Dear HR Departments:

[rigpiggy]

Last i heard nca was paying sub 70k for 1900 Capt.

[rigpiggy]

The market is changing again. Might as well say 'if you want me to work at your company, tell me what the salary is so we don't waste each other's time'.
[/quote]
And you think companies are bad, for their mercenary attitudes.
[/quote]

I don't think they are bad, I think they are being inefficient and I don't understand what they hope to accomplish by hiding the salary.

This............. i talked with a company on vancouver island a ways back. Salary came up fairly quick. I asked for 10k more than current job. Uhhhh I don't think that will work. Well sorry to waste your time. They are still looking for people.

[JHR]

I was called for an interview recently. No job description except type and base. When I finally saw the names of the interviewers I was able to do some research and found the pay was far too low for the type of plane and the schedule. Not wanting to waste anyone's time on an interview I contacted HR to cancel. If they had posted the salary upfront I would never have applied. Maybe that is what they are worried about?
Just seems very inefficient in the current environment.

[CL-Skadoo!]

There are two sides to this coin, especially for private operators and I definitely see it from a pilot's side when viewing some of abyssmal salaries that are offered at times. However, if your salary gets out as being better than average or even superior to other operations, especially management companies, they can often use it to slide in and try to convince an operator to use them instead of having their own flight department. "Why are you spending XX when we could be saving you X by using our people and our system?".

So please aware that there are companies who benefit from hiding both low salaries and high salaries.

[schnitzel2k3]

"Why are you spending XX when we could be saving you X by using our people and our system?".

One would hope the answer is - '...because I like to know that the people upfront are happy, and able to afford some fairly standard North American amenities in life, so that I'm not worried when they are operating the jet that their mind is on flying and not on that they wished they had an extra X dollars....'

[digits_]

"Why are you spending XX when we could be saving you X by using our people and our system?".

One would hope the answer is - '...because I like to know that the people upfront are happy, and able to afford some fairly standard North American amenities in life, so that I'm not worried when they are operating the jet that their mind is on flying and not on that they wished they had an extra X dollars....'

More realisticaly, the answer would likely be 'because after 10 years my pilots making XX are still here. How long have your pilots making X been in their position?'

[CL-Skadoo!]

These are both correct answers. Sometimes a business mind has a tough time wrestling with these facts and for those above average salaries, the turnover is low enough to not have to publish their payscales. Granted, this is more of an exception to the rule, so don't let me take away from the intent of the thread. I just thought it is worth understanding for some.

"Why are you spending XX when we could be saving you X by using our people and our system?".

One would hope the answer is - '...because I like to know that the people upfront are happy, and able to afford some fairly standard North American amenities in life, so that I'm not worried when they are operating the jet that their mind is on flying and not on that they wished they had an extra X dollars....'

More realisticaly, the answer would likely be 'because after 10 years my pilots making XX are still here. How long have your pilots making X been in their position?'

[schnitzel2k3]

These are both correct answers. Sometimes a business mind has a tough time wrestling with these facts and for those above average salaries, the turnover is low enough to not have to publish their payscales. Granted, this is more of an exception to the rule, so don't let me take away from the intent of the thread. I just thought it is worth understanding for some.

One would hope the answer is - '...because I like to know that the people upfront are happy, and able to afford some fairly standard North American amenities in life, so that I'm not worried when they are operating the jet that their mind is on flying and not on that they wished they had an extra X dollars....'

More realisticaly, the answer would likely be 'because after 10 years my pilots making XX are still here. How long have your pilots making X been in their position?'

You're good bud, I think going forward though, bizav needs to breakaway from the stale mentality of this is how we've always done it.

Salaries, proper crewing for the mission, schedules, bondless employment are now on the table and need to be respected. This 2 crew for a non-adjustable constant on call charter pig is getting old fast, which is why they have to bond - 24 months where the employee is paid so low they cannot leave without incurring massive debt. The companies racing to the bottom will be the first to be affected when seats go unfulfilled.

[Launchpad1]

If they had posted the salary upfront I would never have applied. Maybe that is what they are worried about?

I think that's exactly it.

If they put up the payscale, and you can work out the location you're expected to live, you could very quickly figure that you'd be struggling to survive so wouldn't even apply.

By reeling you in first with an interview they can a) try to sell the job with other 'benefits' and b) you're kind of more invested into it as you've prepared for the interview.

If they started putting up the payscale on Pilot job advertisements the entire industry would probably collapse as no one would become a Pilot

[rigpiggy]

So lets see, mississinippi is offering 100-130 for b200 capt. and 130-145 for Chief Pilots. Would be nice if Keewatin posted a salary range. Especially as some of there flying is even as we shall say "more robust"

[rudder]

703/704 operators (and some smaller 705) are on their way to being decimated in this hiring cycle (2022/2023).

Some will realize the change and at least try to adapt. Others will simply shrink or disappear.

The pendulum always swings too far in each direction. It is a sellers market.

[digits_]

I'd say you'd get a lot of long term pilots in 703 ops if they can make 140k there. And -and this is important- if they believe the salaries will maintain that level. So some proper contract or union involvement might be necessary to provide that protection.

[rigpiggy]

With the demise of airlinepilotpay.ca maybe the mods here can set up a way to anonymously post pay an t&c for every canadian operator

[rudder]

With the demise of airlinepilotpay.ca maybe the mods here can set up a way to anonymously post pay an t&c for every canadian operator

It has been done before elsewhere. Then either the pilots or the moderator cease to update so information becomes irrelevant.

[rigpiggy]

More likely the traffic didn't support the server cost