705 PIC vs 737 type

[Bluewaffe]

Which one catches ACs eye more?

I have the opportunity to stay at my 705 op to upgrade soon or hop over to a ULCC to be an FO on the 37. Looking for opinions.

[Loon-A-Tic]

PIC is King, that said I'm assuming the PIC time is on a jet. There's no telling what aircraft type you might be assigned to at AC so a specific type rating doesn't factor into their hiring process.

[Bede]

Easy. PIC

[Arnie Pye]

PIC is everything in this industry.

[rudder]

Points scale -

1. PIC large jet (over 100,000 lbs)
2. PIC medium jet (50-100,000 lbs)
3. PIC large turboprop (Part 705)
4. PIC medium turboprop (Part 705)
5. PIC Corporate Jet
6. PIC 704/703
7. PIC Corporate turboprop

Notice the common requirement - PIC.

AC is looking for rapidly upgradeable pilots. They are not looking for career FO’s. Quality PIC time typically makes a big difference in upgradability success rate. Learning the plane, procedures, airports is the same from either seat. But judgement and decision making are a byproduct of relevant experience.

[kiaszceski]

Points scale -

1. PIC large jet (over 100,000 lbs)
2. PIC medium jet (50-100,000 lbs)
3. PIC large turboprop (Part 705)
4. PIC medium turboprop (Part 705)
5. PIC Corporate Jet
6. PIC 704/703
7. PIC Corporate turboprop

Notice the common requirement - PIC.

AC is looking for rapidly upgradeable pilots. They are not looking for career FO’s. Quality PIC time typically makes a big difference in the upgradability success rate. Learning the plane, procedures, airports is the same from either seat. But judgement and decision making are a byproduct of relevant experience.

I'm seeing Turboprop FOs with no 705/704/703 PIC time getting hired, on the other hand, people with 705 PIC prop time do not even have an interview.
A degree and/or military experience are also significant assets.

[bcflyer]

From what vantage point are you seeing that? Are you on the interview board?

[Bluewaffe]

Thanks for the info guys

[737Maximilian]

Contrary to what many here have suggested, when looking at the new hire bios, a significant proportion seem to be coming from either a:

1) 705 turbo-prop training captain/CP position; or,
2) 737/767 FO position

In the 737/767 FO category, several of them were only flying in that position for 6-8 months prior to being hired by AC, with only turbo-prop FO backgrounds beforehand.

While it's impossible to say which position will get you to AC quicker, I would hesitate to suggest that the "PIC is king" mantra is necessarily valid in the current hiring environment. The most recent bid showed a large number of widebody FO positions vacant, so I'd imagine AC would look quite favourably on even 500 hrs of 737 time.

What I would suggest is to weigh the pros/cons of each position. Which flying would you prefer? Which pays better? Which has a better quality of life? And which could you see yourself staying at in the long-term if AC doesn't work out?

[Eric Janson]

Just want to add another consideration:-

Marketability.

If you get laid off - PIC time will make it easier to find alternative flying imho.

We all saw what happened in 2020 - there are no guarantees. Makes no difference who you work for Imho.

[negroni]

That is always something to consider, yes. But also don't discount getting into the job you want sooner than later, seniority and all. If you spend an extra year or two "getting PIC" and delaying your move to the larger airlines, that's 1-2 years less at top pay towards pension, earnings etc. And that said, most smaller carriers won't take laid off airline pilots or if they do it's all through connections vs. cold calling. When I was laid off for covid, it was IMPOSSIBLE to get a job offer and I have a hell of a lot of 703 and 705 PIC. The smaller carriers just didn't' want to take furloughed pilots, knowing they would leave as soon as things rebounded.

[AstroPants]

When I was laid off for covid, it was IMPOSSIBLE to get a job offer

I know a good youtube video for you to check out next time this happens.

[negroni]

When I was laid off for covid, it was IMPOSSIBLE to get a job offer

I know a good youtube video for you to check out next time this happens.

Thanks for looking out bro.

[Joe Blow Schmo]

What aircraft type is your current job upgrade going to be on? Getting 737 PIC time will make you extremely marketable globally. If you go to the ULCC, you can still jump to AC if you want and if not you can upgrade in a couple years and open up lots of other options.

