Parking Brake on the Runway

[rigpiggy]

do not trust the park brakes...... on or off. Anybody remember a ggn 1900 that just about rolled into the terminal because they had put on the park brakes and were head down in their after starts. Or a B200 stuck on the runway for awhile due to delay in clearance, and put on the brakes and they wouldn't release or the emb-190 guys that were trying to reset the clock in the air that landed with the brakes on.

In Short trust nothing mechanical not to fail at the most inopportune time.

[Cat Driver]

The only time I set the park brakes was to have wheel chocks put in place....then I released the park brake.

Setting the park brake after taxiing can result in problems due to brake temperatures.

[Maynard]

If you need to use the parking brake, then you're not using enough beta.

[complexintentions]

I think this is yet another one of those discussions that can't really have a one size fits all answer. Too many types, vintages, and systems. I do know that it's been standard practice at my various outfits to set the parking brake any time you're stopped, anywhere, for more than a couple seconds. Including on the runway waiting for takeoff clearance. Especially at light weights there's plenty of residual thrust at ground idle to try and stand on the pedals for minutes at a time. Stop concentrating for a few seconds and "HEY! WE'RE ROLLING!". The risk of unwanted movement was considered far greater than the brake not releasing again. As far as taking off or landing with it on there are warnings up the wazoo.

It is correct that there can be temperature issues as Cat mentioned, but obviously, far more a problem taxiing in after landing than taxiing out for takeoff.

But yeah in something small and light with a simple parking brake I wouldn't set it on the runway.

[PilotDAR]

By my personal choice, based upon lessons learned (no damage happily), I do not use a parking brake at all, unless doing so is specified by a company SOP. If I'm in charge of a plane which is running, and unchocked, I will take responsibility for applying the brakes as required, for however long required - or I'll shut down and chock it.

[Donald]

I think this is yet another one of those discussions that can't really have a one size fits all answer. Too many types, vintages, and systems.

Bingo.

[oldtimer]

It was a park brake that did not fully release that killed 11 people at the Mirabel airport a few years ago. . flt 420, an SA 226TC Metro 2 departed Dorval and the TSB feel the poorly designed park brake system allowed pressure to remain in the wheel brakes and on take-off, the brakes overheated, setting fire to the tires and the wing failed before the crew could get the airplane on the ground. C-GQAL.

[Zaibatsu]

It's part of our SOPs following engine failure or fire. Several examples of aircraft rolling away during evacuation were cited as reason for doing so.

Yes, you might forget it, or it might stick on, or likewise you might forget to release brakes that are held or those brakes might not release as well for various reasons. I have no issue setting a park brake on the runway when waiting for wake turbulence or separation.

[Illya Kuryakin]

Well, I have attempted to release the park brake to taxi by pushing in the air vent on the BE90 (they are right next to each other, and the other guy set them). I have attempted to taxi with both props in feather (I looked silly) I have also attempted to get out of my seat with my seat belt still fastened (we've all done that, right?). I witnessed a C310 fall on its face while the ramp guy attempted to tow it with the park brake on. Position and hold....I'll feather the puppy. Park....I'll wait till it's chocked. I almost never use the park brake. Okay, after an RTO, and a pax evac, everybody sets the park brake.
Illya

[CL-Skadoo!]

The only time I set the park brakes was to have wheel chocks put in place....then I released the park brake.

Setting the park brake after taxiing can result in problems due to brake temperatures.

A fellow with far more grey hair than I (used to have) told me the exact same thing many years ago and since it passed the sanity test for me, has been personal SOP to this day.

[altiplano]

To those that "never use the park brake" - Do you not set the park brake after push back?

[CL-Skadoo!]

To those that "never use the park brake" - Do you not set the park brake after push back?

Gates and pushbacks are far too mainstream for me. I should qualify, that I am more of the rarely category. To say I never use it, is a bit of a stretch. I'll use it when I am in the penalty box for slot times or something similar, but surely NEVER on a runway during normal ops (RTO, Evacuations, etc excluded).

[valleyboy]

Trying to recall but I think it might of been the herc or possibly boeing classics but there was a remote possibility that after setting the parking break it might not release. It was associated with normal wear on the system. Bottom line is that we never set parking breaks on the runway. Except for emergencies parking breaks were set prior to start and chock removal and released when chocks were in place. We rarely even set them in the line up.

