Air Canada Pool
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Re: Air Canada Pool
First I've heard of this. Anyone have more details? Is it official somewhere or just being discussed?flashheart wrote:Anyone going to comment on the impact the new 50/50 Jazz flow through program could have on poolies. Might be a 2016 date for a bunch if this is true...
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Re: Air Canada Pool
Nothing official yet, if you check the press releases basically it says there will be some system in place to move Jazz pilots to AC since Jazz airplanes are going to drop significantly, but no details are given for a flow through scheme since the public doesn't really care about that stuff.
The flow through numbers I heard was 80/20, but others have heard 50/50, so sounds like nothing too concrete has been nailed down. We're not even sure if the flow through would be effective immediately. The agreement is only tentative, so they haven't officially signed it yet, so it's really not clear how this is going to affect applicants, although it has the potential to be negative.
I'm hoping they give us poolies more info soon.
The flow through numbers I heard was 80/20, but others have heard 50/50, so sounds like nothing too concrete has been nailed down. We're not even sure if the flow through would be effective immediately. The agreement is only tentative, so they haven't officially signed it yet, so it's really not clear how this is going to affect applicants, although it has the potential to be negative.
I'm hoping they give us poolies more info soon.
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Re: Air Canada Pool
So assuming a 80% flowthrough gets voted, and that maybe the bottom 500 pilots at Jazz want to flow, this means a new hire at Jazz won't see mainline in the next 5 years, when they could actually get an interview pretty soon if they don't vote this through. I'm not sure it's a win win at Jazz for the very last pilots on the list. A lot of the guys I know there already have everything to qualify for mainline, why vote something that could slow them down?
Re: Air Canada Pool
The details of the flow haven't been posted yet. Might not even have an interviewarcadia wrote:Oh what do you know, you are a Jazz pilot, typical. You aren't on the property yet either, still gotta pass the interview!
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Re: Air Canada Pool
So do poolies get at least get an official Air Canada seat cushion to avoid drowning?
If this becomes effective immediately, may as well kiss any chance of getting on for years unless you are near the front. Say 50 spots this year, 80% go to Jazz = 10 spots for non-Maple Leaf flyers. With a pool of 50, the math is not good...
If this becomes effective immediately, may as well kiss any chance of getting on for years unless you are near the front. Say 50 spots this year, 80% go to Jazz = 10 spots for non-Maple Leaf flyers. With a pool of 50, the math is not good...
Re: Air Canada Pool
You may have a seat cushion in the pool but if someone pees then what do you do? Then what do you do.....
Re: Air Canada Pool
I doubt there will be any interviews. Heard this was a major sticking point for ALPA. Also heard a 4 year pay top-up for Jazzers going to AC ($ coming from Jazz). BOTL is a given. Reserved seniority #'s was another one.
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Re: Air Canada Pool
80% flow from Jazz, in favour of Jazz (with potential for being higher initially so as to help cost cutting.)
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Re: Air Canada Pool
An email update was sent to the pool this morning.
Basically it confirmed that there will be a Jazz flow through agreement, which would be non-exclusive ( I'm assuming that means not 100% flow through), but no specific number was given. It said the approval process for the agreement was expected to be completed Feb. 1st. She also says they expect to be hiring in the next few months, but no course dates have been confirmed. She said a further update will come early Feb.
I'm assuming that update in early Feb will provide us with more information regarding what is to be done with the pool pilots then, as well as when this flow through will take effect and when courses are scheduled.
Basically it confirmed that there will be a Jazz flow through agreement, which would be non-exclusive ( I'm assuming that means not 100% flow through), but no specific number was given. It said the approval process for the agreement was expected to be completed Feb. 1st. She also says they expect to be hiring in the next few months, but no course dates have been confirmed. She said a further update will come early Feb.
I'm assuming that update in early Feb will provide us with more information regarding what is to be done with the pool pilots then, as well as when this flow through will take effect and when courses are scheduled.
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Re: Air Canada Pool
So this means that one year down the road the only options for pilots wanting a mainline in Canada is to go the encore or jazz route? on B-scales for a decade? Really????
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Re: Air Canada Pool
Gents,
Let's wait and not panic here. 80% / 20% as been thrown out of the window by multiple sources on this forum. Noting is official yet. I've eared that this flow agreement is to get Jazz pilots a priority over the interview process (again rumour). I'm assuming myself that they will not go to AC mainline without going through a certain process which means folks in the pool will still have a good shot at getting an offer soon enough.
