YVR Base Chair Recall

[Montroyal]

A friend of mine from the YVR Base showed me the "literature" from the Recall Vote.

Can someone from YVR explain to me how one side offers a professional document while the other can't seem to figure out how to write emails or communicate without personal attacks?

I actually feel dumber after reading that diatribe from the Base "Leadership" and its no wonder ACPA is in the mess it is in under these guys.

Can they just "move along" without this vote?

How embarrassing is it reading something my 12 years old daughter could have wrote on toilet paper while taking her post grade 7 class afternoon dump

[Loon-A-Tic]

Post it up so we can all have a chuckle or will I end up wasting good beer out my nose

[Sharklasers]

It’s on the ACPA website under the VCC,
Montroyals bias is showing, I think the councillors literature is a formatting nightmare and doesn’t adequately convince me of why we should turf the LeC members and what exactly they would do better if in charge. Many of their accusations are broad based and not backed up with facts or evidence and feel like ultra divisive populist politics. Whereas the response letter (which granted doesn’t look like it was written by a 14 year old with a MS PowerPoint subscription and untreated ADHD) effectively counters many of the accusations (which you interpret as person attacks?) and reads like it was written by experienced adults with a grasp on the realities we find ourselves in.

The accusation that the LEC members were asked to resign because they didn’t wholeheartedly hop on the ALPA train is disturbing as I now question whether the councillors could be trusted to take an objective and measured approach to an issue as important as that. The decision on whether we join ALPA or not should be made solely with the needs of AC pilots in mind and I don’t like the idea of silencing any dissenting opinions and replacing them more with hardcore ex-Jazz ALPA sycophants.

[elonmusk]

A friend of mine from the YVR Base showed me the "literature" from the Recall Vote.

Can someone from YVR explain to me how one side offers a professional document while the other can't seem to figure out how to write emails or communicate without personal attacks?

I actually feel dumber after reading that diatribe from the Base "Leadership" and its no wonder ACPA is in the mess it is in under these guys.

Can they just "move along" without this vote?

How embarrassing is it reading something my 12 years old daughter could have wrote on toilet paper while taking her post grade 7 class afternoon dump

Well notice how it was all written in 3rd person? They didn't even write it themselves.

[elonmusk]

It’s on the ACPA website under the VCC,
Montroyals bias is showing, I think the councillors literature is a formatting nightmare and doesn’t adequately convince me of why we should turf the LeC members and what exactly they would do better if in charge. Many of their accusations are broad based and not backed up with facts or evidence and feel like ultra divisive populist politics. Whereas the response letter (which granted doesn’t look like it was written by a 14 year old with a MS PowerPoint subscription and untreated ADHD) effectively counters many of the accusations (which you interpret as person attacks?) and reads like it was written by experienced adults with a grasp on the realities we find ourselves in.

What's broad about making baseless conflict of interest allegations just so they can delay MEC business?

And yes two have openly admitted their accusations had no merit and we're done to delay. YUL Chair openly admitted it at their base meeting and YVR Chair the same but "unofficially" through texts. They need to go we deserve better.

[elonmusk]

The accusation that the LEC members were asked to resign because they didn’t wholeheartedly hop on the ALPA train is disturbing as I now question whether the councillors could be trusted to take an objective and measured approach to an issue as important as that. The decision on whether we join ALPA or not should be made solely with the needs of AC pilots in mind and I don’t like the idea of silencing any dissenting opinions and replacing them more with hardcore ex-Jazz ALPA sycophants.

Based on my info, this is an outright lie. Pick up the phone, call one of the Councillors and ask them if this is true. (It's not).

[Sharklasers]

Based on my info, this is an outright lie. Pick up the phone, call one of the Councillors and ask them if this is true. (It's not).

Based on my info, it’s not.
Your welcome to pick up the phone and call one of the LEC reps now currently under attack or better yet one of the dozens of committee chairs and volunteers who were or are about to be unceremoniously turfed by the P4C reps.

[elonmusk]

Based on my info, this is an outright lie. Pick up the phone, call one of the Councillors and ask them if this is true. (It's not).

Based on my info, it’s not.

