Helicopters 2020 Season

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PitchLink
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Helicopters 2020 Season

Post by PitchLink »

How’s everyone making out this season? No fires and monsoons from northern Ontario through to the pacific.... Some burns in Quebec but not much. Few guys doing spray in The Maritimes. That’s what I know, me I’m steady but not busy...
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helicopterray
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Re: Helicopters 2020 Season

Post by helicopterray »

Got let go a few weeks ago. Waiting for something to happen. Anything. Anywhere. Haven't seen it this bad since the 80's.
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PitchLink
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Re: Helicopters 2020 Season

Post by PitchLink »

helicopterray wrote: Tue Jul 21, 2020 3:44 pm Got let go a few weeks ago. Waiting for something to happen. Anything. Anywhere. Haven't seen it this bad since the 80's.
I agree it’s dismal, hopefully a late summer and dry things up a bit.... you east or west?
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helicopterray
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Re: Helicopters 2020 Season

Post by helicopterray »

Western.
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AngelsSang
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Re: Helicopters 2020 Season

Post by AngelsSang »

It was by far the busiest year I ever had. Probably because I am so small, it doesn't take much to be busy. Planning to add another machine, and 3 more employees within the next 18 months.
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PitchLink
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Re: Helicopters 2020 Season

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AngelsSang wrote: Mon Jan 04, 2021 7:04 pm It was by far the busiest year I ever had. Probably because I am so small, it doesn't take much to be busy. Planning to add another machine, and 3 more employees within the next 18 months.
That’s great and yes small operators that have their niche are doing well. I’m a small company as well and my niche carried on and expanded too. Big operators seem to be bleeding to death however...
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crosstube
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Re: Helicopters 2020 Season

Post by crosstube »

I am glad to know some operators did ok this year. Some others, not to good. I won't complain on my side, I did OK even if I didn't fly as much as I would have liked. Hope this year things comes back.

JD
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AngelsSang
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Re: Helicopters 2020 Season

Post by AngelsSang »

PitchLink wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 11:02 am
AngelsSang wrote: Mon Jan 04, 2021 7:04 pm It was by far the busiest year I ever had. Probably because I am so small, it doesn't take much to be busy. Planning to add another machine, and 3 more employees within the next 18 months.
That’s great and yes small operators that have their niche are doing well. I’m a small company as well and my niche carried on and expanded too. Big operators seem to be bleeding to death however...
Three operators here have closed over the past 7 years, one was poor management, one terrible customer service, and the last was shut down by authorities for running drugs and alcohol. The biggest operation left in the area, I doubt will survive another 3 years, they seem to be in trouble. Fully expect a future of about 3 to 5 new helicopter companies opening, but all smaller and specialized. Once they seem to get big here, they lose control of their quality, customer service, and if things slow down at all, they can't handle the payroll and overhead for any amount of time at all. Also far too many seem to be stuck in the year 1960 from the machines that they have in their fleet. Seems like a lot better plan to have 3 to 6 modern machines, that are perfect for the tasks asked of them, and a nice staff who act professionally. Owners/management know their employees, and are actually around sometimes. They don't live 1500 kms away, visit once a year for 2 days, and they have no clue who works for them, or what is truly going on. Once an employee becomes just a number, many won't give a crap what they do. Everything is done to bare minimums, from training, to even how they treat a customer.
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PitchLink
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Re: Helicopters 2020 Season

Post by PitchLink »

AngelsSang wrote: Wed Jan 06, 2021 10:36 pm
PitchLink wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 11:02 am
AngelsSang wrote: Mon Jan 04, 2021 7:04 pm It was by far the busiest year I ever had. Probably because I am so small, it doesn't take much to be busy. Planning to add another machine, and 3 more employees within the next 18 months.
That’s great and yes small operators that have their niche are doing well. I’m a small company as well and my niche carried on and expanded too. Big operators seem to be bleeding to death however...
Three operators here have closed over the past 7 years, one was poor management, one terrible customer service, and the last was shut down by authorities for running drugs and alcohol. The biggest operation left in the area, I doubt will survive another 3 years, they seem to be in trouble. Fully expect a future of about 3 to 5 new helicopter companies opening, but all smaller and specialized. Once they seem to get big here, they lose control of their quality, customer service, and if things slow down at all, they can't handle the payroll and overhead for any amount of time at all. Also far too many seem to be stuck in the year 1960 from the machines that they have in their fleet. Seems like a lot better plan to have 3 to 6 modern machines, that are perfect for the tasks asked of them, and a nice staff who act professionally. Owners/management know their employees, and are actually around sometimes. They don't live 1500 kms away, visit once a year for 2 days, and they have no clue who works for them, or what is truly going on. Once an employee becomes just a number, many won't give a crap what they do. Everything is done to bare minimums, from training, to even how they treat a customer.
I’m guessing you’re in BC, yes there will be several more closing the doors this year I think. Agree about the large operators most can close shop with this pandemic I think
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AngelsSang
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Re: Helicopters 2020 Season

