Which sh!tty operator is advertising internationally?

[digits_]

I do agree, things are not working here but I personally don't want the government doing any new jobs until they can at least do their current jobs properly. Civil servant jobs increased in numbers and salary exponentially yet their productivity has never been worse. They threw up their arms in protest when they were simply asked to COME TO WORK a mere 2 days per week. A joke.

That's rich coming from a guy getting paid a small fortune to go on vacation every day!

Let's not devolve into arguing about stereotypes. If the job can be done remotely there's no point in using the employees to dress up an otherwise useless office building.

[khedrei]

I do agree, things are not working here but I personally don't want the government doing any new jobs until they can at least do their current jobs properly. Civil servant jobs increased in numbers and salary exponentially yet their productivity has never been worse. They threw up their arms in protest when they were simply asked to COME TO WORK a mere 2 days

That's rich coming from a guy getting paid a small fortune to go on vacation every day!

Care to explain?

If you're going to make accusations like that, you'll have to back them up.

[theacolyte]

Wait, you don't think the standard of living in Canada has declined in the last 15-20 years?

I think it has declined. I disagree with the analysis that this has been significantly influenced by one side of the political spectrum.

Europe has a variety of countries, each with a different type of government, and the majority of the countries are experiencing very similar issues. Some worse, some better.

A major benefit of Canada though is that you can likely fairly easily improve your situation. The hardest hit areas are Toronto and Vancouver. Move to a rural prairie town, and your housing costs will get decimated. That's an option most Europeans don't have, as a lot of areas don't have rural towns left.

Here's a thought experiment: assuming visas and work permits aren't an issue, where would you move to to improve your situation? Where would you suggest young working class Canadians move to to improve theirs?

You should go visit Europe. There’s A LOT of rural area and small towns.

I laughed when I read that. There’s a ton of great and inexpensive places to live in Europe.

[digits_]

I do agree, things are not working here but I personally don't want the government doing any new jobs until they can at least do their current jobs properly. Civil servant jobs increased in numbers and salary exponentially yet their productivity has never been worse. They threw up their arms in protest when they were simply asked to COME TO WORK a mere 2 days

That's rich coming from a guy getting paid a small fortune to go on vacation every day!

Care to explain?

If you're going to make accusations like that, you'll have to back them up.

It's not an accusation. It's a stereotype how the public sometimes looks at pilots: getting paid a fortune to just go on vacation. It's as incorrect as your stereotype that government employees don't want to work.

[khedrei]

That's rich coming from a guy getting paid a small fortune to go on vacation every day!

Care to explain?

If you're going to make accusations like that, you'll have to back them up.

It's not an accusation. It's a stereotype how the public sometimes looks at pilots: getting paid a fortune to just go on vacation. It's as incorrect as your stereotype that government employees don't want to work.

It's not a stereotype that government employees didn't want to come back to the office. It's a fact. There are plenty of reports of these workers not wanting to come in to the office for 2 days per week. It's also a fact that civil servant jobs were increased in number by 40% over the last few years. Also a fact that they make more than the private sector and have more time off.

As for them not doing their job, do you believe we are getting real productivity from federal workers?? From everything that I have seen, and many articles I have read, wait times for services has really never been worse. People waiting over a year to get a medical. Healthcare (yes it's provincial) has never been in worse shape. Yes it's been bad for years, but it's worse now. Not enough doctors and nurses, yet we have administrators coming out the wazoo. Billshit jobs that don't produce anything.

More civil servants making more money producing less. That's a fact.

[digits_]

Care to explain?

If you're going to make accusations like that, you'll have to back them up.

It's not an accusation. It's a stereotype how the public sometimes looks at pilots: getting paid a fortune to just go on vacation. It's as incorrect as your stereotype that government employees don't want to work.

It's not a stereotype that government employees didn't want to come back to the office. It's a fact. There are plenty of reports of these workers not wanting to come in to the office for 2 days per week. It's also a fact that civil servant jobs were increased in number by 40% over the last few years. Also a fact that they make more than the private sector and have more time off.

As for them not doing their job, do you believe we are getting real productivity from federal workers?? From everything that I have seen, and many articles I have read, wait times for services has really never been worse. People waiting over a year to get a medical. Healthcare (yes it's provincial) has never been in worse shape. Yes it's been bad for years, but it's worse now. Not enough doctors and nurses, yet we have administrators coming out the wazoo. Billshit jobs that don't produce anything.