The guys from Jazz who got put on a course in last December were probably coming out of the pool, so...... make you're own conclusions.
In the mean time sit back, relax and let's wait for more official news coming from AC in february.
Let's wait and not panic here. 80% / 20% as been thrown out of the window by multiple sources on this forum. Noting is official yet. I've eared that this flow agreement is to get Jazz pilots a priority over the interview process (again rumour). I'm assuming myself that they will not go to AC mainline without going through a certain process which means folks in the pool will still have a good shot at getting an offer soon enough.
The guys from Jazz who got put on a course in last December were probably coming out of the pool, so...... make you're own conclusions.
In the mean time sit back, relax and let's wait for more official news coming from AC in february.

Re: Air Canada Pool
Jazz pilots were given the details of the PMA last night from our MEC in Toronto.
The deal has yet to be ratified.
80/20 is in fact the ratio with a minimum of 495 slots. any. That means if they only hire 495 people over the next 11 years they will all be from jazz. but if they hire 1000 then 800 will be from Jazz (at least)
The executive also mentioned there financial relief for AC if they hire above the 80% from Jazz.
The deal has yet to be ratified.
80/20 is in fact the ratio with a minimum of 495 slots. any. That means if they only hire 495 people over the next 11 years they will all be from jazz. but if they hire 1000 then 800 will be from Jazz (at least)
The executive also mentioned there financial relief for AC if they hire above the 80% from Jazz.
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Re: Air Canada Pool
I think it's safe to say the hiring window on the AC website won't be activated anytime soon...
Re: Air Canada Pool
That's depressing. Go to University they said, the airlines like that. Seems a waste of time now. Wish I had started flying four years earlier and avoided all this...
Re: Air Canada Pool
The university degree may be your key to get hired from the 20% that will still be hired off the street
Re: Air Canada Pool
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Last edited by arcadia on Thu Feb 12, 2015 7:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Air Canada Pool
Their pay will be subsidized by Jazz for first 4 years with the intent that after 4 years they should be making similar/close to previous salary. (or at least something decent)arcadia wrote:How quickly is this flow through agreement supposed to take effect?
Also, what benefit is it to a Jazz Capt. Who waited forever to finally get a left seat job with with a decent salary to give it up to go to AC? Bigger metal?
However they will still have all the other negatives of being BOTL
Re: Air Canada Pool
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Last edited by AllClutch on Mon Jan 19, 2015 10:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Air Canada Pool
How are new f/o's frothing at the mouth here? Depending on how new you are, hypothetically you could have around 700-800 guy's ahead of you moving to AC. Sure you may have a better chance of getting hired at AC now with the minimum 80%, but a new F/O (5 years or less) at Jazz HAD a much better chance at getting hired at AC then say a Captain at Jazz (historically speaking). My take on the NEW TA, Seniority 1-500 at Jazz: Best off, 1001-1387: Worse off.arcadia wrote:How quickly is this flow through agreement supposed to take effect?
The weird thing to me is that this flow through is targeted at senior Jazz Capt's. I find it hilarious how new F/O's are frothing at the mouth for this agreement to be signed...newer Jazz F/o's are going to be stuck just as bad as the guy off the street, this is aimed at reducing cost up top at Jazz and driving the high paid guy over to another list at which they will be at the bottom of again with shit pay, for another 4 years. Also, what benefit is it to a Jazz Capt. Who waited forever to finally get a left seat job with with a decent salary to give it up to go to AC? Bigger metal?
Re: Air Canada Pool
[/quote]Their pay will be subsidized by Jazz for first 4 years with the intent that after 4 years they should be making similar/close to previous salary.[/quote]
Incorrect,
Their pay will be subsidized by Air Canada for the first four years.
Funds are coming from AC for this purpose, and are a part of new CPA. Confirmed at the first roadshow.
This should be very popular within ACPA.....
Incorrect,
Their pay will be subsidized by Air Canada for the first four years.
Funds are coming from AC for this purpose, and are a part of new CPA. Confirmed at the first roadshow.
This should be very popular within ACPA.....
Re: Air Canada Pool
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Last edited by arcadia on Thu Feb 12, 2015 7:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Air Canada Pool
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Last edited by arcadia on Thu Feb 12, 2015 7:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.