Crew Stranded in Punta Cana -- Had a Similar Experience?

[Raymond Hall]

‘We are not safe here’: Canadian airline crew pleads for help from Ottawa two months after drug seizure in Dominican Republic


A Pivot Airlines crew has been stranded in Punta Cana for two months, potentially facing serious criminal charges after five bags of cocaine were discovered in the E&E bay, after they arrived to work the aircraft back to Toronto. The airplane was on the ground for four days, and the crew arrived only the day before, but were nevertheless arrested, held in deplorable jails for five days and have been refused permission to leave.

Would anyone know any of the crew members?

Has anyone had a similar circumstance in these countries where the Rule of Law is only term in the dictionary?

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/ ... om-ottawa/

[Cavalier44]

Respectfully, what does this have to do with Air Canada? Shouldn't this fall under "General Airline Industry Comments"?

[bob99]

Has anyone had a similar circumstance in these countries where the Rule of Law is only term in the dictionary?

I don't think many people have flown to a foreign country with a plane full of drugs.

Why is this in the AC forum?

[Raymond Hall]

It is here to alert anyone at Air Canada operating into or out of Punta Cana that the same thing could happen to them. Show up at the airport one hour before your scheduled flight and wind up in a hell-hole jail charged with drug trafficking, or worse, not charged but stuck in a jail and not allowed to leave the country for months or years.

I am asking if anyone knows of anyone at Air Canada has had any kind of similar experience or if anyone knows of another pilot who has been subjected to the same fate in this or other "third world" countries. Go to work one day, and wind up in jail the next, through no fault of your own.

[Sharklasers]

There’s almost certainly more to the story than the few lines of msm you have posted. Even just googling one of the flight crew members names brings up some pretty unsavory history. While I don’t know for certain the fact the Canadian government isn’t kicking and screaming and seems to be demurring to the Dominican authorities is telling.

[Dias]

It is here to alert anyone at Air Canada operating into or out of Punta Cana that the same thing could happen to them. Show up at the airport one hour before your scheduled flight and wind up in a hell-hole jail charged with drug trafficking, or worse, not charged but stuck in a jail and not allowed to leave the country for months or years.

I am asking if anyone knows of anyone at Air Canada has had any kind of similar experience or if anyone knows of another pilot who has been subjected to the same fate in this or other "third world" countries. Go to work one day, and wind up in jail the next, through no fault of your own.

I know of one Canadian pilot (not Air Canada) that ended up in foreign jail. It was for drugs also.

[Inverted2]

Nothing to do with Air Canada. If you showed up to your Air Canada plane and a rampie stuffed drugs in it you have nothing to worry about. It’s happened in Jamaica if I recall. This company was flying all over the Caribbean for months for whatever reason and they were likely running dope till they got caught. I’m sure there is more to the story than we are being told. There must be some evidence the crew knew about it or the government would be doing more.

[alkaseltzer]

‘We are not safe here’: Canadian airline crew pleads for help from Ottawa two months after drug seizure in Dominican Republic


A Pivot Airlines crew has been stranded in Punta Cana for two months, potentially facing serious criminal charges after five bags of cocaine were discovered in the E&E bay, after they arrived to work the aircraft back to Toronto. The airplane was on the ground for four days, and the crew arrived only the day before, but were nevertheless arrested, held in deplorable jails for five days and have been refused permission to leave.

Would anyone know any of the crew members?

Has anyone had a similar circumstance in these countries where the Rule of Law is only term in the dictionary?

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/ ... om-ottawa/

Those crew members were in on it. Got caught. Period.

[Chaxterium]

Those crew members were in on it. Got caught. Period.

It is well known—and undisputed—that it was the crew who reported the contraband. Specifically one of the maintenance engineers. It seems somewhat counter-intuitive for a crew that's trying to smuggle drugs to inform the authorities about the drugs they're trying to smuggle.

Further to that I've personally known the captain of the flight for years. I find it incredibly hard to believe that he would have been in on it. I understand that that's not evidence but if the drug enforcement agency in the Dominican had any real evidence that tied them to the smuggling I highly doubt they'd be out of prison.

But I'm not a lawyer.

[Fanblade]

Those crew members were in on it. Got caught. Period.

It is well known—and undisputed—that it was the crew who reported the contraband. Specifically one of the maintenance engineers. It seems somewhat counter-intuitive for a crew that's trying to smuggle drugs to inform the authorities about the drugs they're trying to smuggle.

Further to that I've personally known the captain of the flight for years. I find it incredibly hard to believe that he would have been in on it. I understand that that's not evidence but if the drug enforcement agency in the Dominican had any real evidence that tied them to the smuggling I highly doubt they'd be out of prison.

But I'm not a lawyer.

Let’s put it this way. Someone might have been in on it. However it is highly unlikely everyone was. You don’t smuggle by telling everyone what you are doing.

