altiplano]

To be clear, there are gains to be had. But spending time or capital on the above list is a set up for failure.

[GATRKGA]

LOL...

Keep dreaming guys.

Yep, funny thing is some think there will be gains out of this, they will be sorely disappointed!

I don’t know how the Jazz MEC could possibly manage to not extract gains from this. You guys have them by the stones. I don’t care what Claude says AC wants to consolidate, it’s a done deal and you guys hold the keys to getting it that last mile.
Good luck.

Precisely - this is the exact moment Claude has been waiting for. Now he's got AC by the ying-yang's. Time to correct the 11 year history, and set the express journey forward. If AC is so adamant about having their E175's up and running May 1, leverage is in the hands of ALPA now.

To be clear, there are gains to be had. But spending time or capital on the above list is a set up for failure.

Why?

[Hangry]

Yep, funny thing is some think there will be gains out of this, they will be sorely disappointed!

I don’t know how the Jazz MEC could possibly manage to not extract gains from this. You guys have them by the stones. I don’t care what Claude says AC wants to consolidate, it’s a done deal and you guys hold the keys to getting it that last mile.
Good luck.

Precisely - this is the exact moment Claude has been waiting for. Now he's got AC by the ying-yang's. Time to correct the 11 year history, and set the express journey forward. If AC is so adamant about having their E175's up and running May 1, leverage is in the hands of ALPA now.

To be clear, there are gains to be had. But spending time or capital on the above list is a set up for failure.

Why?

yes. Jazz has AC by the "ying yangs". That has never and will never be true.

Perhaps it's time to start living in reality.

[GATRKGA]

I don’t know how the Jazz MEC could possibly manage to not extract gains from this. You guys have them by the stones. I don’t care what Claude says AC wants to consolidate, it’s a done deal and you guys hold the keys to getting it that last mile.
Good luck.

Precisely - this is the exact moment Claude has been waiting for. Now he's got AC by the ying-yang's. Time to correct the 11 year history, and set the express journey forward. If AC is so adamant about having their E175's up and running May 1, leverage is in the hands of ALPA now.

To be clear, there are gains to be had. But spending time or capital on the above list is a set up for failure.

Why?

yes. Jazz has AC by the "ying yangs". That has never and will never be true.

Perhaps it's time to start living in reality.

Who is it that wants the consolidation so desperately right now? It sure isn’t Jazz or Sky. It’s AC. This gives the opposite side leverage to negotiate something for that desperation.

CHR is under the direction of AC. But the pilot group doesn’t need to play into that. The way that press release reads it identifies that It’s subject to ALPA’s agreement if this is to go through.

The reinstatement of those sky pilots who were supposed to be laid off/down graded is also another one to watch.

Reality, is that pilots like Hangry give into cargo contracts for 10% below mainline pay, then the company turns a profit off their backs. #reality.

[Loon-A-Tic]

Quote: Reality, is that pilots like Hangry give into cargo contracts for 10% below mainline pay, then the company turns a profit off their backs. #reality.

So if I understand your suggestion a company shouldn't "turn a profit", how long will that entity last in the industry.

[a220hereicome]

LOL...

Keep dreaming guys.

Says the guy who thinks ACPA can win a challenge at the supreme court against the federal government and reverse the 2012 FOS.

If you're going to dream, you might as well dream big!

[mbav8r]

Those who think gains are possible are overlooking one thing, AC has terminated the CPA with Sky but this does not mean it has to be Jazz.
I know of one operator in Canada who was operating the 190 and 175 as common type until very recently, who still has a simulator, if you’re still not getting it, AC could easily bring them back in house and is very likely plan b

[Loon-A-Tic]

Those who think gains are possible are overlooking one thing, AC has terminated the CPA with Sky but this does not mean it has to be Jazz.
I know of one operator in Canada who was operating the 190 and 175 as common type until very recently, who still has a simulator, if you’re still not getting it, AC could easily bring them back in house and is very likely plan b

