Checklists.

[zulutime]

You need a checklist to fly a C172?? My car is more complex than a 172....

I do not know any single seat pilot that physically use a checklist before, during and after a flight. I can't talk for other communities.


While a C172 checklist is significantly less complex than a 777 it should still be referenced as a "CHECK". Suggesting you don't know a single seat pilot who uses a Checklist would concern me if they worked for my company. The last I checked, no human is PERFECT, and therefore subject to making the odd mistake or missing the odd item on a checklist. Being too proud to go through the Checklist to ensure you haven't missed anything is a dangerous road to travel down. YOU TUBE is filled with single pilot (professionals) who always check the checklist before proceeding to the next phase of flight. Guido Warnick is a perfect example.

Know your Checklist/Flow inside and out.....Great! But don't ignore the Checklist as a result........

[Big Pistons Forever]

Part of the problem with this discussion is many different concepts are being discussed.

I hope that we all in agreement that unlike your car, some form of formal process is required to ensure, or "Check" that the aircraft is properly set up for the phase of flight it is and that systems required for safe flight are verified operational. In aviation those "checks" are are listed in some form of a "checklist" and the checklist is fundamentally a safety of flight tool.

That "checklist "process starts out in written form and even the purely mnemonic "checklists"were codified in various training publications.

The real issue is a human factors one. What is the most effective way to maximize the probability that nothing important to flight safety was missed by the pilot ?

Like most things in aviation there is no one fits all solution and what is appropriate for a large aircraft many be totally inappropriate for a small one or what is totally appropriate for a PPL student with 25 hours makes little sense for a 10,000hr pilot. However there are some universal principals which I think apply to all "checklist"

1) Checklist are for ensuring safety of flight, they are not a "how to fly" guide. The how to fly piece should be covered by Standard Operating Procedures

2) All checklist should have a "flow". That is the checklist should address each item in a logical progression. For example in my C 172 normal and emergency checklists I have arranged each check so that it starts at the bottom of the instrument panel centre console and continues in a counter clockwise circle ending at the throttle.

3) There are 2 types of written checklists.
a) "Do lists" : That is where a check is read, the action completed and then you move to the next item read and complete etc etc until all the items are comlete
b) "Checklists" That is where all the items of the check are completed by means of a flow/memory and then when practicable the checklist is reviewed to make sure no items were missed

4) My checklist SOP reflects my personal philosophy for flight training in light aircraft and/or for PPL pilots. Checks performed when the airplane is on the ground stopped, or in cruise flight are done as do lists and the remainder are done as check lists.

Finally the original poster asked specifically about a "runup" checklist for a C 172. So here is what my C 172 checklist has followed by the SOP's that apply to it

RUNUP

1)Fuel.................................... Both Qty checked
2)Carb Heat............................Cold
3)Mixture Rich.........................Full Rich
4)RPM....................................1700 RPM
5)Eng Temps & Pressures........ Checked
6)Suction............................... Green
7)Alternator............................Checked
8 )Magneto's............................Checked
9)Carb Heat/Ice.......................Checked
10)Mixture..............................Checked
11)Idle RPM.............................500-700
12)Carb heat ..........................Cold
13)Throttle ............................ 1000 RPM

SOP's

1) The fuel selector and the fuel gauges are linked. The fuel quantity should always be verified when checking the fuel selector position and fuel quantity should always be checked before moving the fuel selector.

5) Oil pressure and oil temperature should be correlated. That is a cold oil temperature should result in a high oil pressure and vice versa. On very cold days excessively high oil pressure may occur. If the oil pressure is near the upper redline return to idle and allow the engine to warm up before proceeding with the runup

7) To check that the alternator is functioning correctly and can carry normal electrical loads, observe the ammeter needle, it should be at the middle zero position. Watch the ammeter while you turn on the landing light and activate the flaps. The needle should dip to the discharge side (left or minus side) very briefly and then return to the centre positions. If it remains in the discharge zone then the charging system is unservicable and the flight should be cancelled. (Note if the aircraft has LED landing lights use the pitot heat instead of the landing lights to provide a load to the system)

8 ) Check the Mags one at a time returning to both between each selection. Each mag should not show an RPM drop of more than 125 RPM or have a difference of more than 50 RPM between mags. The engine should run smoothly on each magneto. If you inadvertently select off DO NOT turn the mags back on as a damaging back fire will likely occur. Instead wait for the engine to stop and restart it.

9) Apply carb heat and observe the RPM drop 100 to 225 RPM indicating that hot air is being supplied to the engine. Wait at least 15 secs and if the RPM rises then this indicated the presence of carb ice. Allow the ice to clear as indicated by a stable RPM and smooth engine running and then reset the RPM to 1700.

10) Verify mixture function by slowly leaning the mixture. A small 25-50 RPM rise should be seen first as the overly rich mixture created by the carb heat is corrected followed by a drop in RPM as the engine goes too lean. Do not let the drop exceed 100 RPM and never lean so far that the engine dies. Return the mixture to full rich

11) Verify the engine runs smoothly within the idle RPM range.

13) When stopped the engine RPM should be set at 1000 RPM to minimize spark plug fouling.