Almost a certainty that some of them had no clue.

[Raymond Hall]

It's almost a certainty that none of the crew had any clue. They arrived the day before, had a short layover, and arrived at the airport an hour or so before the outbound flight. The aircraft had been on the ground there for over four days. The crew obviously didn't lug 200 KG of cocaine from their hotel in the taxi on the way to the airplane.

The issue isn't just about crews. It is about the justice system in these destinations that permits incarceration and indefinite detainment of any crew, from any country, on the basis of mere suspicion. Take the example of the flight attendants. Do you really believe that they knew anything about the location of the E&E bay? They went to work for a short layover expecting to be home the next night and wound up in jail indefinitely in a remote country, on potentially life-sentence charges.

The crew is still sequestered in the Dominican Republic. Passports confiscated and they are not allowed to leave the country, pending completion of the investigation, which could likely take up to one year. Worse, there are active threats against their lives, as suspected drug traffickers. This is a serious concern to all airline crews operating not only into the Caribbean, but to anywhere where adherence to the Rule of Law is not part of the country's judicial system.

Air Canada pilots beware. It could happen to you.

[Raymond Hall]

If there is a lesson to be learned here, practically speaking, from a lawyer with some experience in these matters, report it on arrival in YYZ, not prior departure.

Do not allow yourself to be subjected to the vagaries of a "third world" judicial system, and do not assume the the judicial system from where your are operating in any way protects you in the same manner as that of your home nation.

[WellThatAgedWell]

It's almost a certainty that none of the crew had any clue. They arrived the day before, had a short layover, and arrived at the airport an hour or so before the outbound flight. The aircraft had been on the ground there for over four days. The crew obviously didn't lug 200 KG of cocaine from their hotel in the taxi on the way to the airplane.

The issue isn't just about crews. It is about the justice system in these destinations that permits incarceration and indefinite detainment of any crew, from any country, on the basis of mere suspicion. Take the example of the flight attendants. Do you really believe that they knew anything about the location of the E&E bay? They went to work for a short layover expecting to be home the next night and wound up in jail indefinitely in a remote country, on potentially life-sentence charges.

The crew is still sequestered in the Dominican Republic. Passports confiscated and they are not allowed to leave the country, pending completion of the investigation, which could likely take up to one year. Worse, there are active threats against their lives, as suspected drug traffickers. This is a serious concern to all airline crews operating not only into the Caribbean, but to anywhere where adherence to the Rule of Law is not part of the country's judicial system.

Air Canada pilots beware. It could happen to you.

Everything you mention is not evidence that It's almost a certainty that none of the crew had any clue.

The crew reported the drugs that were found to the authorities after the drugs were found by the engineer. It’s possible they reported it because the engineer would have, and they wanted to come across as innocent and play that card. It’s possible only some of the crew members knew about it or maybe none. Regardless, just because you report a crime doesn’t mean are you instantly innocent, it does make you instantly a suspect. How many missing kids were reported by a family member, then it turns out it was that family member who abducted the child who reported the missing case? Whoever finds the drugs is instantly a suspect.

The hotel, the layover, how long the plane was on the ground, blah blah blah. What does this have to do with anything at all with the possibility that a crew member was involved. The crew members didn’t have to be the one moving and loading the drugs to be in on the operation.

Let’s say this crew knew nothing of it. So who did know? Where was the plane going and who was on the receiving end. It seems a little odd that you think people who are not connected to the airline have enough access to the aircraft to run an operation without anyone at the airline being aware. Do you think it’s possible someone fills your car with drugs, knows where you drive to regularly, and has someone empty the drugs on the other end, and you are completely unaware? Most crime that happens around airlines is connected to at least one employee on each end of the transaction. Cabin groomers stuffing drugs in the trash cans, ramp guys moving weapons/drugs etc through the cargo holds.

There’s a reason airport employees are heavily scrutinized at airports. The amount of organized crime going on is crazy. The Police have a unit that taps into cellphone calls of airport employees and monitor organized crime groups. I recall more than once groups of Air Canada ramp crews getting busted. And because our restricted access opens the opportunity for easily committing crime, we will forever have to be screened and monitored when working in restricted areas. So my guess would be it’s almost a certainty that someone who works for pivot was aware of what was going on. Whether it was the crew members operating, or someone back at home base, or both.

I think you need to watch American Gangster and see how this all works

[digits_]

Let’s say this crew knew nothing of it. So who did know? Where was the plane going and who was on the receiving end. It seems a little odd that you think people who are not connected to the airline have enough access to the aircraft to run an operation without anyone at the airline being aware. Do you think it’s possible someone fills your car with drugs, knows where you drive to regularly, and has someone empty the drugs on the other end, and you are completely unaware? Most crime that happens around airlines is connected to at least one employee on each end of the transaction. Cabin groomers stuffing drugs in the trash cans, ramp guys moving weapons/drugs etc through the cargo holds.

