Air Canada Pool

[gonefishin']

nada.
LCC is lower... subject to annual raises as per AC
Y1 $46.94
Y2 $51.82
Y3 $59.64
Y4 $67.45

[bcflyer]

nada.
LCC is lower... subject to annual raises as per AC
Y1 $46.94
Y2 $51.82
Y3 $59.64
Y4 $67.45

That is incorrect. The rates are the same for the first four years both at Mainline AND LCC. There is no difference in pay for the first four years.

[pelmet]

For what it's worth...

-15 EMJ = approximatelty 150 mainline jobs

+2 LCC 319 = approximately 20 pilots
+2 LCC 767 = approximately 40 pilots (no RP's)
+2 777 = approximately 90 pilots

90 pilots for two 777's...that many?

[ram]

90 pilots for two 777's...that many?

Sorry, just re-did my math (should have said 60)...it ranges between 27-30 per a/c. Overseas aircraft, senior pilots with max vacation, relief pilots, etc...We currently have 490 pilots on the 777 for 18 aircraft; an average of about 27.2 pilots per aircraft...

[ZBBYLW]

nada.
LCC is lower... subject to annual raises as per AC
Y1 $46.94
Y2 $51.82
Y3 $59.64
Y4 $67.45

That is incorrect. The rates are the same for the first four years both at Mainline AND LCC. There is no difference in pay for the first four years.

Not sure if you work at AC or not, but if you have access to the contract give it a read. If you start off at the LCC those rates seem to be similar to what I read they were when I read through the contract. As far as I know (without reconfirming with the contract) those rates are in fact correct. Now if you getting hired to mainline and get "forced reduced" into the LCC that changes things.

[CatInTheHat]

I received an email about the Nov 12 groundschool that they might be calling this week.

Hey Twotter,

Do you mean you were invited to the groundschool? Or they sent you an email telling you that you "might" get a call?

Any news since?

[gonefishin']

hey BC... read LOU 74.20

pretty black and white

L74.20 Pay Rates
CA B767 CA A319 FO B767 FO A319
1 $118.47 $129.98 $46.94 $46.94
2 $125.70 $134.42 $51.82 $51.82
3 $133.02 $138.80 $59.64 $59.64
4 $140.40 $143.05 $67.45 $67.45
5 $147.70 $147.42 $94.60 $90.50
6 $154.98 $151.94 $100.70 $94.65
7 $162.35 $158.06 $105.50 $98.00
8 $169.58 $164.12 $111.95 $99.05
9 $176.91 $170.32 $116.80 $99.05
10 $182.30 $176.35 $116.80 $99.05
11 $182.30 $177.40 $116.80 $99.05
12 $182.30 $178.52 $116.80 $99.05

L74.20.01 Annual Wage Increases
L74.20.01.01

The rates in L74.20 will be increased according to the following:
Effective Date Increase
August 1, 2013 3%
August 1, 2014 2%
August 1, 2015 2%

[gasbag]

Back to the topic, with the arrival of the 787's there will be a requirement for additional bodies to cover all the other positions below that type. They will have to be in place and ready to go, prior to the first delivery. The moving of 767's to LCC will take a similar uptake to be in place, prior to their arrival.

As any one knows here we are not carrying any surplus pilots, but there will be a pool of pilots created with the EMB 175's leaving the fleet. However that group alone will not be adequate for the requirement next year. IMHO

[bcflyer]

hey BC... read LOU 74.20

pretty black and white

L74.20 Pay Rates
CA B767 CA A319 FO B767 FO A319
1 $118.47 $129.98 $46.94 $46.94
2 $125.70 $134.42 $51.82 $51.82
3 $133.02 $138.80 $59.64 $59.64
4 $140.40 $143.05 $67.45 $67.45
5 $147.70 $147.42 $94.60 $90.50
6 $154.98 $151.94 $100.70 $94.65
7 $162.35 $158.06 $105.50 $98.00
8 $169.58 $164.12 $111.95 $99.05
9 $176.91 $170.32 $116.80 $99.05
10 $182.30 $176.35 $116.80 $99.05
11 $182.30 $177.40 $116.80 $99.05
12 $182.30 $178.52 $116.80 $99.05

L74.20.01 Annual Wage Increases
L74.20.01.01

The rates in L74.20 will be increased according to the following:
Effective Date Increase
August 1, 2013 3%
August 1, 2014 2%
August 1, 2015 2%

Hey Gonefishin. Have a read of 12.03.01. Pretty black and white. The published rates for a mainline F/O in their first 4 years are exactly the same as what you just posted for LCC. Not sure why you feel that an F/O in their first 4 years will make make less at LCC....

