'Regional' Flight Crew Selection - What are you looking for?

[rudder]

Because your fairy tale was a thinly veiled comparison to Air Canada. Not only that, but your facts were all wrong. As I posted earlier, the corporate structure between Air Canada and it's regional airlines is totally different than between Westjet and Westjet Regional.

Sorry Raven. Not every discussion is based on the AC world.

It was actually a thinly veiled comparison to some of the rumours circulating about the planned WJ/WJR employment arrangements. I am hoping that it will have little resemblance to reality in the WJ world.

[Duncan Idaho]

AC used to own Jazz and my understanding is it is exactly as rudder described. The owners faced paying for training on the 767/319 for the newhire mainline employee PLUS the Dash8/RJ training for a new Jazz guy off the street if they upgraded a Jazz pilot to the mainline. So they just put a guy off the street onto the mainline. They did have a guaranteed interview for Jazz pilots and some guys were funnelled in, but they weren't the hiring pool.

[FriendlyBear]

Hi Dave and Gina,
I would like to ask what weight/value you place on previous Q400 PIC experience for the new regional division? Will having previous experience on the Q400 help somebody make it into the 'short listed' pool of candidates or, will it not play any significant role in selection criteria?
Has WestJet given any thought to eventually getting their own Q400 simulator? Can't wait to see what the details are going to be for this new venture!
Thanks
FB

[DaveP]

Hi Bear,
I think it's safe to say we will likely choose the first 40 pilots to come with some 705 experience. The q400 will likely assist you in being noticed. the plan is to train all the pilots as captains and right seat check the ones that don't have a left seat - until their new airplane shows up.

As for the simulator - it was part of the rfp or request for procurement, however we won't be obtaining one right out of the gate. It will likely show up down the road in a year or two (or 3). When it's viable.

Cheers.

From sunny yxl, im heading back to my vacation!

Dave.

[FriendlyBear]

Dave,
Thanks for taking the time from your holidays to get back to me! That's pretty cool to be able to ask you these questions and actually get a first hand response.
Enjoy the holidays and I hope you are getting in some fun time on a Beaver!
Cheers
FB

[the goal is soul]

I suppose a big question for a lot of people whose career goals are to fly with WestJet is whether or not the Regional operation will become the ‘the’ way to reach that goal. If want to be a WestJet pilot at some point, are you going to miss the boat if you don’t jump on this?

Does a guy leave what he’s doing now, in anticipation that his contributions and service to the Regional operation is well-recognized and puts him in a better position to be hired into WestJet as compared to external applicants?

Does a guy stay where he is to avoid a lateral move, continue to build experience and develop professionally, in anticipation that the window to be hired hasn’t closed because the majority of pilots will be coming from the Regional operation?

It would be a pretty special part of your career to be a part of this on the ground floor. It’s unfortunate that you have to think so strategically about your career…takes some of the fun out of it. But it is what it is.

Good people always seem to figure it out and make it through just fine though.

[cj555]

Great question 'the goal is soul,' I'm very interested to hear some input from someone involved in hiring at WJ.

[yycflyguy]

Enjoy the holidays and I hope you are getting in some fun time on a Beaver!
FB

Well that seems a little personal.

[wjawannabe]

The latest and greatest is:

- We are finalizing comp and ben next week
- Chief pilot and VP postings are up (extended for another 2 weeks)
- General pilot posting will be up likely October 1st - Interviewing will commence in November
- We hope to hire and have first ground school going by late March/1st of April
- Bases are still undecided - marketing will choose where the first 2 aircraft start later in the year - likely Q1.

Cheers,
Dave.

Just wondering if the compensation and benefits details are public knowledge yet? I don't want to start some mud-slinging debate over them, but they're obviously an important part of making career decisions. I am in the fortunate position of having several options to look at and WestJet Regional (for lack of a working name!) is at the top of my list, but the lack of specific information on pay is a bit of a hole in my research!

[DaveP]

Hi,
Nothing is settled yet. It will likely be a while yet too.

The posting itself won't go up until all this (comp/ben)is decided. We are still in the process of hiring a President, CP and VP. I'll be working with the new CP for the hiring piece.

Cheers.

[Oleo 4]

I see the excitement here on this forum is going to create a few options on the ol' resume pile for you guys!

Don't work too many late nights, life is too short!

