P4C

[Stu Pidasso]

SHTF and all is quiet?

[RRJetPilot]

Sounds like the company is in attack mode. This is a good time to unite.

[Fanblade]

What? You thought the company would just sit on their hands and watch their friendly union disappear?

[Blueontop]

SHTF and all is quiet?

What happened?

[FL030]

Can someone please lay out step by step how we get rid of ACPA and join ALPA International? Let's do this methodically. The process has to start and not stall. Step 1:

[altiplano]

Step 1:

Become a P4C.

It's not an organisation, it's a movement.

The company is targeting people they don't want to work against. They are in the process of terminating people that are representing your interests ahead of the company's. They want to get their friendly old committee reps and status quo compliant elected reps back in control.

Every pilot at AC has to wake up and see what is going on. This company doesn't respect you, they don't respect your contract, they don't respect your association. Time to find some unity.

[rudder]

Can someone please lay out step by step how we get rid of ACPA and join ALPA International? Let's do this methodically. The process has to start and not stall. Step 1:

I think I have posted something along these lines before.

OPTION 1

Merge ACPA in to ALPA. Would require consent from both parties. This was the plan several years ago before a falling out after an agreement in principle was reached and ratified by the ALPA Executive Board. Clearly, in order for this outcome to be revisited there would have to be support from a majority of the ACPA elected representatives.

OPTION 2

Apply for alternative representation during the ‘open period’. This is the 90 days preceding the expiry of the CBA. There is no consent or concurrence required from the ACPA leadership. Rank and file ACPA members sign ALPA cards. Once 50%+1 are collected ALPA files for representation (within the 90 day window). The CIRB rules on the application. The CIRB may require a board supervised representation vote (if signed ALPA cards are hovering around 50-60%) or may simply issue an order recognizing ALPA as the AC pilot bargaining agent (overwhelming support provided from ALPA card drive).

Good luck.

[schnitzel2k3]

Make it happens guys and good luck. Strike first, strike hard. No mercy

[RippleRock]

ACPA is CANCER.

It needs to be cut out. Not in piece, but in whole.

I'm very troubled by recent events. The Company is in 100% attack mode on our "disobedient" LEC "rouges" that are taking a stand for our contract, a stand for what's right.

STAND now with them, or lay down and take it. Demand change, or don't. Make your choice.

Your future will be written by you, or for you.

[schnitzel2k3]

ACPA is CANCER.

STAND now with them. Demand change. Make your choice.

Your future will be written by you.

There, I fixed it for you.

There is no OR.

[Stu Pidasso]

I am all for change and completely agree that ACPA is a joke. However ask yourself if you owned your own company and hired a new employee.

Said employee slammed your company from the first day of employment.

Ran around saying; I f@#king HATE this company, to anyone that he had an audience with.

Promise you he (or she) would have been long gone if it wasn't for Covid and the subsequent layoff.

This is not how you facilitate change and improvement, if you expect to be treated and remunerated as a Professional.

I said ages ago here, he wasn't doing the P4C movement any favors.

[ReturnoftheMike]

Moronic members,

As many of you wastes of cockpit space have noticed - me & the boyz are ready to take this union back from the grips of these change people. It's time to change back to status quo and go back to the good old days of the new relationship which brought industry leading 2% raises.

Our spokesman Kenny is doing the lord's work (aka the company's) and while you thought I may be out of the picture, let me personally assure you, the old boys network is stronger than ever. We followed ACPA's lead in acquiring the most technological advanced Dial-up modems money can buy. We even got ICQ & MSN messenger for instant messaging capability. Dan uses this app called "Facebook" which most of you simpleton surfs have probably never heard of but I will say it even shows more promise than any software I've tried to pawn off to the Corp.

While the base chairs continue their dynasties of displacements, they will never capitulate to the pressures from a mob of common membership surfs. Divine rule is for kings - and kings they are - Kings of the Cottage. Those 4 time yearly turns don't fly themselves

The Base Chairs work tirelessly from their homes and even agree to sit in economy to travel to 4 yearly meetings like scummy & deplorable Commuters

It is imperative to point out that the chairs were duly & democratically elected to milk the membership dry and the association desperately requires their experience and the results are the proof in the pudding: a top contract when compared to Buffalo Joe.