[ogopogo]

Newbie question on the definition of PIC: how does one accumulate PIC time flying as an FO? If one assumes the CA and FO fly alternate legs, is the PF the one getting PIC regardless of seat position?

[Bede]

Newbie question on the definition of PIC: how does one accumulate PIC time flying as an FO? If one assumes the CA and FO fly alternate legs, is the PF the one getting PIC regardless of seat position?

You can’t. You must be the pilot in command.

[skyhighh]

Newbie question on the definition of PIC: how does one accumulate PIC time flying as an FO? If one assumes the CA and FO fly alternate legs, is the PF the one getting PIC regardless of seat position?

You can’t. You must be the pilot in command.

Well technically he/she can. It’s called PICUS. Valid for the ATPL but not valued by airlines hiring wise.

[co-joe]

Which one catches ACs eye more?

I have the opportunity to stay at my 705 op to upgrade soon or hop over to a ULCC to be an FO on the 37. Looking for opinions.

Which one has better long term lifestyle and pay for you? Do you want to be a PIC on a large turboprop, or a small Boeing for your life? Don't worry about Air Canada, they'll call when they call (neither are better on the resume), the question is, where do you want to hang your hat when either AC never calls, or they don't call you back after the interview?

[Jetlifer]

Which one catches ACs eye more?

I have the opportunity to stay at my 705 op to upgrade soon or hop over to a ULCC to be an FO on the 37. Looking for opinions.

Which one has better long term lifestyle and pay for you? Do you want to be a PIC on a large turboprop, or a small Boeing for your life? Don't worry about Air Canada, they'll call when they call (neither are better on the resume), the question is, where do you want to hang your hat when either AC never calls, or they don't call you back after the interview?

This is the best advice and most true statement I’ve seen on here.. I’ve thought long and hard on this, and the truth is there seems to be literally no method in the madness as to what gets you in the door to AC. I’m a 705 training captain and have had my application in with AC for nearly a year.. I see people all around me getting interviews. Some with less experience and some with different experience. To be honest, I don’t even know if the recruiters have a process.. they just likely look at the next bid of what they need and try to find the closest to that.. moving down the qualifications list, while still trying to grab some from Jazz.

If anyone actually knows more, I haven’t seen a soul on here share it, if you do we’re all ears! Otherwise, the advice from above is all you have to go on.

Myself, I’ve got an offer to go to Jazz.. I’m probably just going to do that. Why? Because Jazz is a great company, and I’d rather fly for them than who I fly for now. It’s still going to give me the Air Canada in time.

[Transition9er2]

Which one catches ACs eye more?

I have the opportunity to stay at my 705 op to upgrade soon or hop over to a ULCC to be an FO on the 37. Looking for opinions.

Which one has better long term lifestyle and pay for you? Do you want to be a PIC on a large turboprop, or a small Boeing for your life? Don't worry about Air Canada, they'll call when they call (neither are better on the resume), the question is, where do you want to hang your hat when either AC never calls, or they don't call you back after the interview?

This is the best advice and most true statement I’ve seen on here.. I’ve thought long and hard on this, and the truth is there seems to be literally no method in the madness as to what gets you in the door to AC. I’m a 705 training captain and have had my application in with AC for nearly a year.. I see people all around me getting interviews. Some with less experience and some with different experience. To be honest, I don’t even know if the recruiters have a process.. they just likely look at the next bid of what they need and try to find the closest to that.. moving down the qualifications list, while still trying to grab some from Jazz.

If anyone actually knows more, I haven’t seen a soul on here share it, if you do we’re all ears! Otherwise, the advice from above is all you have to go on.

Myself, I’ve got an offer to go to Jazz.. I’m probably just going to do that. Why? Because Jazz is a great company, and I’d rather fly for them than who I fly for now. It’s still going to give me the Air Canada in time.

When was the last time you updated your application with AC? If you ultimately want to be at AC and you meet the min requirements right now, don't waste your time at Jazz. Sure Jazz is a good company, but getting a seniority number at AC today is more important long term.

If I were you I’d start by updating my resume and application then start reaching out to HR and following up with them. Given the hiring that’s going on you shouldn’t be overlooked this long unless there’s a glaring reason as to why. I’ve been hearing some timelines between interview and GS being 4-6 weeks.

Don’t walk away from Jazz just yet, but see if you can get some communication from HR at AC, then decide.

Just my 2 cents