[monkey]

I hear the startup will require a lot of q400 captain types like myself. I'm very interested but I'm curious what it will take to lure away others to join the new regional. This is post if for the other higher time heavy turboprop captains, what are you guys/girls looking for in a package to lure you away?

Cheers

[7thirtyseven]

I hear the startup will require a lot of q400 captain types like myself. I'm very interested but I'm curious what it will take to lure away others to join the new regional. This is post if for the other higher time heavy turboprop captains, what are you guys/girls looking for in a package to lure you away?

Cheers

For cryong out loud..... anybody that has two eyes connected to even a small pilot peabrain the name Westjet alone should be able to "lure them away" from the other festering holes we call jobs in this country. Of course that is just the opinion of someone who wants to ne compensated better than everyone else, who wants a great but fair schedule who wants a job that is sustainable and will be there/better in the future. who wants a job where your LIFE actually has a minute bit of meaning. A job where shit actually rolls uphill, and has folks who own up take responsibility in mgmt. where DAY 1 you have a decent shot at summer.holidays/christmas off.

[monkey]

Hey 737 thanks for the reply. A lot of the conditions you posted apply with the 737 fleet but may or may not carry over to the turboprop. I'm interested in the opinion from Jazz \ Porter Captains with 1000 PIC on type, interested or not and what would it take?

I'm sure WJ prop will be an awesome place to work however your also going after pilots that will have significant years into a good company who probably already have a great lifestyle. I'm interested in hearing from some of those types.

Cheers

[7thirtyseven]

Hey 737 thanks for the reply. A lot of the conditions you posted apply with the 737 fleet but may or may not carry over to the turboprop. I'm interested in the opinion from Jazz \ Porter Captains with 1000 PIC on type, interested or not and what would it take?

I'm sure WJ prop will be an awesome place to work however your also going after pilots that will have significant years into a good company who probably already have a great lifestyle. I'm interested in hearing from some of those types.

Cheers

hee hee... I am curious about that too... looked like the conversation stalled trying to get it going again. I think what youll find when all the pieces fall into place is a job that will take second seat to NO one, but will also be sustainable. ie at the end of the work day you will feel you have contributed, not just to the wellbeing of the company but to your own personal future. To me this is a PRICELESS attribute of Westjet which will be included in the q400 operarion.

You can be assured that of the 1100± guys already flying for westjet 1099± will be saying whats good for the day one capt on the 37 is good for the 1st dayer q400 FO.

You can be assured that while westjet has the deserved reputation of being ruthlessly cheap and agressive with suppliers, airports, levels of government etc it is also obsessed with providing the best tools and training procedures aircraft etc for you to do your job. eg in the last month ive seen 5-6 mels. tv screens and a coffee pot that didnt work. this is on 37s that have been flogged mercilessly for the past 10 yrs.

[7thirtyseven]

Pressed the wrong button above...

Like I said I am curious about what high time dh8 would be expecting in terms of compensation/conditions as well. My guess is the response would be all over the map (like most issues us peabrains address). The result being when the conditions finally are published (dont worry, we will squak) some will see it as a priceless opportunity and others will focus on elements that are obviously immature in their development.

I have roughly 8000 hrs in a dh8 and a history of failed operations (read shitty career) so the "intangibles" ive mentioned above are a dominant factor for me personally.... but I too am curious what guys at say Jazz or Porter would consider a Good gamble to jump ship given westjets historical pattern of "delayed compensation" lack of pension etc.

[Kosiw]

If the salary/benefits package (hopefully available before job posting goes up) turns out to be comparable to Jazz/Porter, it would end up being a lateral for most but dollars to donuts there are those from Jazz/Porter who will be looking at WJR as a backdoor way into the mainline regardless of the compensation package, hopefully the hiring team will sift the wheat from the chaff...

This is a very unique situation... here you have a major north american airline starting a regional from scratch, getting in on the ground floor of a well funded operation will be very attractive to many of us.... brand new shiny Q400's, job stability, a good schedule, good salary and benefits and being a part of a winning team with a future are all reasons to look seriously at this opportunity.

[monkey]

Hey 737,

I know that life, I'm at the point in mine now were i'm not sure i can afford to reset to the beginning again is all. The kids RESP / my RRSP might take a huge hit to get back to were I'm at now.

I'm glad to hear that you've "made it" though, it's nice to hear that it does finally work out in the end.