Still an extremely bad situation for the crew members that are not involved.

If 100 other people would use my car and another 50 mechanics would work on it every week, I'd say it would be very feasible that some idiot would have filled it up with drugs and that I am innocent.

[Raymond Hall]

... it’s almost a certainty that someone who works for pivot was aware of what was going on. Whether it was the crew members operating, or someone back at home base, or both. I think you need to watch American Gangster and see how this all works.

Almost all of these operations involve contracts with local companies to provide the service and security while the aircraft sits on the ground, this time for four days between flights. In other words, no-one from Pivot. No-one has been able to provide a shred of evidence connecting anyone at the airline with the placement of the drugs on the aircraft in the electronics bay that is accessible only from the ground.

Meanwhile, the crew that carried out their professional responsibilities by reporting the find to the authorities remain hostages to a third-world legal system that has no record of being in any hurry to get at the truth.

As the President of the airline reported in the media recently, the crews were thrown into jails with known drug traffickers. Crowded single cells with had no chairs, benches or toilets—only a hole in the concrete floor. And they were not allowed to change out of their uniforms until they were sprung on bail several days later. They were and still are under serious threats against their lives, and are not allowed to leave the country, after two months, with no prospect of the investigation even taking place, let alone being concluded. No charges laid. No prospect of coming home any time soon.

This is why I raised this topic here. We tend to think that we are immune from these nightmares. But almost any one of us is precariously close to winding up in the same situation, through no fault of our own.

[mmm..bacon]

Maybe someone should charter a Navajo from Miami in the middle of the night? I'm sure, if they ask around, they'll find some pilots experienced in that sort of thing!

[Sailtime]

I had heard this story a while ago but only became aware of the Captain's name this morning.

He used to work for me as Captain. I would not at all be surprised if he was involved after what I have seen.

This was back in the 90's. He was working out of our YTZ base as Captain. I had hired him with a CPL but an ATP was required for the position as per contract and provincial government requirements. We sent him off to do the required SIM training and upon returning he provided a "Temporary" ATP valid for 90 days which was common at the time. As the 90 day expiration approached I reminded him that we did not have his permanent license. A few days later he faxed a "new" 30 day temporary. As that date approached with no permanent document, I picked up the phone and called TC Personal Licensing and spoke with the inspector (a former employ BTW) and explained the situation and asked why was it taking so long to issue the document. I explained that he had written his ATP 4 months previous but still only has a temporary document. He advised me that he would look into it and call me back.

A short time later he called back and advised me that "RD" had never passed his ATP exams and had NEVER been issued an ATP. A moment later I was speaking with enforcement. He asked me if he was currently out flying and I advised no however he had a flight booked for first thing in the morning. I was told not to tell anyone and we agreed to meet at our YTZ office first thing in the morning. My wife and I drove to Toronto and were on the first ferry in the morning. (my wife attended to be the replacement Captain on the flight)

The TC Enforcement Inspector was on the second ferry that morning and came to my office. About 15 minutes later RD entered the office and said, "oh sorry, I didn't know you were here" and went to leave to give us privacy. The TC Inspector asked him to stop and asked him his name. He answered of course. He was then asked if he had a flight this morning and the answer was "yes". The Inspector then asked to see his license and was told that he forgot it at home. The Inspector then handed him a copy of the falsified license and asked him if this was "a reasonable facsimile of his license" he was using and how did he obtain it? RD hung his head, paused and then said; "I manufactured it".

The Inspector then advised that he was "Under arrest" (no, there were no cuffs involved) and did I have anything to say. I just advised RD that he was terminated and left the room.

Ultimately, he was charged with "Uttering a forged document". The RCMP attended our head office a couple of days later and seized all aircraft logbooks showing RD as the Captain as evidence. Of course, I immediately advised our MNR Safety officer of the situation and he was of course, astounded. He commented that RD had fooled both of us. (Copies of licenses were always sent to the MNR)

RD never had his "real" CPL revoked but "apparently" was sentenced to 30 days.

I will add that this was the final incident with RD. Previous issues, including running company credit cards to the max for "very" personal purchases, which necessitated us to revoke his card and to issue the CC to the FO's is but one example.

So let us just say, at least with us, there is a pretty good history of lies and deceit.

[Transition9er2]

Respectfully, what does this have to do with Air Canada? Shouldn't this fall under "General Airline Industry Comments"?

Raymond Hall is a pilot turned reporter from what I understand.

Posts his questions or headlines on the Air Canada thread because it has the highest number or readers.

When you question the relevance of his post or suggest it’s in the wrong section he’ll loosely claim it’s linked to AC.

Reporters gotta report I guess.

[Inverted2]

The F/O has a bit of a shady past as well.....

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... r-law.html

[Dias]

If his brother is in federal prison what's the chance he's being extorted by gang members to move product for them.