More civil servants making more money producing less. That's a fact.

You wrote:

I do agree, things are not working here but I personally don't want the government doing any new jobs until they can at least do their current jobs properly. Civil servant jobs increased in numbers and salary exponentially yet their productivity has never been worse. They threw up their arms in protest when they were simply asked to COME TO WORK a mere 2 days per week. A joke.

That they can't do their current job and their productivity is bad. Sure seems like some stereotyping. Definitely not a fact. I don't know what they do exactly, so I'm not comfortable saying they aren't productive. If you experience their service as slow, their could be multiple reasons for that. They could be overworked, micromanaged or slow workers.

More civil servants making more money producing less. That's a fact.

Not a fact at all. And very hard to verify, possibly irrelevant. How do you value 'verifying if an applicant meets TC standards'? Government workers don't necessarily produce. They verify and govern.

But hey, at least they spend 8 hours a day on work. Those pesky pilots fly for 10 minutes and then the plane flies itself on autopilot. Why are we paying them to do nothing??

[khedrei]

It's not an accusation. It's a stereotype how the public sometimes looks at pilots: getting paid a fortune to just go on vacation. It's as incorrect as your stereotype that government employees don't want to work.

It's not a stereotype that government employees didn't want to come back to the office. It's a fact. There are plenty of reports of these workers not wanting to come in to the office for 2 days per week. It's also a fact that civil servant jobs were increased in number by 40% over the last few years. Also a fact that they make more than the private sector and have more time off.

As for them not doing their job, do you believe we are getting real productivity from federal workers?? From everything that I have seen, and many articles I have read, wait times for services has really never been worse. People waiting over a year to get a medical. Healthcare (yes it's provincial) has never been in worse shape. Yes it's been bad for years, but it's worse now. Not enough doctors and nurses, yet we have administrators coming out the wazoo. Billshit jobs that don't produce anything.

More civil servants making more money producing less. That's a fact.

You wrote:

I do agree, things are not working here but I personally don't want the government doing any new jobs until they can at least do their current jobs properly. Civil servant jobs increased in numbers and salary exponentially yet their productivity has never been worse. They threw up their arms in protest when they were simply asked to COME TO WORK a mere 2 days per week. A joke.

That they can't do their current job and their productivity is bad. Sure seems like some stereotyping. Definitely not a fact. I don't know what they do exactly, so I'm not comfortable saying they aren't productive. If you experience their service as slow, their could be multiple reasons for that. They could be overworked, micromanaged or slow workers.

More civil servants making more money producing less. That's a fact.

Not a fact at all. And very hard to verify, possibly irrelevant. How do you value 'verifying if an applicant meets TC standards'? Government workers don't necessarily produce. They verify and govern.

But hey, at least they spend 8 hours a day on work. Those pesky pilots fly for 10 minutes and then the plane flies itself on autopilot. Why are we paying them to do nothing??

Yeah... those people waiting over a year to get an expired medical... unappreciative jerks.

Civil service jobs and salaries are very easy to verify. The numbers have increased huge since trudeau took office.
And whether or not their jobs can be done from home or not is irrelevant (In this case I'd say they clearly can't because the work isn't getting done) but if your boss tells you to start coming back to the office when that's what you were hired to do, if you don't show up, you should be fired.

In all your nonsense you do make a good point though, remove all that excess money from pilots, give it to civil servants since they are so valuable!

[digits_]

Civil service jobs and salaries are very easy to verify. The numbers have increased huge since trudeau took office.

The cost can be verified, the output can not be verified by us. We don't know if their jobs have gotten harder or easier. The output we see (medical processing times for example) is not necessarily an indication of their output. If their managers/bosses/political leaders have decided they would need to verify 20 points per applicants instead of 10 (just a random fictional example to illustrate), their output would halve if they maintain their efficiency. Is that what's happening? I don't know. Do you? Unless we know for sure, I'd prefer it if we don't start badmouthing any employee.

Every TC employee I've dealt with has been very correct and quick to respond. But yes, some things do take a while. However I certainly don't have the impression they are being inefficient.

And whether or not their jobs can be done from home or not is irrelevant (In this case I'd say they clearly can't because the work isn't getting done) but if your boss tells you to start coming back to the office when that's what you were hired to do, if you don't show up, you should be fired.