Cheers

[flyer 1492]

Hope you enjoy the LOW wages. Hope you enjoy living at home (Calgary and Toronto). It sets it self up just like every regional that is in operation today, the majors (westjet) saying NIMBY, SCOPE, etc and the regionals trying to undercut...
And so continues the race to the bottom...

[Lateralus]

Hope you enjoy the LOW wages. Hope you enjoy living at home (Calgary and Toronto). It sets it self up just like every regional that is in operation today, the majors (westjet) saying NIMBY, SCOPE, etc and the regionals trying to undercut...
And so continues the race to the bottom...

Do you have any facts to back this up?

[DaveP]

I don't even have the wages and working conditions for the new regional!

Flyer has never been a fan of WJ let alone this newest venture.

I remember when I left Air Ontario, everyone was making fun of Westjet back then too. It was all about the wages and working conditions. Sometimes it takes a little grind to build the company up and then we can reward ourselves. My upgrade wage was 70k. Today many airlines are trying to catch up to us with wages and lifestyle.

Today I'm thinking the average captain pays more than 70k in tax!

I'm not throwing stones here flyer, just saying give us a chance to get it off the ground and we will match and (hopefully)someday surpass what you folks have done at Jazz. We have to get the foundation built first!

I can honestly say we have learned a lot from those other traditional regional issues.

Cheers.

[Bede]

Hope you enjoy the LOW wages. Hope you enjoy living at home (Calgary and Toronto). It sets it self up just like every regional that is in operation today, the majors (westjet) saying NIMBY, SCOPE, etc and the regionals trying to undercut...
And so continues the race to the bottom...

So let's assume you're CEO of WJ. How would you run the operation.

My brother lived in Switzerland for a while. He described the Swiss way as "whenever you say, 'they should do it that way', the Swiss do it that way". WestJet is kind of like that. If I was King Almighty of WestJet, there is very little I could think of to do better. And that includes wages and working conditions.

Our executive open themselves up for humiliation by putting the regional business plan to a vote by the employees. I was at a couple townhalls and the pilots asked some very pressing and pointed questions towards our leadership. Our management sold the plan to the employees, the ones most concerned with wages, and the plan was accepted by us overwhelmingly.

Will WJR pay as much as mainline? No, but this will be the best regional airline job in this country.

[7thirtyseven]

Hey 737,

I know that life, I'm at the point in mine now were i'm not sure i can afford to reset to the beginning again is all. The kids RESP / my RRSP might take a huge hit to get back to were I'm at now.

I'm glad to hear that you've "made it" though, it's nice to hear that it does finally work out in the end.

Cheers

Completely valid, spoken like a great parent.
My family took a knife to our standard of living for a couple of yrs... somehow I convinced them the future payoff would be worth it.

All told (this is just from watching I have no internal info, infact Im a pain in davePs arse) the conditions will probably be a balance between fair market wages and a desire to atract motivated people who are willing to put something on the line for a better future.

Its remarkable how the "race to the bottom" boys come out of the woodwork but no one is willing to anti up and say "these are the conditions I would jump ship for". Again my feelings are that it would be all over the map...

[Joe Blow Schmo]

no one is willing to anti up and say "these are the conditions I would jump ship for". Again my feelings are that it would be all over the map...

Since you asked: I'd jump ship for $250K plus the same ESP, scheduling, and other benefits that Westjet mainline gets....and no, I'm not expecting to be jumping ship

[monkey]

Hey all, great comments so far.

Although there is risk for new employees coming over in terms of lower wages and lost earnings growth from the previous employer however as Dave mentioned I do see the benefit in a stable career. I jump seat with WJ and am always impressed with how friendly \ happy everyone is, for me this is what excites me the most.

Bede and Dave you both have said WJ excels at doing this the "right way", one of the most important things I would like to see is some sort of flow through with a common seniority. Actually I think this is going to be paramount to attracting and retaining the right people as well as avoiding a lot of the current pitfalls ie. Jazz/AC. I am very content staying at regional knowing that one day I have an option of going to mainline, who knows I may decide to spend my whole career at regional. However if there is no flow then there well be a drive amongst regional pilots to go to mainline ASAP to avoid loss of seniority and associated loss of pay. As well this would go a long way to preventing any bad blood between the two groups. That being said I fully do not expect to go from left seat Q400 to left seat B737, I understand that there would need to be some sort of time spent in the right seat learning the job. If it truly is going to be the best job in the industry it must have this, my opinion anyways.

Cheers!