Post by AngelsSang »

PitchLink wrote: Thu Jan 07, 2021 10:34 pm
AngelsSang wrote: Wed Jan 06, 2021 10:36 pm
PitchLink wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 11:02 am

That’s great and yes small operators that have their niche are doing well. I’m a small company as well and my niche carried on and expanded too. Big operators seem to be bleeding to death however...
Three operators here have closed over the past 7 years, one was poor management, one terrible customer service, and the last was shut down by authorities for running drugs and alcohol. The biggest operation left in the area, I doubt will survive another 3 years, they seem to be in trouble. Fully expect a future of about 3 to 5 new helicopter companies opening, but all smaller and specialized. Once they seem to get big here, they lose control of their quality, customer service, and if things slow down at all, they can't handle the payroll and overhead for any amount of time at all. Also far too many seem to be stuck in the year 1960 from the machines that they have in their fleet. Seems like a lot better plan to have 3 to 6 modern machines, that are perfect for the tasks asked of them, and a nice staff who act professionally. Owners/management know their employees, and are actually around sometimes. They don't live 1500 kms away, visit once a year for 2 days, and they have no clue who works for them, or what is truly going on. Once an employee becomes just a number, many won't give a crap what they do. Everything is done to bare minimums, from training, to even how they treat a customer.
I’m guessing you’re in BC, yes there will be several more closing the doors this year I think. Agree about the large operators most can close shop with this pandemic I think
Correct, central BC. A certain terribly run group, got big, then got sloppy and rude, its not doing very well. I won't name it, that would be rude. Their big pile of junk aka ancient 206 garbage should be auctioned off really cheap before too long I suspect. Now if only I could figure out why on earth anyone would buy a 206. Oh sure maybe in 1969, before I was born, but not in 2021.
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Heliian
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Re: Helicopters 2020 Season

Post by Heliian »

AngelsSang wrote: Fri Jan 08, 2021 12:22 am

Correct, central BC. A certain terribly run group, got big, then got sloppy and rude, its not doing very well. I won't name it, that would be rude. Their big pile of junk aka ancient 206 garbage should be auctioned off really cheap before too long I suspect. Now if only I could figure out why on earth anyone would buy a 206. Oh sure maybe in 1969, before I was born, but not in 2021.
Have some respect for the 206 series. I would take a 206 over any robinson junk anyday. The AS350 series is still going strong.

What do you offer as a replacement?
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PitchLink
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Re: Helicopters 2020 Season

Post by PitchLink »

Heliian wrote: Fri Jan 08, 2021 6:29 am
AngelsSang wrote: Fri Jan 08, 2021 12:22 am

Correct, central BC. A certain terribly run group, got big, then got sloppy and rude, its not doing very well. I won't name it, that would be rude. Their big pile of junk aka ancient 206 garbage should be auctioned off really cheap before too long I suspect. Now if only I could figure out why on earth anyone would buy a 206. Oh sure maybe in 1969, before I was born, but not in 2021.
Have some respect for the 206 series. I would take a 206 over any robinson junk anyday. The AS350 series is still going strong.

What do you offer as a replacement?
Airbus is expecting a replacement for the h125 (350) for 2026. We will see what that looks like, the 505 is supposed to replace the 206. I have limited experience with them but they’re selling lots in the USA
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Heliian
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Re: Helicopters 2020 Season

Post by Heliian »

PitchLink wrote: Fri Jan 08, 2021 6:55 am the 505 is supposed to replace the 206
The 505 has the same drivetrain as a longdog. The arrius is decades old. The cabin is a huge improvement, fancier panel. Bell is way behind in general.

