YTZ Flying

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Understated
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Re: YTZ Flying

Post by Understated »

Johnny767 wrote:Unfortunately this Scope issue has turned into Base and Color Politics. As all the same old players expose their hate-on for the YVR LEC.
I found it very interesting, at the YYZ Council meeting this week, listening to my colleagues traipsing to the microphone and telling the LEC that the MEC better not issue a vote on the YTZ flying saying, "Do you approve of the MEC's decision on how to proceed?" Those guys told the LEC not to give us biased information and expect us to vote yea or nay. Give us non-biased information, then let us make up our own minds, based on the facts, they said.

I was sitting there, listening to a very reasonable request to be fully informed with accurate information before voting, about a direction that the union was about to take that would have a long-term impact on me.

Then I thought about the age 60 vote, in 2006. Do you remember the question on the vote? Here it is:

"Do you support the MEC’s position to maintain the Age 60 retirement provisions?"

Nobody stood up then, at any meeting, asking for unbiased information. And nobody has stood up since then, demanding independent, unbiased information. And all of those who could have given us a counter-balancing viewpoint, based on the facts, have since been either silenced or excommunicated.

Nobody at the meeting this week appeared to connect the dots regarding making independent, considered decisions on the basis of all the relevant facts related to the scope question now before us and the age question before us then.

Yet the 2006 chickens are now coming home to roost.
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bcflyer
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Re: YTZ Flying

Post by bcflyer »

This discussion has nothing to do with Age 60 or the whole Red/Blue crap. Quit stirring the pot and please get back to the topic.
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Localizer
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Re: YTZ Flying

Post by Localizer »

I don't think he's trying to stir the pot .. more or less comparing the present vote to the past vote and the information being given on said subjects during meetings? .. Maybe i'm wrong .. but i'll give him the benefit of the doubt.

:wink:
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Understated
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Re: YTZ Flying

Post by Understated »

Localizer wrote:I don't think he's trying to stir the pot .. more or less comparing the present vote to the past vote and the information being given on said subjects during meetings?
Thank you. My post was not directly about age 60. It was about the role of the leadership of the union in conducting votes of "informed" members. The votes are used to essentially "lock in" the union's direction on any particular critical issue, and the question is legitimate. What role should the leadership play first, in providing complete, unbiased information, and second, in soliciting direction from its membership?

That issue was definitely on the mind of those at the meeting this week who cautioned the LEC about "tainting" the voting process in two ways--first, providing limited or biased information, and second, taking a position on the issue that could obviously influence the outcome of the vote.

I simply found the question to be relevant to more than just the present scope debate and puzzled that no-one else there seemed the least bit concerned about the same issue in the age 60 context, given the equally intrusive effect of that issue on our scope, albeit internal scope--namely, who operates our flights? Nobody has ever expressed much concern about the 2006 tainted vote, or the lack of information provided on that issue, especially recently. What is so different about this issue?
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Johnny767
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Re: YTZ Flying

Post by Johnny767 »

bcflyer wrote:This discussion has nothing to do with Age 60 or the whole Red/Blue crap. Quit stirring the pot and please get back to the topic.
bcflyer:

Everything (unfortunately) for the majority of the Toronto and Montreal LEC's is about 'red/blue' - 'YVR verse YYZ' crap. The MEC is being run by "Winnipeg ... west" and Toronto has been completely sidelined and guess what - they don't like it very much?

Because - they are a "one issue" LEC.

Standby for them to attempt to hijack the "Age 60" issue as a "Major Corporate Event" and put Seniority on the front burner.

Until these guys are given the boot from the Toronto LEC, nothing is going to change.

Get vocal, ask the questions and most importantly read between the lines with these guys.

Now, I'm with you, back to "Scope."
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Black Cat
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Re: YTZ Flying

Post by Black Cat »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RayMaswju1A


A rumor I heard from a current sktyservice pilots is if the q400 contract goes well they will be looking at operating E70's , which will be bad for both of our groups.
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ng78
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Re: YTZ Flying

Post by ng78 »

I wouldn't count on that, I doubt the scope clause would allow this to happen. The big question in my mind is whether they will get back into the charter market and operate Airbus or Boeing aircraft for the Brits again.

Black Cat wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RayMaswju1A


A rumor I heard from a current sktyservice pilots is if the q400 contract goes well they will be looking at operating E70's , which will be bad for both of our groups.
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Jack Klumpus
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Re: YTZ Flying

Post by Jack Klumpus »

ng78 wrote:I wouldn't count on that, I doubt the scope clause would allow this to happen. The big question in my mind is whether they will get back into the charter market and operate Airbus or Boeing aircraft for the Brits again.
You're confusing the two different SkyService companies.
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ng78
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Re: YTZ Flying

Post by ng78 »

Jack Klumpus wrote:You're confusing the two different SkyService companies.
Trust me, the Skyservice brand name does not confuse me :) You're forgetting who Russ Payson is, and also that Jazz is now operating 757's for Thomas Cook. Never under-estimate the ability of Russ to get back some of the charter work he once did.
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Jack Klumpus
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Re: YTZ Flying

Post by Jack Klumpus »

The statement you made was talking about skyservice flying for Brits again, implied that skyservice business flew 757 for the Brits, or that the people running SkyRegional, are the same from SkyService (defunct) airline.

Neither of those cases are true.
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ng78
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Re: YTZ Flying

Post by ng78 »

Jack Klumpus wrote:The statement you made was talking about skyservice flying for Brits again, implied that skyservice business flew 757 for the Brits, or that the people running SkyRegional, are the same from SkyService (defunct) airline.

Neither of those cases are true.
Actually, all of the above are true. The folks running Sky Regional are all from Skyservice Airlines, with the exception of a small number of people from the FBO. I therefore stand by my statement and wonder if they will be after any charter work in the coming years. The people involved know that business far better than they know how to run a regional airline.
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Takeoff OK
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Re: YTZ Flying

Post by Takeoff OK »

Am I missing something? Has the issue been decided?

...never mind. found it.
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Johnny767
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Re: YTZ Flying

Post by Johnny767 »

Standby for them to attempt to hijack the "Age 60" issue as a "Major Corporate Event" and put Seniority on the front burner.


Well boys...as promised.
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