Maybe, like today's automobiles, NG aircraft are approaching idiot proof but common sense dictates you remove any variables you can to improve safety. Have we deteriorated to the point we can't hold the breaks while in position -- damn

[pelmet]

To those that "never use the park brake" - Do you not set the park brake after push back?

It will be much easier to discover a problem during a long, low power taxi than during a high power takeoff roll. Might want to reconsider.

[stone69]

It seems to me that the OP was questioning the use of the parking brake when in position on the runway for takeoff. There have been all sorts of situations covered in the previous posts that really have nothing to do with the original question. Setting the brake after push-back has nothing to do with the question. I will tell you that back... way back... a situation occurred where a large ( for the day ) four engine jet was cleared to position and hold.... this was done and the parking brake was then set..... when take off clearance was given, the takeoff was commenced and the crew thought the acceleration was slower than normal, but the takeoff was continued and it was only after takeoff that it was discovered the parking brake was still on.... the only thing that saved them was the runway was " contaminated ".... make that ice covered and who knows what sort of JBI it would registered, but they did live to fly another day.... after that it was drilled into crews not to set the PB when in position on the active.... not an old wives tale at all.... happened in YYZ....

[telex]

If the above post is a first hand account of being onboard I'll believe it.

Otherwise I call bs.

[altiplano]

To those that "never use the park brake" - Do you not set the park brake after push back?

It will be much easier to discover a problem during a long, low power taxi than during a high power takeoff roll. Might want to reconsider.

might want to reconsider setting the brake after push? at all? what do you mean?

bottom line, you set the brake when you don't want to move... when set the brake on a Boeing, you don't go anywhere... lower power, higher power... taxi, takeoff... whatever... pretty f-ing easy to figure out either way because you're stopped.

[pelmet]

To those that "never use the park brake" - Do you not set the park brake after push back?

It will be much easier to discover a problem during a long, low power taxi than during a high power takeoff roll. Might want to reconsider.

might want to reconsider setting the brake after push? at all? what do you mean?

Stone69 said it best.

"It seems to me that the OP was questioning the use of the parking brake when in position on the runway for takeoff. There have been all sorts of situations covered in the previous posts that really have nothing to do with the original question. Setting the brake after push-back has nothing to do with the question. I will tell you that back... way back... a situation occurred where a large ( for the day ) four engine jet was cleared to position and hold.... this was done and the parking brake was then set..... when take off clearance was given, the takeoff was commenced and the crew thought the acceleration was slower than normal, but the takeoff was continued and it was only after takeoff that it was discovered the parking brake was still on.... the only thing that saved them was the runway was " contaminated ".... make that ice covered and who knows what sort of JBI it would registered, but they did live to fly another day.... after that it was drilled into crews not to set the PB when in position on the active.... not an old wives tale at all.... happened in YYZ.... "

And I gave the real world examples.

[av8ts]

Stone69 starts out by saying most posts have nothing to do with the question then gives tells us a "well I heard" story that has nothing to do with the question. Most modern airliners have a takeoff warning horn that will sound if you try to increase power/thrust with the brakeon, so what happened in the story won't happen.

[stone69]

This thread is why I don't bother posting most of the time. It happened on runway 32 ( YYZ ) and who said it was a " modern airliner " with all the protections that are now provided....

[telex]

Can we assume this is a first person account of the event? I heard it was a 747.

[stone69]

DC-8 ...YYZ -YUL

[Illya Kuryakin]

Stone69 starts out by saying most posts have nothing to do with the question then gives tells us a "well I heard" story that has nothing to do with the question. Most modern airliners have a takeoff warning horn that will sound if you try to increase power/thrust with the brakeon, so what happened in the story won't happen.

And almost everything more modern than an Apache has a "the gear is still up azzhole" warning, but pilots still just leave it up.
Illya

[av8ts]

I'm not saying it was a modern airliner or that it didn't happen, I'm just saying that today it's no more or less relevant than anyone else's post

[ahramin]

I agree. While this thread has been interesting and has some information I didn't know that could have applied very much to a couple aircraft I flew in my career, the practice of never setting the parking brake because a few crews managed to take off with it on doesn't apply to a single one of the many types of aircraft I currently fly.

I've always been against the philosophy of flying aircraft A in a certain manner because aircraft B needs to be flown that way, but it's good to know about aircraft B nonetheless.