Even though the AS350 is an old design, it's been improved quite a bit over the years and is a proven workhorse. The EC120 was a flop and the 130 is a fishbowled as350 with less tail authority.
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PitchLink
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Re: Helicopters 2020 Season

Post by PitchLink »

Heliian wrote: Fri Jan 08, 2021 7:20 am
PitchLink wrote: Fri Jan 08, 2021 6:55 am the 505 is supposed to replace the 206
The 505 has the same drivetrain as a longdog. The arrius is decades old. The cabin is a huge improvement, fancier panel. Bell is way behind in general.

Even though the AS350 is an old design, it's been improved quite a bit over the years and is a proven workhorse. The EC120 was a flop and the 130 is a fishbowled as350 with less tail authority.
I agree and am well versed on everything you’ve stated. The latest B3E >2015 with the newer canopies are great, I think that may be the last from airbus improvement until the types retirement. That said, the 2026 predicted replacement was pre Covid-19 and things may well change. The 350 has been my paycheque for nearly 20 years and is still great I agree. It’s only downfall is it doesn’t crash well, but not many helicopters do LOL
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Re: Helicopters 2020 Season

Post by AngelsSang »

I would take a 66 over a 505 at the same price, but then factor in the 40% less cost, lower insurance rates, ability to have MUCH better range with the slip tank option in the baggage area, and much better customer service ( Bell sucks IMO) give me a 66, please, and thanks. I spent 2 years flying a 206 as well, hated them all, they had 4 of them, all 4 sucked.
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Re: Helicopters 2020 Season

Post by The Mole »

Universal/Lakelse, Highland, E&B. Are there more?
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Re: Helicopters 2020 Season

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The Mole wrote: Sat Jan 09, 2021 11:19 pm Universal/Lakelse, Highland, E&B. Are there more?
There will be, that list is just within 2020! Rumours of another 2-3 old larger companies cutting bases and becoming seasonal possibly closing, but those are rumours. This industry has been in a downward spiral since the last recession. Big operators slashing rates for the last ten years didn’t help a thing, COVID19 tipped the scale for lots of operators.

I think this industry will be left to smaller 1-10 machine operators that can weather the next few years of reduced flying caused by the pandemic and autonomous drones flooding the scene. Canada isn’t a booming market anymore and hasn’t been for some time, that’s said I’m sure exploration may pick up for anode/cathode material for newer batteries for electric transportation mildly.
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Re: Helicopters 2020 Season

Post by The Mole »

Dirt bags have small overheard, they will mostly survive. The norm will be as many employees on day rate contracts with no guarantees. It's already mostly that way for dirt bag outfits now.

The war on Canadas natural resources will continue, there will be survey and drills but I don't expect any kind of boom. Survey tech is always changing, that might go UAV in the future. Drills? @#$! i hate drills.
Who would invest in canada when every level government is against you. Even if it is to supply minerals for teslas.
Everyone seems to be banking on the climate emergency burning everything down. So far that's been a bad bet.
But an Industry bail out is just some ground lighting away.
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Heliian
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Re: Helicopters 2020 Season

Post by Heliian »

The Mole wrote: Sun Jan 10, 2021 11:42 am Dirt bags have small overheard, they will mostly survive. The norm will be as many employees on day rate contracts with no guarantees. It's already mostly that way for dirt bag outfits now.

The war on Canadas natural resources will continue, there will be survey and drills but I don't expect any kind of boom. Survey tech is always changing, that might go UAV in the future. Drills? @#$! i hate drills.
Who would invest in canada when every level government is against you. Even if it is to supply minerals for teslas.
Everyone seems to be banking on the climate emergency burning everything down. So far that's been a bad bet.
But an Industry bail out is just some ground lighting away.
Ya, like that guy in Quebec with a survey company who uses his private helicopter to do the surveys, no oc.
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Re: Helicopters 2020 Season

Post by The Mole »

There is private, then there's "private". Last i looked into it, it was easier to just get an OC then jump through the hoops of using a corporate heli for aerial work/taxi. But base on your tone, and in the great nation of k-beck, i assume he's just running it private, like an old guy with a C150 he's owned for 40 years and not a "private" corporate flight department.
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