My spouse is a 4 year FA at WJA and is contemplating applying for the FA job AC. Based in YVR and unwilling to move bases to YYZ or YUL which seems to be the bases for new hires at AC. We are in our early 30s and bilingual.
Any info or input would be appreciated. Pros and cons for staying at WJA or moving to AC. How long would it take to transfer to YVR? We’re looking down the road for the next 35-40 years. What do you guys think?
Which would you choose?
Moderators: sky's the limit, sepia, Sulako, North Shore
-
FOD_Vacuum
- Rank 4
- Posts: 294
- Joined: Wed Oct 02, 2013 8:54 am
-
flying4dollars
- Rank (9)
- Posts: 1298
- Joined: Mon Jul 09, 2007 8:56 am
Re: Which would you choose?
If unwilling to go to two of the most common new hire bases, why bother applying, or even contemplating? Is he/she at their desired base at WJA? If so, keep the 4 year seniority and stay put.FOD_Vacuum wrote: ↑Thu Oct 28, 2021 5:46 pm My spouse is a 4 year FA at WJA and is contemplating applying for the FA job AC. Based in YVR and unwilling to move bases to YYZ or YUL which seems to be the bases for new hires at AC. We are in our early 30s and bilingual.
Any info or input would be appreciated. Pros and cons for staying at WJA or moving to AC. How long would it take to transfer to YVR? We’re looking down the road for the next 35-40 years. What do you guys think?
Re: Which would you choose?
You guys are planing for the long term so the first thing which comes to my mind is retirement.
What are the pro and con between the companies for this matter ?
What are the pro and con between the companies for this matter ?
-
TalkingPie
- Rank 3
- Posts: 117
- Joined: Wed Nov 27, 2019 11:39 am
- Location: YUL
Re: Which would you choose?
I have knowledge of the cabin crew conditions at AC, although none for WJ.
Some things for your spouse to consider:
- Wage progression - starting from scratch at AC vs. continuing at WJ, how do they compare short- and long-term?
- Are they interested in becoming a service director? If so, how do those roles compare between the two airlines? At least at AC it could be a shorter path to a better salary.
- How important is it to have a choice in flights and days off? As a new hire at AC they'll be at the bottom of the totem pole for a while.
- Are they willing/able to learn a new route language that could be of benefit for better flying at AC?
- How do the pension and benefits compare between the two airlines? AC is likely tough to beat in this respect, although leaving after 4 years at WJ would surely have some negative implications on the pension.
- How are the working conditions? Which airline has the more crew-friendly cabin layouts and company culture?
- If commuting, how do the airlines compare in ease and cost of getting to your crew base? Having seniority at WJ vs new hire at AC is a consideration for pass travel, but at least for now AC has abolished their 6 month probationary period before getting the passes.
- Long term viability: Anything can happen, but I'd put my money on the government ensuring AC's survival more than WJ.
Some factors will be hard to predict, as they vary depending on changing circumstances. For example, sometimes a new hire could transfer to YVR nearly immediately (speaking French likely increases those odds considerably), sometimes it can take years. If it's a hard and fast "no" for commuting to YYZ or YUL even temporarily, I agree with flying4dollars that the prospects at AC aren't likely to be very good.
Notwithstanding what I wrote above, I find that airline people sometimes overstate the importance of "retirement." While the pension plan is an important factor, if the wages and other benefits are good enough, a person can create their own pension plan by investing wage income like normal people do.
If you want to ask about specifics regarding AC, you can PM me and I might be able to point you in the right direction.
Some things for your spouse to consider:
- Wage progression - starting from scratch at AC vs. continuing at WJ, how do they compare short- and long-term?
- Are they interested in becoming a service director? If so, how do those roles compare between the two airlines? At least at AC it could be a shorter path to a better salary.
- How important is it to have a choice in flights and days off? As a new hire at AC they'll be at the bottom of the totem pole for a while.
- Are they willing/able to learn a new route language that could be of benefit for better flying at AC?
- How do the pension and benefits compare between the two airlines? AC is likely tough to beat in this respect, although leaving after 4 years at WJ would surely have some negative implications on the pension.
- How are the working conditions? Which airline has the more crew-friendly cabin layouts and company culture?
- If commuting, how do the airlines compare in ease and cost of getting to your crew base? Having seniority at WJ vs new hire at AC is a consideration for pass travel, but at least for now AC has abolished their 6 month probationary period before getting the passes.
- Long term viability: Anything can happen, but I'd put my money on the government ensuring AC's survival more than WJ.
Some factors will be hard to predict, as they vary depending on changing circumstances. For example, sometimes a new hire could transfer to YVR nearly immediately (speaking French likely increases those odds considerably), sometimes it can take years. If it's a hard and fast "no" for commuting to YYZ or YUL even temporarily, I agree with flying4dollars that the prospects at AC aren't likely to be very good.
Notwithstanding what I wrote above, I find that airline people sometimes overstate the importance of "retirement." While the pension plan is an important factor, if the wages and other benefits are good enough, a person can create their own pension plan by investing wage income like normal people do.
If you want to ask about specifics regarding AC, you can PM me and I might be able to point you in the right direction.
Re: Which would you choose?
When one is going through a few companies shut down, it could be difficult to invest.
-
TalkingPie
- Rank 3
- Posts: 117
- Joined: Wed Nov 27, 2019 11:39 am
- Location: YUL
Re: Which would you choose?
I hate to be a Debbie Downer, but if the airline you work for shuts down, there's a good chance that your company pension plan won't play out quite as planned, either.
Re: Which would you choose?
No, that is not how it works. You don't count on the company pension plan. You save money as you go but when the company shuts down or lay off Covid), what do you do ? Well, you're going to use your saved money as CEWS is not going to do it. Neither are unqualified jobs.
All I am saying with a company like AC, you're more likely to end up with a decent pension.
All I am saying with a company like AC, you're more likely to end up with a decent pension.
Re: Which would you choose?
Not true with a defined contribution plan. That money is held by a third party and outside of the company. The bankruptcy of the airline will have zero effect on it. Much different than a defined benefit plan which no longer exists in aviation.TalkingPie wrote: ↑Sat Oct 30, 2021 4:07 pm I hate to be a Debbie Downer, but if the airline you work for shuts down, there's a good chance that your company pension plan won't play out quite as planned, either.
Re: Which would you choose?
Not always. Nortel is a good example. Company puts the pension wherever they want, then lose it, or pay it to themselves... Dishonest/illegal still leaves employees holding the bag.
