Hello aviators,

With all the hoopla on working conditions at all levels of piloting in Canada I’d like to ask those that enjoy flight instructing, if it paid enough or more would you rather be a flight instructor or fly 703,704,705?

Thanks in advance

There are plenty of people who decide to keep working at a flight school for most if not all of their career. It’s not for everyone, not by a long shot.

Part time Instructing is rewarding.

The thing is, most schools are run by the cheapest people on the planet with no business sense whatsoever. Freelance on the other hand can be very relaxed and rewarding as a part time gig. I’m talking about teaching someone you know for a PPL in their 152 or a couple night ratings here and there. I know a freelance instructor out in Alberta that’s easily doing 70k a year. It can be profitable if your reputation is good.

780Pilot wrote: ↑Sat Sep 03, 2022 3:30 pm The thing is, most schools are run by the cheapest people on the planet with no business sense whatsoever.

They're not cheap, they just choose not to give their money to you.

Lots of career instructors end up at TC. It's sort of a logical step where you still get to be involved in the teaching process, but with a stable schedule, good pay, and benefits.

photofly wrote: ↑Sat Sep 03, 2022 4:25 pm

780Pilot wrote: ↑Sat Sep 03, 2022 3:30 pm The thing is, most schools are run by the cheapest people on the planet with no business sense whatsoever.

They're not cheap, they just choose not to give their money to you.

It goes well beyond instructor wages.

780Pilot wrote: ↑Sun Sep 04, 2022 9:01 am It goes well beyond instructor wages.

Given that you continue to turn up for whatever it is they pay you, paying you that amount is good business sense, not bad.

I'd love to teach on the side, but it pays no where close to 705 pay, 1 WDO is a week+ of instructing. Just not worth my time sadly

photofly wrote: ↑Sun Sep 04, 2022 9:29 am

780Pilot wrote: ↑Sun Sep 04, 2022 9:01 am It goes well beyond instructor wages.

Given that you continue to turn up for whatever it is they pay you, paying you that amount is good business sense, not bad.

Not necessarily. It might be enough to keep class 4s showing up for a few months, but not enough to keep others interested. Turn over has a (significant?) cost, which is rarely reflected in pay raises.

If the cost of turnover is not reflected in pay rises like you think it should be, perhaps it’s just not as expensive as you think it is.

780Pilot wrote: ↑Sat Sep 03, 2022 3:30 pm Freelance on the other hand can be very relaxed and rewarding as a part time gig.

Sometimes I think about getting my instructor rating back, then I realize that I don’t want to teach strangers and I don’t want to charge friends.

photofly wrote: ↑Mon Sep 05, 2022 11:06 am If the cost of turnover is not reflected in pay rises like you think it should be, perhaps it’s just not as expensive as you think it is.

Could be. I am merely refuting your argument that "if you don't leave your employer it's proof he has good business sense".

I don't think that's guaranteed.

lownslow wrote: ↑Mon Sep 05, 2022 11:38 am

780Pilot wrote: ↑Sat Sep 03, 2022 3:30 pm Freelance on the other hand can be very relaxed and rewarding as a part time gig.

Sometimes I think about getting my instructor rating back, then I realize that I don’t want to teach strangers and I don’t want to charge friends.

So instructing sucks ! Nobody wants to do it but has to so their lob book gets filled, sad that not only the pilot wages suck in this country but also instructing.

Terrible profession that we love !

digits_ wrote: ↑Mon Sep 05, 2022 11:40 am

photofly wrote: ↑Mon Sep 05, 2022 11:06 am If the cost of turnover is not reflected in pay rises like you think it should be, perhaps it’s just not as expensive as you think it is.

Could be. I am merely refuting your argument that "if you don't leave your employer it's proof he has good business sense".

I don't think that's guaranteed.

That isn’t my argument.

My argument is that just because he doesn’t pay you what you think you’re worth, that he must have bad business sense.