Sweet, 100% flow to mainline for SKV

[mbav8r]

Those who think gains are possible are overlooking one thing, AC has terminated the CPA with Sky but this does not mean it has to be Jazz.
I know of one operator in Canada who was operating the 190 and 175 as common type until very recently, who still has a simulator, if you’re still not getting it, AC could easily bring them back in house and is very likely plan b

Sweet, 100% flow to mainline for SKV

Sure, to the bottom of the AC/Transat list

[Loon-A-Tic]

Those who think gains are possible are overlooking one thing, AC has terminated the CPA with Sky but this does not mean it has to be Jazz.
I know of one operator in Canada who was operating the 190 and 175 as common type until very recently, who still has a simulator, if you’re still not getting it, AC could easily bring them back in house and is very likely plan b

Sweet, 100% flow to mainline for SKV

Sure, to the bottom of the AC/Transat list

Transat isn't a "done deal" yet the SKV pilots still have a chance to jump the queue.

[mbav8r]

Sweet, 100% flow to mainline for SKV

Sure, to the bottom of the AC/Transat list

Transat isn't a "done deal" yet the SKV pilots still have a chance to jump the queue.

Well, wouldn’t that be something!
As a Jazz pilot who was directly affected by SR in it’s early days, I’m torn about the integration into our list. I’m in favour of solidarity, especially since they did join ALPA but we have essentially half of our group on furlough as do they.
So, I support(begrudgingly) a 3 to 1 Jazz pilot to SR pilot recall with DOH for all other aspects of the contract but I’m under no illusions that there are gains to be made, the gain is all express flying under one roof

[timeflies]

to my fellow jazz pilots:

continue making the Sky Regional saga a personal thing and you will be up to some surprises that will affect US more than their integration in our seniority list.

You don't want solidarity? fine. we won't get the airplane without their pilots so the e175 will go elsewhere and most likely to the mainline because you best believe Air Canada will never replace the Embraer routes with an Rj200. this is no ''leverage comments and threats'' regardless of what some guy may say.

think smart.

[throwaway123]

There's 600 furloughed Mainline pilots who would be happy to fly them.

[altiplano]

LOL...

Keep dreaming guys.

Says the guy who thinks ACPA can win a challenge at the supreme court against the federal government and reverse the 2012 FOS.

If you're going to dream, you might as well dream big!

The precedent was there. All the other labour groups on the same track won their challenges.

A competent staff would have won.

But ACPA has a lazy and incompetent LRD staff. They would rather just file some expenses, go out for some lunches, and wrap it up for an easy settlement without actually having to do anything.

And that's exactly what they did.

So you're right, ACPA and the people there then and today wouldn't succeed because they are inept cowards. An association of average proficiency, even somewhat sub-average competency would win though.

It should have been a slam dunk, but when your happier riding the bench and won't get into the game you aren't going to make any baskets.

Lazy incompetent cowards.

Competent representation... dreaming big...

[GATRKGA]

Sky pilots going to AC BOTL, that would upset a lot of Jazz pilot's more than integration I bet. Heck why not? Sky pilot's are basically Air Canada, at half the wages. Unlike jazz, they already deal with AC flight plans, dispatch, socc, gate agents, etc. I'm sure a differences course/initial course and they'd be set to call Air Canada over the radio over Maple. It's an identical flight ops structure.

Altiplano - LOL.

[Inverted2]

Sky pilots going to AC BOTL, that would upset a lot of Jazz pilot's more than integration I bet. Heck why not? Sky pilot's are basically Air Canada, at half the wages. Unlike jazz, they already deal with AC flight plans, dispatch, socc, gate agents, etc. I'm sure a differences course/initial course and they'd be set to call Air Canada over the radio over Maple. It's an identical flight ops structure.

Altiplano - LOL.

I’ve been at Jazz for 15 years. Glad I don’t have to deal with any gate agents!