As we enter future negots, rest assured pilot peons that Dan, Rob, Blake & the rest of the old boyz armed with their experience and resume of ACPA victories will be actively involved in negotiations. We can't afford to risk having children for change and their pathetic principles getting in the way of the rich history of pilot compensation extraction.

[schnitzel2k3]

When the satire hits just the right note.

[WellThatAgedWell]

Do I have this right? Air Canada union is led by insider company management doing back door deals and making decisions to benefit the company?

This sounds just like government! This is exactly how socialisim works. You pay taxes (or in this case union dues) for people to act on your behalf and mak decisions. Then corrup politicians (in this case acpa reps) make back door deals and do things to benefit friends and family or themselves.

Socialisim is always garbage whether it be the government or unions. Since we know that, we should always work to have less government. You have to accept some corruption because it will always happen and we do need some government. But the more social systems you have the more layers of corruption you have to peel back constantly. Why do we need half of this shit our government spends taxes on? Same could be said about unions, why do we need hundreds of positions and committees? Why do you need contacts 500 pages long? Just to leave room for corruption.

Air Canada pilots should be asking why they are paying for a union that is actively trying to make their lives worse. Almost like you would be better with no union. Atleast you would have your union dues to spend on something else.

Just like we should ask why we pay for government that also does the same. Complete waste of money.

[737Maximilian]

Do I have this right? Air Canada union is led by insider company management doing back door deals and making decisions to benefit the company?

This sounds just like government! This is exactly how socialisim works. You pay taxes (or in this case union dues) for people to act on your behalf and mak decisions. Then corrup politicians (in this case acpa reps) make back door deals and do things to benefit friends and family or themselves.

Socialisim is always garbage whether it be the government or unions. Since we know that, we should always work to have less government. You have to accept some corruption because it will always happen and we do need some government. But the more social systems you have the more layers of corruption you have to peel back constantly. Why do we need half of this shit our government spends taxes on? Same could be said about unions, why do we need hundreds of positions and committees? Why do you need contacts 500 pages long? Just to leave room for corruption?

I think you're on the wrong forum buddy.

[PeterParker]

Do I have this right? Air Canada union is led by insider company management doing back door deals and making decisions to benefit the company?

This sounds just like government! This is exactly how socialisim works. You pay taxes (or in this case union dues) for people to act on your behalf and mak decisions. Then corrup politicians (in this case acpa reps) make back door deals and do things to benefit friends and family or themselves.

Socialisim is always garbage whether it be the government or unions. Since we know that, we should always work to have less government. You have to accept some corruption because it will always happen and we do need some government. But the more social systems you have the more layers of corruption you have to peel back constantly. Why do we need half of this shit our government spends taxes on? Same could be said about unions, why do we need hundreds of positions and committees? Why do you need contacts 500 pages long? Just to leave room for corruption.

Air Canada pilots should be asking why they are paying for a union that is actively trying to make their lives worse. Almost like you would be better with no union. Atleast you would have your union dues to spend on something else.

Just like we should ask why we pay for government that also does the same. Complete waste of money.

Sir, this is a Wendy's!

[sportingrifle]

So for those of us less skilled at mind reading, did somebody get fired? Or what?

[‘Bob’]

I don’t know but this is all entertaining and part of why I thank god every day that I don’t work for Air Canada.

[Winnikegger]

SportingRifle,

Why don't you ask your buddy- the YVR Base Chair

Probably try email and he can call you back. He has tough reception from his cabin and it's summer. He is enjoying his decade away from the flight line

[sportingrifle]

Because if it is an HR issue he (quite properly) wouldn’t tell me. If anything is indeed happening.

Irrespective, I will make a general observation based on having seen the union/company relationship ebb and flow many times during my time here. The company cuts bad actors considerable discretion when the union / management relationship is relatively calm. When the two are at war, that discretion is greatly reduced and summary executions periodically happen. For those pilots with a habit of doing dumb shit, for the next few months it could be prudent to be on good behaviour.