More likely it’s evidence of the opposite.

ellinas wrote: ↑Mon Sep 05, 2022 12:00 pm So instructing sucks ! Nobody wants to do it but has to so their lob book gets filled, sad that not only the pilot wages suck in this country but also instructing.

Terrible profession that we love !

Not at all, I went into instructing on purpose and at the school I was with I typically found it very rewarding.

It actually continues to be rewarding in some cases, there was one student handed to me on the brink of failing out and I got him successfully through his CPL. Coincidentally I happen to run into him every few years (and in unexpected places) as he’s on his way to the next step in his career. It’s neat to see.

I just have other things I’d rather do with my time and other resources these days.

lownslow wrote: ↑Mon Sep 05, 2022 11:38 am

780Pilot wrote: ↑Sat Sep 03, 2022 3:30 pm Freelance on the other hand can be very relaxed and rewarding as a part time gig.

Sometimes I think about getting my instructor rating back, then I realize that I don’t want to teach strangers and I don’t want to charge friends.

Same, plus I think it's a huge PITA to get it back.

co-joe wrote: ↑Tue Sep 06, 2022 9:32 pm

lownslow wrote: ↑Mon Sep 05, 2022 11:38 am

780Pilot wrote: ↑Sat Sep 03, 2022 3:30 pm Freelance on the other hand can be very relaxed and rewarding as a part time gig.

Sometimes I think about getting my instructor rating back, then I realize that I don’t want to teach strangers and I don’t want to charge friends.

Same, plus I think it's a huge PITA to get it back.

So basically when it comes to flying as a “professional pilot flight instructor “. Sucks s?!t

co-joe wrote: ↑Tue Sep 06, 2022 9:32 pm

lownslow wrote: ↑Mon Sep 05, 2022 11:38 am

780Pilot wrote: ↑Sat Sep 03, 2022 3:30 pm Freelance on the other hand can be very relaxed and rewarding as a part time gig.

Sometimes I think about getting my instructor rating back, then I realize that I don’t want to teach strangers and I don’t want to charge friends.

Same, plus I think it's a huge PITA to get it back.

Written test, sign off and a check ride. It’s not that big a deal.

photofly wrote: ↑Wed Sep 07, 2022 2:10 pm Written test, sign off and a check ride. It’s not that big a deal.

Does the written test or ride require a recommend? What’s a Class I’s time worth these days? How about renting a light single from a school for a few hours to do the ride plus whatever frivolous ‘checkout’ they want?

The local school wants ten hours(!) dual for a commercial student to switch from a Cherokee to a Katana, how many hours to sign off a stranger as good to go?

What minimum skill demonstration would you say is reasonable, on returning to instructing after a many years-long break?

Would it be ok for your first instructional flight in 15 years to be with a real student? Does the student not deserve some basic demonstration of recency before being taught?

Does the written test or ride require a recommend? What’s a Class I’s time worth these days? How about renting a light single from a school for a few hours to do the ride plus whatever frivolous ‘checkout’ they want?

OK, let's look at these in order:

Does the written test or ride require a recommend?: Assuming you're more than 24 months out of recency, then both the written test and ride require a recommend.

What’s a Class I’s time worth these days? You'd have to ask around. If you want flight instructors to be well paid, then you had better be prepared to pay well when you need one. You can't be cheap at both ends.

How about renting a light single from a school for a few hours to do the ride plus whatever frivolous ‘checkout’ they want?
How about it? The cost isn't the government's problem. There's no rule that says you *have* to rent a plane (perhaps you own one), or that you *have* to checkout. After all, if after 15 years away from a 172 you're ready to step back into the right seat to teach a noob, then I'm pretty sure the checkout will be quite short.

Better yet, if we're playing "how about", then how about you run your own flight school and provide a plane for others to check out in for free?

photofly wrote: ↑Wed Sep 07, 2022 5:58 pm

What’s a Class I’s time worth these days?

One MILLION Dollars.

Wait, I forgot about inflation. One BILLION Dollars!