Do we remember the topic of Flair where pilots were recommending to call in fatigued because they didn't like doing the standups/red eye flights, even though they fell within the scope of their contract and the regulations? Should we fire them too?

If the employer wants their employees to do something that they don't like, for no other reason than 'I prefer it this way', it's an ego trip and the employees have every right to make a fuzz. Try to take any perk away from any employee group, especially unionized ones, and see how that goes.

[khedrei]

Civil service jobs and salaries are very easy to verify. The numbers have increased huge since trudeau took office.

The cost can be verified, the output can not be verified by us. We don't know if their jobs have gotten harder or easier. The output we see (medical processing times for example) is not necessarily an indication of their output. If their managers/bosses/political leaders have decided they would need to verify 20 points per applicants instead of 10 (just a random fictional example to illustrate), their output would halve if they maintain their efficiency. Is that what's happening? I don't know. Do you? Unless we know for sure, I'd prefer it if we don't start badmouthing any employee.

Every TC employee I've dealt with has been very correct and quick to respond. But yes, some things do take a while. However I certainly don't have the impression they are being inefficient.

And whether or not their jobs can be done from home or not is irrelevant (In this case I'd say they clearly can't because the work isn't getting done) but if your boss tells you to start coming back to the office when that's what you were hired to do, if you don't show up, you should be fired.

Do we remember the topic of Flair where pilots were recommending to call in fatigued because they didn't like doing the standups/red eye flights, even though they fell within the scope of their contract and the regulations? Should we fire them too?

If the employer wants their employees to do something that they don't like, for no other reason than 'I prefer it this way', it's an ego trip and the employees have every right to make a fuzz. Try to take any perk away from any employee group, especially unionized ones, and see how that goes.

You're seriously going to try and compare flair pilots being worked till the max of their contract on red eye turns and being fatiqued for working overnight with federal workers having to COME TO WORK on a 9-5 job???

I get it now. You're the mother of all trolls. This was my fault. I should have known better.

[Old fella]

Back in the ‘90s at HQ & Regional level I sat on a few interview boards for external hiring for ANSR branch. It was quite surprising what was presented on paper and what was in front of us during the interview process. Some who applied didn’t get through the screen process, and as well many were not successful at the interview. Certainly can’t speak now but that was then.

Off topic, however since some “ common- taters” chimed in on TC, I pontificated my lowly two cents worth since I spent 10 yrs there in various ANSR positions. Got to see plenty, most of it quite positive.

[digits_]

You're seriously going to try and compare flair pilots being worked till the max of their contract on red eye turns and being fatiqued for working overnight with federal workers having to COME TO WORK on a 9-5 job???

Compare it? No. I used to illustrate that your statement -if I may paraphrase- 'it's part of your job, do it without complaining or get fired' is a bit short-sighted. Perhaps refusing to go to the office might be worth firing the workers over, perhaps not. The fact that they don't want to return to the office in itself is not enough information for you or me to go on. It's mainly a discussion between the employer and employee, and it should revolve around the question "is the work being done" not "where is the work taking place".

In a time where aviation workers are fighting for better conditions, it's not a good look to judge other workers who are trying to improve their situation.

[khedrei]

You're right. Very hard to measure productivity. We just dont know....1 year for TC medical. 12 hour wait times in the ER. Building permit delays. Yes I am aware not all of these are federal.

The people in charge of these office workers who want them back in the office have no idea if the people working from home are doing their jobs efficiently or getting normal amounts of work done. The decision to bring them back was completely punitive. They just wanted to stick it to them. Disrupt their work like balance and force them to commute and spend time away from their families.

It all makes sense now.

[digits_]

The people in charge of these office workers who want them back in the office have no idea if the people working from home are doing their jobs efficiently or getting normal amounts of work done.

They know. You and I don't.

The decision to bring them back was completely punitive. They just wanted to stick it to them. Disrupt their work like balance and force them to commute and spend time away from their families.

It all makes sense now.

You've never worked in an office, have you? You underestimate the power hunger of (middle) management. Productivity is way down the list of reasons why workers would have to return to the office. For government jobs, 'how does it look', is likely on the top, as proven by this discussion.

You're right. Very hard to measure productivity. We just dont know....1 year for TC medical. 12 hour wait times in the ER. Building permit delays. Yes I am aware not all of these are federal.

Do you honestly think working from home has any effect on ER waiting times