Buckshot,
We would all welcome good news at canjet. If we leave or if we stay we all have friends there and wish them all the best. BUT we've all heard good news from them before, we've all seen things go fairly smooth then have the rug once again pulled out from under us. That's the problem. The track record sucks. Not only is respect an issue but also trust. There's a fairly large feeling that the employees are really just gun fodder.
After we're smacked around and given a good solid beating we all like to be cuddled, told we're loved and that it'll never happen again. But ya know it usually does and sooner or later we wake up and see the pattern and run to the halfway house.

I do have respect for the people that worked there and put up with the crap. But as its been mentioned, its a 2-way street. Stop defending an employer that had no respect. Especially for the 1 guy that put his heart and soul, volunteered the majority of his free time and sacrificed his personal life for the betterment of CanJet as a whole. JK has taken it on the nose. He put up with the embarrassment, frustration, and humiliation that CJ management illegally subjected him to when they refused to hire him back because he was the union ring leader. Where was the RESPECT that he deserved. Shove your respect!

So this meeting on Tuesday, is this a normal scheduled meeting or is it something bigger than that?

I for one miss seeing CanJet.

invertedattitude wrote:So this meeting on Tuesday, is this a normal scheduled meeting or is it something bigger than that?

I for one miss seeing CanJet.

lets see, the rumor mill says it could be just the announcement of the summer reduced domestic/charter sked, or when he is gonna shut er down for good, or Airbus's joining the fleet, although they talked about that for years s how knows.

Sorry Kandoo. I was not aware of any information that others were not provided.
I thought it was great to hear some good news for a change and thought it would be good to share...
I was told by a good source from within the company's ranks that a letter was sent via e-mail from COO to all employees with E-mail access on Friday afternoon.
From what was shown to me this letter was rather positive and detailed a meeting with the pilots and F/A group to discuss the Summer and next Winter flying opportunities further. This was to occur on next Tuesday afternoon. Not sure of any meetings scheduled with the rest of the employees. I am sure if you ask around you might be able to find a copy. Unfortunately I was not given a copy, but only an opportunity to read it.

I'm not understanding this whole Airbus idea? What's the supposed benefit? Aside from having to retrain everyone to an airplane with the same capabilities or less than a 737.

Man I've been screaming it from the rooftops already, and 37 drivers won't like it, but if CanJet wants to survive in a constant market (Domestic) You need to go RJ's man... either CRJ's or ERJ's whatever, for CanJet's routes they used to have IMO this is the way to go. Lease 5 or 6 new ERJ145XR's or CRJ700's

You only need 50-60% to break even, and it's a lot easier to fill a 50 or 70 seat jet than it is a 120...

inverted, where do you get your 'break even' numbers from??

also, this airbus rumor; is this an all-airbus fleet rumor, or a we-have-boeings-and-airbuses fleet? If it's the latter, how could running 2 types be a good thing(costs-wise)?

invertedattitude wrote:I'm not understanding this whole Airbus idea? What's the supposed benefit? Aside from having to retrain everyone to an airplane with the same capabilities or less than a 737.

Man I've been screaming it from the rooftops already, and 37 drivers won't like it, but if CanJet wants to survive in a constant market (Domestic) You need to go RJ's man... either CRJ's or ERJ's whatever, for CanJet's routes they used to have IMO this is the way to go. Lease 5 or 6 new ERJ145XR's or CRJ700's

You only need 50-60% to break even, and it's a lot easier to fill a 50 or 70 seat jet than it is a 120...

C'mon man what are the supposed benifits of and Airbus compared to a 737/500. Hmm lets see more seats, longer range, easier on the gas, remember the 500 has basically the same wing as a 200. Most companies will train some crews as well to get the deal. blah blah blah.
KR has said that he wants to do the charter market and get away from domestis skeds all together, although since he has said that a limited summer sked might happen but clearly he has said for Canjet to survive it has to do charters mostly. Therefore RJ's aren't the plane for them.
I agree on a east coast domestic only market the 37 might be a little too big but since he gave up on that then the 500 isn't the best for charters. I say Airbus 19's and 20's or NG 37's, imo.

Amen Sticksheaker, JK was and still is being treated in the worst possable way. I don't understand for one instant how anybody can expect a company that deliberatly and openly disregards the Canadian Labour code and the ALPA seniority list to be respected. It will only be a matter of time untill any of you still employed there will find out what it will be like working for an employer who makes up all his own rules. Good luck trying to justify a safety concern if it goes against company policy or heaven forbid may cost some money. Respect, HAHAHA your fired.