[bcflyer]

nada.
LCC is lower... subject to annual raises as per AC
Y1 $46.94
Y2 $51.82
Y3 $59.64
Y4 $67.45

That is incorrect. The rates are the same for the first four years both at Mainline AND LCC. There is no difference in pay for the first four years.

Not sure if you work at AC or not, but if you have access to the contract give it a read. If you start off at the LCC those rates seem to be similar to what I read they were when I read through the contract. As far as I know (without reconfirming with the contract) those rates are in fact correct. Now if you getting hired to mainline and get "forced reduced" into the LCC that changes things.

I do work at AC and I have read the contract. The flat rate for F/O's in their first 4 years is the same at mainline as it is at LCC.. Section 12.03.01 for mainline and LOU 74 as posted above for LCC. The rates for an F/O in their first 4yrs are identical.

[TheStig]

You're all (kind of) right. As per Section 12.03.01 the 4 four year fixed rate was:
Y1 $46.94
Y2 $51.82
Y3 $59.64
Y4 $67.45

Now multiple those figures by the 2% raise for 2011 and the 5% raise for 2012 and you get:
Y1 50.27
Y2 55.50
Y3 63.87
Y4 72.24

Therefore, the rate is the same for the first 4 years at the LCC and Mainline.

Hope that helps.

[ZBBYLW]

The 2% raise for the LCC does not come into effect until 2013.

[DBC]

The 2% raise for the LCC does not come into effect until 2013.

I can confirm this, Page 38 or the Final Appendix Page of the Company Webcast, or LOU 74 I believe.

[TheStig]

The 2% raise for the LCC does not come into effect until 2013.

I can confirm this, Page 38 or the Final Appendix Page of the Company Webcast, or LOU 74 I believe.

I see that in the webcast, but not in the contract. Under Recognition in LOU 74, Sections 12.05.01 is not an excluded article.

[DBC]

L74.20.01.01 is the applicable reference, I don't think section 12 applies as LCC rates are not included there.

[altiplano]

Crewsware pay tables show a lower rate at LCC.

[TheStig]

DBC, thanks for the reference. Once again I stand corrected.

[777LR]

For all of you in the pool...
Latest bid shows 59 vacancies all yyz.
My guess another gs in Jan and Feb.
Cheers guys

[snag]

For all of you in the pool...
Latest bid shows 59 vacancies all yyz.
My guess another gs in Jan and Feb.
Cheers guys

...of which 56 are at the LCC.

3 New Mainline Jobs! Sweet! How's that compare to the previous bid?

[Beefitarian]

Gah, this title is misleading.
~wraps towel around waist making a skirt like cover for the speedo~
~walks away~


~kicks a rock~

[ZBBYLW]

For all of you in the pool...
Latest bid shows 59 vacancies all yyz.
My guess another gs in Jan and Feb.
Cheers guys

...of which 56 are at the LCC.

3 New Mainline Jobs! Sweet! How's that compare to the previous bid?

Perhaps it's putting lipstick on a pig but consider those Captain positions. There aren't too many positions and I'd imagine most if not all would be A320, EMJ or perhaps really Junior 767 FOs who have a good income at home from their spouse and bid into it. With the socialized bidding I'd say most of the Junior pilots that go there (I'd bet it's only the junior pilots that go there at least at first) would gain a better lifestyle. With that I'd wager for the next few courses (before the LCC really starts to ramp up) there will be openings for EMJ and A320 FOs at mainline.

Its mostly the reduction in 767 flying that is going to be a problem. I find it difficult to believe the company is saving money by having to retrain at least 32 767 FOs (unless they go directly to the 767 LCC).

[props ahead]

Is it possible that people in the NOV 12 course would be bidding straight into the LCC.....Could a new hire potentially hold a 767 FO position??

[snag]

Is it possible that people in the NOV 12 course would be bidding straight into the LCC.....Could a new hire potentially hold a 767 FO position??

You could possibly bid on, and get a 777 Captain position also. Not likely, but possible. Remember that you are behind a whole whack of EMJ FO's that are being reduced. These guys wouldn't mind a nice raise (year 5+) to fly a widebody, or have a much better schedule on the 320 than they would at mainline. We'll just have to wait and see where the gaps are after the current bid results are out, around the 10th.

[TheStig]

Is it possible that people in the NOV 12 course would be bidding straight into the LCC.....Could a new hire potentially hold a 767 FO position??

The LCC FO positions will not be filled by pilots on the Nov 12th course. The vacant positions will be filled closer to the LCC launch next summer. To answer the second part of your question, yes, there will be new hires going to the LCC A319 and B767 FO positions moving forward as they will be entry level positions for Air Canada pilots.

[Baphomet]

Might there be a January gs? In your best guestimate, what equipment and base will be available for new hires in early 2013?