[BTD]

to my fellow jazz pilots:

continue making the Sky Regional saga a personal thing and you will be up to some surprises that will affect US more than their integration in our seniority list.

You don't want solidarity? fine. we won't get the airplane without their pilots so the e175 will go elsewhere and most likely to the mainline because you best believe Air Canada will never replace the Embraer routes with an Rj200. this is no ''leverage comments and threats'' regardless of what some guy may say.

think smart.

Wait... you would rather have the e175s at Jazz than mainline? Even if you are at Jazz that is short sighted. We lost those 175s at mainline and they went to an operator paying a fraction the wages. How many more guys/gals (pandemic aside) would have been at mainline making mainline wages vs a CPA carrier. The flying noticeably changed on the Embraer and stagnated when the 175s went to sky.

[Kosiw]

Hopefully, fear of the unknown doesn't influence any vote, but it probably will.

[Loon-A-Tic]

Hopefully, fear of the unknown doesn't influence any vote, but it probably will.

It would appear by many have already done exactly that or have come the a decision without all the facts, they are still an unknown are they not.

[Kosiw]

Everyone's nightmare "Operated by PIVOT" on the side of the 175s

[a220hereicome]

A competent staff would have won.

It should have been a slam dunk

So...taking the feds to court, and reversing a decision that would reopen a closed DB pension plan.

Slam dunk?

I’ve got some beachfront property for you.

[altiplano]

A competent staff would have won.

It should have been a slam dunk

So...taking the feds to court, and reversing a decision that would reopen a closed DB pension plan.

Slam dunk?

I’ve got some beachfront property for you.

It's clear. Collective bargaining rights were violated, the law would be struck down and the arbitrator's decision set aside. The fact that it would reopen a DB plan is inconsequential, particularly now as it's a plan that's brutally overfunded and actually cheaper for the corporation than the DC plan.

Look at the other successful decisions. Collective bargaining rights are protected in this country and you can't erase them to save spring break. On top of that the law unfairly biased the corporation and the FOS process specified is without comparator ever in regards to back to work legislation in this country.

Besides, it was the corporation doing the locking out, and if indeed Air Canada Pilots provide an essential service then the government should legislate it and put interest arbitration in place similar to other essential service providers in this country.

[rudder]

A competent staff would have won.

It should have been a slam dunk

So...taking the feds to court, and reversing a decision that would reopen a closed DB pension plan.

Slam dunk?

I’ve got some beachfront property for you.

It's clear. Collective bargaining rights were violated, the law would be struck down and the arbitrator's decision set aside. The fact that it would reopen a DB plan is inconsequential, particularly now as it's a plan that's brutally overfunded and actually cheaper for the corporation than the DC plan.

Look at the other successful decisions. Collective bargaining rights are protected in this country and you can't erase them to save spring break. On top of that the law unfairly biased the corporation and the FOS process specified is without comparator ever in regards to back to work legislation in this country.

Besides, it was the corporation doing the locking out, and if indeed Air Canada Pilots provide an essential service then the government should legislate it and put interest arbitration in place similar to other essential service providers in this country.

This debate really belongs under the Air Canada topic.......

[Outlaw58]

So...taking the feds to court, and reversing a decision that would reopen a closed DB pension plan.

Slam dunk?

I’ve got some beachfront property for you.

It's clear. Collective bargaining rights were violated, the law would be struck down and the arbitrator's decision set aside. The fact that it would reopen a DB plan is inconsequential, particularly now as it's a plan that's brutally overfunded and actually cheaper for the corporation than the DC plan.

Look at the other successful decisions. Collective bargaining rights are protected in this country and you can't erase them to save spring break. On top of that the law unfairly biased the corporation and the FOS process specified is without comparator ever in regards to back to work legislation in this country.

Besides, it was the corporation doing the locking out, and if indeed Air Canada Pilots provide an essential service then the government should legislate it and put interest arbitration in place similar to other essential service providers in this country.

This debate really belongs under the Air Canada topic.......

Word

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