[Illya Kuryakin]

Sorry folks, but why do you people insist that flying a 172 has to be as complicated as a heart transplant? Seriously? The checklist should fit on a credit card sized card.
Check toilet seat down.
Undo pants.
Pull pants down beyond reach of leading edge of toilet seat.
Push...take cleansing breaths....push....repeat as required.
Complete required paperwork.
Check paperwork for mistakes.
Return to standing position.
Return pants to proper position.
Tuck in shirt.
Observe results of endouver.
Push flush handle into the gear down position.
Don't look back......
Illya

[Big Pistons Forever]

ILya

The original poster, whom I am guessing is a relatively low time pilot asked about a runup checklist for his C 172

I provided an answer. I am guess from the ridicule in your response you don't agree. OK so how about you
provide an answer to his specific query ?

[photofly]

UNUP

1)Fuel.................................... Both Qty checked
2)Carb Heat............................Cold
3)Mixture Rich.........................Full Rich
4)RPM....................................1700 RPM
5)Eng Temps & Pressures........ Checked
6)Suction............................... Green
7)Alternator............................Checked
8 )Magneto's............................Checked
9)Carb Heat/Ice.......................Checked
10)Mixture..............................Checked
11)Idle RPM.............................500-700
12)Carb heat ..........................Cold
13)Throttle ............................ 1000 RPM

If you don't want a how-to list, you could distill that to:

Fuel Qty - CHECKED
Carb heat - WORKS
Oil Temp and Pressure - CHECKED
Suction - CHECKED
Magnetos - BOTH CHECKED
Alternator - WORKS
Mixture Control - WORKS
Idle RPM - GOOD

No need to include "1700RPM" or explain when to set full rich. That's all part of the "how-to". Putting the throttle back to 1000RPM doesn't need to be a checklist item.

Even better, just:

Fuel Gauges
Carb Heat
Oil gauges
Suction
Mags
Alternator
Mixture
Idle RPM

Order them howsoever you wish.

[CpnCrunch]

Edited, as I misread BPF's comment.

[Cat Driver]

What would you fixed wing pilots do about written check lists if you were to switch over to instructing in helicopters...say something like an R22?

How would you teach them to read one of those mile long written check lists that a lot of schools have for Cessna 172's?

Last time I flew an R22 I think holding and reading a long written check list while flying the R22 would have been challenging.

[Illya Kuryakin]

ILya

The original poster, whom I am guessing is a relatively low time pilot asked about a runup checklist for his C 172

I provided an answer. I am guess from the ridicule in your response you don't agree. OK so how about you
provide an answer to his specific query ?

Well, I might just have refered him to the POH. Just messing with your head. I'd suggest a sense of humour transplant.
ILLYA

[CpnCrunch]

What would you fixed wing pilots do about written check lists if you were to switch over to instructing in helicopters...say something like an R22?

I've never come across a flight school that uses a printed checklist in the air, and I don't think anyone was suggesting that.

[PilotDAR]

Both helicopter schools I trained with expected reference to paper checklists in flight, not a problem, if you plan its use into the piloting.

[Big Pistons Forever]

I'd suggest a sense of humour transplant.
ILLYA

Well since since smart ass throw away toilet humour seems to be the extent of your "contribution" to this thread I am OK with just continuing to post you know actual information in response to the original posters question. If that constitutes a sense of humour failure on my part; well I guess I am guilty as charged.......

[Illya Kuryakin]

Trey, on the subject of mind numbing redundancy of checklists, keep in mind they're written by the manufacturer's legal department. At my latest visit to FSI for my first Caravan school in 17 years, we were blown away by the 20 minutes it took to run the pre start checklist as per Cessna. You KNOW where that checklist ended up, don't you.
Illya

[New_PIC]

The manual for a Cessna 172i has Section I titled 'Operating Check List'. It includes the following paragraph as part of the chapter's introduction:

"Section I lists, in Pilot's Check List form, the steps necessary to operate your airplane efficiently and safely. It is not a check list in its true form as it is considerably longer, but does cover briefly all of the points that you should know for a typical flight."

So they've actually said that stuff can be trimmed out of what they present in that manual, right? Cessna, at that time, was saying the lists provided did not have to be used verbatim. A later manual at hand separates actual checklists and "amplified" procedures. So, for the OP, whether you want to use the checklist from the manual might depend on which 172 and manual you have.

[goldeneagle]

Fish on

[Rookie50]

I suggest for those owning an aircraft or a partnership, using the (Cessna) resources, write your own checklist, to the level and brevity, and equipment, that suits you and your equipped airplane. I did this, and bolded the "kill items" , and sectioned off a "before entry" checklist.

That is the only one I always refer to before start, after that it's a flow for me, though I have a checklist for each phase, I rarely look at it.

The pre-start items, some of which are "kill items" would be summarized as "(fuel) caps, drains, oil quantity / cap secure, tires, chocks / cowl plugs, pitot cover off, spot device on, flight plan texted, (I do flight follow for northern flights) cargo / pax secure". Occasionally I've actaully caught something using that list, from there its a flow because every other check is in right in front of me. If caps are good I know I visually checked fuel levels, too.

While engine warms I set DI, alt, controls free and clear, boost pump, alt static, check breakers, gear light, trims, fuel selector, input flight plan, clearance --- leaves me little to do after run -up --- except set flaps, mixture, lights, T / O time.....it's all an easy flow.

My most common habit is forgetting to record takeoff times occasionally using a flow....

I fly a 182RG, and I find the flow method much faster and more accurate.

To be fair to some frequency of flying would have a big impact on what system works best for someone, and if planes are switched. I used to switch between a carb 172 RG and a FI 172S, and I had to read the checklist to make sure I could start the S model.....completely different technique.