Radio ?

Tamago · Post by **Tamago** » Tue Nov 08, 2005 7:15 pm

Hi,

I'm studying for my radio license and noticed that operators must keep radio messages secret.

Is this just in Canada?

I'm wondering because I've come across websites where you can listen to live ATC feeds. Wouldn't that be a violation and subject to fine?

switchflicker · Post by **switchflicker** » Tue Nov 08, 2005 7:18 pm

Could you tell us what radio licence you are studying for?

mellow_pilot · Post by **mellow_pilot** » Tue Nov 08, 2005 7:20 pm

How are radio messages secret? If that's true then I'm in trouble for listening in. I think you may have misread something.

N2 · Post by N2 » Tue Nov 08, 2005 7:24 pm

Damn, all this time I've been busting the rules!

Airtids · Post by **Airtids** » Tue Nov 08, 2005 7:47 pm

In times of war, if a radio transmission is overheard, you are to keep it to yourself. Reason being that you may have intercepted a transmission from 'our' side that needs secrecy. Not really sure how applicable that reg is nowadays, though

.

ice ice baby · Post by **ice ice baby** » Tue Nov 08, 2005 7:53 pm

I'm not about to look it up but I'll give you my interpretation of it. It is "illegal" to talk about what you heard on the radio. The people with these websites are only listening to the radio so they might not even have a Radio Operators Certificate and then broadcasting it on the internet. Now they might get into more trouble if someone could had proof that they didn't get a job because of something in those archives. Also putting somebodies last words on the internet shortly after they have crashed might also get them in hot water in court over those "secrets" been divulged.

grimey · Post by **grimey** » Tue Nov 08, 2005 8:41 pm

mellow_pilot wrote:How are radio messages secret? If that's true then I'm in trouble for listening in. I think you may have misread something.

No, you can listen to whatever you want, privately. You just can't put it on loudspeakers for everyone to hear, retransmit it, use it for profit, etc.

hazatude · Post by **hazatude** » Tue Nov 08, 2005 8:49 pm

Loose lips sink ships...

BTD · Post by **BTD** » Tue Nov 08, 2005 8:50 pm

It is true. Unless for an emergency you are to keep other people's broadcasts to yourself. Unless they request a relay or something. Its in the radio study guide, I was looking at it the other day because I have some students who just wrote the exam.

Radio operators and all persons who become acquainted with radiocommunications are bound to preserve the secrecy of communications. No person shall divulge the contents, or
even the existence, of communications transmitted, received or intercepted by a radio station, except to the addressee of the message or his accredited agent, or to properly authorized officials of the Government of Canada or a competent legal tribunal, or an operator of a telecommunications system as is necessary for the furtherance of delivery of the communication. These restrictions do not apply to a message of distress, urgency, safety or to messages addressed to "ALL STATIONS", that is, weather reports, storm warnings, etc.

Here is a link to the guide

http://strategis.ic.gc.ca/epic/internet ... /ric21.pdf

Lommer · Post by **Lommer** » Tue Nov 08, 2005 8:53 pm

Exactly as grimey says, you can listen to ATC, you can let your friend without a licence listen to ATC, but you cannot go to your friend who wasn't listening and hand him a transcript of what you heard. Nor can you use what you heard on the radio for profit. The same goes for any radio frequency, including those used by emergency services.

tom · Post by **tom** » Wed Nov 09, 2005 2:38 pm

Is it possible to listen ATC frequencies throught the computer.

If yes do you have a web link

Ralliart · Post by **Ralliart** » Wed Nov 09, 2005 2:43 pm

http://www.liveatc.net/feedindex.php?type=all

Tamago · Post by **Tamago** » Wed Nov 09, 2005 6:42 pm

"No person shall divulge the contents, or
even the existence, of communications transmitted, received or intercepted by a radio station, except to the addressee of the message or his accredited agent,..."

That's exactly what I read too. So, aren't these web sites devulging the contents and existence of communications? If not, I'm confused.

If so, do they just run these sites and pay the fines? I can't see how they could do that profitably.

ice ice baby · Post by **ice ice baby** » Wed Nov 09, 2005 6:47 pm

They could run the site from a far and distant land and canada can't do anything about that. Then again maybe the government just can't be bothered to enforce it as everyone talks about the emergency they heard on the radio today.

mellow_pilot · Post by **mellow_pilot** » Wed Nov 09, 2005 11:47 pm

That law has to be ancient. How many time have you guys been sitting around a hangar and said, "no shit, he comes on the radio and says..."

Over the Horn · Post by **Over the Horn** » Thu Nov 10, 2005 6:32 pm

I forgot I even had a radio licence

Tamago · Post by **Tamago** » Fri Nov 11, 2005 7:10 pm

That law has to be ancient. How many time have you guys been sitting around a hangar and said, "no shit, he comes on the radio and says..."

Well, it's in the current study guide.

fingersmac · Post by **fingersmac** » Fri Nov 11, 2005 11:01 pm

yup.. it's in the current study guide alright. i just wrote that exam 1.5 months ago.

scubasteve · Post by **scubasteve** » Sat Nov 12, 2005 8:35 pm

I'm not even sure of the relevance of the radio licence these days. In my experience in forestry, search and rescue, firefighting and ski patrol where radio use is very common and necessary, a license isnt even considered. The principles are there however since the use of names is discouraged as is mentioning the details of a dead or injured body and roger dodger is not an official term.

Lommer · Post by **Lommer** » Sat Nov 12, 2005 11:22 pm

Well, the law is pretty old, but it is still current. I believe that the websites in question operate either under a rebroadcasting clause, or that Industry Canada just doesn't give a shit and doesn't enforce anything. I've been a HAM for several years and I also have my maritime ticket, and contrary to fingersmac's post, people do care. Your aeronautical ticket will be required if you ever want to work the ramp... Also if you ever work for the government doing marine work (coast guard, enviro surveys, etc) they'll require your maritime ticket. There's a lot of companies out there that I'm sure don't care though. As far as enforcement goes, the only time I've seen IC ever take any action whatsoever is when some illegally-imported asian radiophones were interfering with the west van police dept frequencies. Prior to that, those same radiophones had been causing havoc on amateur frequencies for ages and despite many complaints IC did jack all. I'm pretty certain that as long as you don't interfere with gov't or really important commercial interests they won't make the effort to prosecute you for even the most serious transgressions.