Trying to make this about ALPA is quite literally a perfect example of the "distraction" the Councillors talk about in their letter. The Chair and Vice-Chair are trying to deflect what this recall is about, and it's not about ALPA. It's about their track record, and complete lack of regard for listening to the membership in their base. Stonewalling the new overwhelmingly 5 duly elected Council members. It's about them paying nasty games at the MEC level to try to censure the NEMs. It's about their constant sell jobs and support for mediocre deals, and "managing expectations". If you spoke to all 5 Councillors, they would all say the same thing about ALPA. It is up to the members after the research as been done, not them. Not so different than what BM/QJ say in their own literature is it? ALPA was not the reason they asked them to resign. And if you hear otherwise, you're being lied to. Which is to be expected, the YVR Chair has a history of plying dirty when voting time comes around.

Edit; as for the turfed committee chairs, good riddance. Especially CMSC and negotiations. I know my views on this are popular. If you opened your eyes and looked around you might realize the same. The last election cycle has shown a desire for changing of the guard. And the "legacy" members of the MEC are taking their last grasps at trying to remain in power. Hence their conflict of interest bullshit.

[Winnikegger]

Having read both myself, pretty clear Sharklaser didn't read the Councilors stuff

The Base Chairs talk about "Personal Attacks" while going on the attack themselves. Then use trigger words like "ALPA" without any basis of truth. I messaged a Councilor about this and it is confirmed - a total LIE

This is about functioning Council. Not ALPA

My vote is with the side that knows how to send an email vice the other that lurks in the shadows so they can push a company friendly agenda.

No Brainer Vote for me. Bye Blake & Quinn!

[Alkasultzer]

...is a formatting nightmare...

Hahaha

A PDF file is a "formatting nightmare"

How do members pilot around on modern airliners then think a PDF file is a "formatting nightmare"

It's no wonder ACPA still runs like it did since its founding in 1998. Too bad we didn't still have those wages!

Concession after concession under the Old Guard

[aeronauticaldisaster]

If the membership doesn't wake up and boot these sort of guys - the pilots deserve the contract they will get behind these sort of company friendly leaders

[Fanblade]

Whereas the response letter effectively counters many of the accusations (which you interpret as person attacks?) and reads like it was written by experienced adults with a grasp on the realities we find ourselves in.

You mean the response written in third person? It doesn't look like they even wrote it. Nor does it address the core issue of the conflict of interest accusation that ultimately triggered the recall.

They have refused to engage with the membership on what happened last month. Even now it appears they couldn't be bothered to rewrite what someone else wrote for them into first person.

They have both been asked repeatedly to explain their side of the conflict of interest accusation they made last month.They have refused. Even now when the membership decides their fate. They refuse.

[Lance rose]

Have you ever been to a good jam before. Both musicians paying their instruments together in operation.

Vote these guys out, mo jamming no operation with management. Big mistake in my opinion,

[WhatThe?]

It is status quo, which doesn't work.

Or we all start rowing together with the PFC group and start acting like a real union.

Nothing personal

[ReturnoftheMike]

Peons,

I was going to say "pathetic peons" but I'll hold off on the insults. You all did vote in my recommendations of paycuts for cargo, ignore the contract in terms of vacation buybacks with furloughs and my personal fav of destroying seniority for reserve. So thank you for the support

Speaking of support, I want to formally endorse the YVR Chairs for their hardwork for the membership and helping me push forward my agenda. Without their support, this would not have been possible.

I cannot believe anyone would support a recall of these experienced individuals. We cannot afford to lose their experience and I hope Blake stays on as chair well into his 60s. Perhaps he can go to 67 if ICAO changes their rules. We would be ever so lucky to have the longest ruling chair in the history of unions. His cottage appreciates it!

Let's keep ACPA great!

[Fanblade]

Peons,

I was going to say "pathetic peons" but I'll hold off on the insults.

[WhatThe?]

Management just entered the Union conversation.

[sportingrifle]

So if, and I am just speculating, the recall vote fails, especially if it fails by more than 50%, what are the LEC councillors going to do? By rights they should all resign on mass. They started this whole deal because they couldn't work with the chair and vice chair. If the tribe speaks and keeps the chair and vice chair, they have to resign. But I bet they won't.

[hithere]

When will the results of this recall vote be known?

[Fanblade]

So if, and I am just speculating, the recall vote fails, especially if it fails by more than 50%, what are the LEC councillors going to do? By rights they should all resign on mass. They started this whole deal because they couldn't work with the chair and vice chair. If the tribe speaks and keeps the chair and vice chair, they have to resign. But I bet they won't.

And if more than 50% vote to recall but the super majority required is not achieved. What then? This IMO is the most likely outcome.

The LEC Chair and Vice remain without a mandate any longer. I also doubt they will resign.

We have a bit of a mess of a constitution don’t we.

How about everyone resign and seek a new mandate?