I heard JK got on with AC, which is AWESOME if true! Congrats!

As well as four other CJ pilots to AC...one to Transat....SWEEEET!

May people continue to get good jobs...

Hi CJ bashers(morons),it is now amusement for some of us at C6 to read how some of you who work for our competitors are really worried about us! Let us take two of our so called friends from AC/J, Stick Shaker and CantStand Ya. SS with his pious statements about no respect at C6 and CSY on about JK. What a pair of hypocrites when in their own company RM laid off thousands of workers, neutured the unions while he filled his own pockets with millions $. Fix your own problems of respect before you start giving us advice. CSY, I did not say in an earlier post our critics were loosers. I said you were losers! Someone in your baggage room can tell you the difference! I hope to get back for the Tuesday meeting so if Rotate and the Capt. really work for C6 it will give you both a chance to put your money where your mouths have been particularly if KR attends. Good luck Josh at AC, you are young enough to sit for 5/7 years starting at 40k and if you get bored I guess you can cut your teeth in the constant fighting that goes on between management and the pilots!

I'm trying to remember when Milton or whomever shut down AC/Jazz on a whim every couple of years...multiple times...

Seriously, I don't think you want to be TRYING to draw attention to a comparison between CanJet and AC...and your attempt at sarcasm at those heading to AC is wasted...JK et al will be making far more year 3 at AC in the right seat than a ten-year captain at CanJet. If C6 ever stayed in business that long. And I think they even get dental there!!

I fail to see where anyone - including myself - has bashed CanJet: the employee group. On the contrary, C6 had (still does have) some of the finest people in the industry working for them.

But "bashing" CanJet: certain managers, the COO, and owner...well they deserve everything they've gotten and a lot more. Ya reap what you sow. And if you can't see the difference, perhaps you shouldn't be throwing the term moron around so quickly...

HiFly I think the fact that you yourself use the term "C6" to describe your own company proof enough that it is going no where. If you are this loyal to a horrible company imagine how loyal you would be to a good one. Go find yourself a better home and stop cutting up those that have.

Whipline, UWP, great posts!

To all the canjetters that remain, I have not intended any of my posts to offend you. Only the mngt team that continually degrade the profession (low salary, benefits, pension, schedule, duty extensions, illegally ignoring the CIRB rulings that appointed ALPA as the barginning unit for CJ pilots...). Stay, at CJ I don't care. I moved on long ago and am happy I did. You will leave jobs at WJ/AC/J for those that want them. I am just making my points to those in power at IMP/CJ that they are so out of touch with what industry standard conditions are both in Canada and in the global market. If you want to accept those terms, break a leg! But I will always defend my points that CJ was substandard working conditions. (I wasn't aware that you didn't have a dental plan there yet, good god. Thats ridiculious!)

Bahahaha!

What I was getting at with the Airbus comment is having to re-train all the staff to work Airbus instead of Boeing. From what I've been told, but I could be wrong a 737-500 to 737NG conversion is for obvious reasons, much smoother. I'm a Boeing or Ain't going kind of fan though so I'm a bit biased in this department.

problem is the supply of NG's vs demand. Companies like WestJet, SouthWest and a bunch of European and Asian outfits already got dibs on all NG's available. Those companies are just the tip of the iceburgh, NG's are very popular. Rumour on the street is there's better odds with a A319. RJ's are out of the question since they can't lift enough for tour operators, the -500 is small enough as it is. The B757 would be a good choice, but maybe too big for what CanJet is shooting for.
But ya never know.

Yeah the 57 would be nice but sadly it is at a premium price for an older aircraft and hard to come by as well.

An Airbus 319/320 would be a good aircraft choice for CanJet as far as capabilities go...but we are talking a huge cost difference in lease price alone , not to mention a whole new parts pool, pilot training, AME training, FA training, tooling, spare engines, etc... the list is a long expense road.

That being said if CanJet can secure a long term, big contract with Transat and Sunquest all those thing I mentioned before don't seem like such a tall order anymore because the money is virtually in the bank and the venture is not as big a risk.

This summer CanJet will have the down time to make these changes as the charter season slows down, we could all be surprised this week about the "big anouncement" coming....ya never know...

Make no mistake if Mr. Rowe signs a deal for six 320's...he isn't going anywhere for awhile.


OR

They could just tell you all they are shutting down in June...hope not though.

My guess is that nobody hears shit about the meeting next week! I'd say that there is no fu&^ing meeting. All I keep hearing is the same old shit "we'll know more next week". That's been their lame game for the past 2 years now. On another note, March is creeping up on us, my guess is the 30-35 pilots remaining will have one awesome schedule - you might even see 8 days off.

ok ill try and be as fair as i can...
canjet leases on the 500 i heard are from 64,000 mth us to 95,000mth us.most other operators on afct 700/800 are around 420,000 mth.So Mr Row can not compete with West Jet and AC with good load factors?In the 70%s well say.And last winter J.G. says how pleased Canjet is pleased with the charter work they have done and how it was profitable.Spring was good as it is always good to all Airlines in Canada.Airplanes going around full all summer(pretty much 80% im guessing)So Alpa comes on the scene in,say may and all of a sudden in the fall Canjet closes the doors because they are bleeding too much.And they start again with of the ALPA head of the ALPA MEC asked to not return via company lawyers and then they springboard another company employee over other employees(negating a company and ALPA negotiated return to work seniority list) including some in the training department.Flight attendants are asked to write up the pilots if they see anything they do not like(some pretty rediculas stuff i hear)ALPA only on the scene after company refuses to address concerns of pilot employee group,for a year plus.
Rumors
Airbus rumor for at least a year now.
more ACFT yes(ontil Union,ALPA)
making money
not making money(union)?

tough spot to go to work.at best.
good luck to those who stay,but get a seat before the music stops
WS

FA's told to write pilots up when they can, never heard of that. Besides, when they did, it didn't carry much weight.
The schroud of good news is that the company is alot more open to ALPA these days (according to what the interim MEC is saying). Maybe a contract can be negeotiated fairly quickly, who knows.
As I see it now, there's no point in bickering anymore. What's done is done, and we'll all have to wait and see what transpires.
Still, the crew shortage issue is going to make things very interesting.

I do hope your meeting on Tuesday with KR goes well. Maybe he'll prove me wrong?

hifly

Are you still at cj because you are actually loyal and belive that it is a good place to be, or are you unable to get another job?
Look deep inside and rember "honesty will set you free"
Another question...How many pilots from AC/Jazz/WJ or any other carrier have left to come and work at cj as of late?
I bet its a safe bet to say ZERO. I wonder why.
I know I won't be back, I'm living the good life now.
As for any other airline being scared of cj...now thats funny.
Good luck on Tuesday with your big meeting (blah blah lies lies blah blah )
And one more thing - your a putz!

I think we should stop beating each other up because of where we decide to work. The argument tends to get a little personal, clouded and sometimes childish.
CJ is suppose to have an announcement on Tuesday. I expect it will be a very good and positive announcement for CJ/IMP. But there's a difference. What is a good deal for CJ/IMP is not necessarily a good deal for the pilot group/employees. 3 to 5 year contract with tour operators will only be as good as their out clause....30 days. New airplanes, if you still want to take the bait, would be good for your resume, next job or contract in 6 months to 3 years.
The terms and conditions that you work under will still be the same. ($40 a day for perdiems, unchanged since day one, for example)
They need to pick up the phone, call ALPA, make some emergency changes to the pay and work conditions and THEN negotiate. Untill that is done they will not keep the pilots they have and won't get any new (experienced) pilots that they can quickly upgrade.
My prediction is on Tuesday they will mumble something about a contract with transat, throw in the word "Airbus" here and there, and expect that will be enough. Oh and don't forget the ritual of them saying they are reviewing the pay and benefits of other airlines!!!! Don't go with your hopes high because once again you'll be let down.
If you are planning of staying at CJ then this is your chance to speak.

Man I've been screaming it from the rooftops already, and 37 drivers won't like it, but if CanJet wants to survive in a constant market (Domestic) You need to go RJ's man... either CRJ's or ERJ's whatever, for CanJet's routes they used to have IMO this is the way to go. Lease 5 or 6 new ERJ145XR's or CRJ700's

A CRJ-only operation wouldn't be financially viable unless it enters into a capacity purchase agreement such as the one Air Canada has with Jazz. You won't find a "major" airline in Canada that would want to charter a CRJ Canjet and you won't find a tour operator wanting to charter a CRJ for flights to the Carribean. In theory your idea sounds great (match lower passenger loads with a lower capacity aircraft) but financially/economically/strategically it doesn't work long-term.

I am on the edge of my seat waiting to hear what KR has to offer you all tomorrow. I hope its juicy!